Spirituality/religious Struggles

[Deleted member 1860]

I wasn't sure if this belonged here or not, so if its in the wrong place, feel free to move it mods.

I guess I should start off by saying that this isn't a struggle with my beliefs, rather a struggle with the church itself.

I *believe* I've posted before about how I've had struggles with my mom invading my "safe" space at church, and I know my current issue ties in with that. Long/short, my mom has been a lifelong atheist who bashed the church every chance she got and used that as a weapon against my dad who put his spirituality aside for decades in order to try and make my mom happy. A few years ago my dad and I started going to church again as I felt it was the right thing at the time for my healing. (I was abused by a religious figure.) Well Good Friday my mom shows up at church and I have a bad episode as worlds were colliding. My safe space was suddenly unsafe. This was the start of a six month no contact period with my mother. I have since reconnected with her (against my better judgment).

So my dad has become quite involved with the church and is on committees and such. He is dealing with such bureaucratic BS that it is really affecting him. Last night he was really upset (and I can't remember seeing him upset like that in the past). I asked him if he thought this was the right "path" for him as it is distracting from the true meaning of things. He said no, and that this level of involvement was not for him. To clarify, I wasn't trying to tell him to change his beliefs or leave the church, rather I know the core of his beliefs and think that what he's doing right now isn't in accordance with those beliefs. (ie a core part is doing good for others) Sorry, trying to not make this too complicated!

I was also helping out with a church activity this week. I was there last night and it was stressful for me as I saw my mother there. (She normally goes to a different service than I do as to avoid conflict.) There was also another incident that made me sit there and shake my head and think "REALLY!?!" One of those things that makes you realize that churches have bad people, too. (A big DUH considering my abuse, right?) I was going to go back today and help but its Friday and Fridays are my designated "home/stress free" days as I need to be on top of my game on Saturdays because I have class. (I violated this rule a few weeks ago and my Saturday was so stressful that I missed class.) The "event" is tomorrow and I was going to go for the early part of it before class, but now I'm thinking that I need to skip it altogether as it is stressing me out.

Ok, so maybe this was too much information, but at the same time I think I needed to get it out. Now to the real question.... I am unsure what to do now in terms of my involvement with the church. There is NO issue with my core beliefs themselves as my spirituality has been a great source of healing and I turn toward it when I am stressed. I guess my issue is that it feels like my involvement with the church has crossed over from being a source of comfort to a source of stress. But, I still long for that sense of comfort that I once had. I'm not even sure if I can get back that sense of comfort now that my mother goes to the same church.

In a way it feels like if I give up on church that I am giving up on God, but I know that God does not see it this way and that this is not the truth. But, I can't help but feel this way. I think a huge part of the struggle is that my spirituality has been a HUGE part of my recovery and I won't do anything to jeopardize that. I am struggling to separate my spirituality from religion and the church itself. Another part of the struggle is being able to trust my instinct and know that I am doing the right thing. (I've always struggled with this in the past, that is knowing I am doing something because it is what *I* want and not what is expected of me.)

I *think* I know what I need to, want to do, but will think about it a little while longer. I guess my question to other members is have you had such struggles with finding your spirituality after struggles with the church and religion itself? I don't want to turn this into a religious debate thread, rather I'm interested in how others have maintained a strong spiritual connection even though they perhaps aren't connected with the church for one reason or another. Somehow I don't think I'm saying all of this right... Or perhaps others have found a way to limit their involvement with the church as to keep it a "safe" place? It no longer feels "safe" and I feel like I am getting distracted from doing good work and giving back like I want to be able to do.

I guess I'm just looking for some feedback, and others experiences with anything similar as well. Sorry this is so long, and sorry its sort of all over the place. I'm a bit upset and my thoughts aren't exactly flowing in a coherent manner.

 

[Chosen]

I can relate. I was raised in a Christian cult from ages 9-21, which is where most of the trauma happened for me. I left 5 years ago (as of today, yay freedom!) My faith was separate from the cult, but it was so hard to go to churches with pastors who triggered me. I went to a fundamental Baptist church for 5 months before I felt like I was being controlled again...then I went to a Catholic church for 5 months, which was very healing because I was able to worship God and not be condemned or controlled at all. I moved to a different town, and I visited many different churches. None seemed to click, so I then went to a Unitarian Universalist church, which isn't Christian at all, but the freedom I felt there was helpful, but still things were missing. Finally, my counselor told me about the non-denomination church I've been attending for the last 2.5 years. I'm completely happy here, and as soon as I walked in, I felt safe and at home. That's not to say there aren't conflicts and hurts, but my pastors intentionally create an environment where anyone can approach them and challenge them if there's something wrong. It's the healthiest environment I've ever found.

So now, I'm part of a faith family again where I feel very safe, but even within that, I have strong boundaries and differences from my church. For example, I am not religious because I believe I'm in a relationship with Jesus, and I don't ascribe to certain rules. I believe in respecting my pastors and their authority, but I retain (and they strongly recommend it too) complete independence on what I decide is best for my walk with God. They advise and support me, but they want me to turn to God more than to them. I also have some unconventional beliefs (compared to the culture of this specific church), and I keep those separate.

In all this, I have to be careful to not get too involved in my church. It cannot be my whole life. And during the times I went to different churches who didn't match my theological beliefs, I gleaned what I could from the fellowship and strengths each congregation had. And during the times I didn't go to church at all, I did my own personal devotions and worship time, along with sometimes going to university ministries. Alongside lots of walks in nature, because I always feel close to God there.

In my opinion: a church gathering is primarily for encouragement, fellowship, worship, and service. And I think you should do whatever you need to do to protect those three things: being in a group of people who build you up and don't tear you down, enjoying good times and community in a safe way (which may not be safe anymore due to the presence of your mother), worshiping God, and then giving back in some way, as much as you are able to according to the level of healing you've attained.

So while this is very scattered, ultimately: you can develop spirituality apart from a church, and I think that finding a safe church is a wonderful blessing, but if it becomes unsafe, then I'd say maybe take a break or find a different church.

 

[risingsun]

In a way it feels like if I give up on church that I am giving up on God, but I know that God does not see it this way and that this is not the truth.

I was raised with 2 religions but my mum and I have always been involved with the church. However, we realized that many people we would encounter there are either "playing the role," judgmental, or going just to say "I went." I think this goes for other religious institutions with rules, regulations, committees, etc. We walked away from our last church as we felt like outcasts. People showed up but didn't show fellowship.

Now, we practice our beliefs in everything we do. We pray, we help others, we give to the needy, we "walk the walk" and infuse it in our everyday lives.

A church is a building with a set time. I believe that we can set a time each and everyday to give praise and thanks and love each other. We can put our religious/spiritual beliefs into practice each and everyday without going into an institution.

To walk in faith, to show love, and to be mindful of this each and everyday is God working through you. God never said, show up to an institution and praise me there. Some people leave their respective churches or religious institutions with this intention to praise God everyday, but then forget.

As long as you walk away with your core beliefs that have resonated with you and you show this in your everyday life, then you are practicing your spirituality in every moment.

However, there is something very peaceful showing up to an empty church and praying when no one else is there. Just us and God.

Still, if it is just a matter of this "particular church" for you, you can always find another where there is fellowship and a welcoming love.

You'll find what is right for you. Trust your instincts. But God is there for you no matter where you are; physically and emotionally.

Rising Sun.

 

[Em C.]

I'm not sure if me posting is a good thing or a bad thing based on my lack of religious beliefs, but I do know a lot about safe spaces (and I actually find being in churches to be very calming). My safe space was my cousin's house and then my brother moved in and I felt like it no longer was my safe space. So what about a sort of imagery meditation where you engage your senses in picturing being there?

You say you think you know what you need to do and you should trust your judgement and know that all of us regardless of religion etc have got your back :)

 

[scout86]

I may be misunderstanding the question, but here goes.

I've wandered a lot when it comes to spiritual things. About 10 years ago, I "wandered" back to Christianity, but a different (much different) version than the one whose services I'd been dragged to as a kid. I got lucky (depending on your definition or "luck", you could as easily call it divine intervention) and found a great church. Moved, worrying about finding another church home, got lucky again. After a couple of years there, things happened. Leadership changed. Many people left that church, including me, eventually. Never quite found another church in that area that "worked". Neither did any of the others who left, as far as I know, although some still get together for Bible study. Then I moved again. Found a church near where I live that looked promising and went for awhile. The theology was a little different, but the people were nice and really involved in helping others. I liked that & decided it could work. Then they hired a new preacher. First sermon out of the chute he expounded on the evils of his misunderstanding of "evolution" and said that you can't be a Christian and believe in evolution. In my version of reality, God gave me a brain expecting me to use it, not check it at the door. I resisted the impulse to walk out immediately, and haven't gone back. Haven't been to a church service in a couple of years. In my immediate area, I seem to have a choice between stifling ceremony that's pretty meaningless to me and a brand of fundamentalist that has missed the point that God must like diversity because it seems he created a lot of it.

So, I miss what I had before, no doubt about it. I still read. I still think. I still remember that "God is love" and try to get the energy right. I think it's possible. I don't think it's ideal. I think what works for any individual is going to depend on them and where they draw their support and how they best access the divine.

Have you talked about this with your priest? (Am I remembering right, that it's a priest?) What does he/she say?

 

[Friday]

In moving around so much, I've found religion to be

1 part Spirituality
1 part Community
1 part Structure
1 part Pain in the ass

When 1 of those parts get removed, or goes bad, or gets out of percentage... it tends to tumble all the rest. Doesn't matter which part. Or how heavily they were weighted before.

Your Community has gone bad... But in removing that, IME, can't just try to keep,the spirituality. Because you'll also be losing the structure (not just dedicated days & times, but also the ceremony, traditions, etc.) as well as the pain in the ass parts (which are oddly necessary*).

So, my suggestion would be if you're trying to preserve the same level of spirituality... That you also look at replacing what you'll also be losing.

The others are obvious, but the PITA parts are different for everyone. Whether it's dressing up, volunteering, getting up early, confession, sitting still, etc... Whatever parts drive you nuts, but that don't drive you away, tend to be oddly necessary for most people. The struggle or the challenge in dealing with (manageable) parts they don't like bringing into sharp relief the parts they do like. Or creating a kind of balance, or acuity, that ends up missing without it. Like someone who is at church for 80% social, and 20% everything else... Who tries to get the social elsewhere... Ends up feeling the lack, because it wasn't just the social aspect that kept them there. It was social in this particular kind of environment, with specific types of people, for set times, with these set problems/PITAs. So the jogging group just doesn't cut it when they try to get their social thing outside of church. Ditto when you're trying to get your spiritually outside of church. Still totally doable. As long as you look at / replace the other aspects. My jogging friend managed it by changing her casual jogging group to a churchy marathon prep group.

 

[RussH]

Solara, regardless of how godly a church may be; it is still made up of human beings therefore it is a very imperfect organization. So, where God is perfect is his love and His righteousness, the church falls short in demonstrating those aspects of God.
I find the church, specifically the individuals that make up the church, demonstrate the love of God best when the extend forgiveness to one another.

As for your involvement; if it is causing you stress, then explain that to the leadership of the church and back off from some of your commitments.I am sure then leadership would understand

 

[Justmehere]

This morning I wanted to throw cupcakes I made at the church I am involved with.

My family doesn't go to church but there are people with some hints of the same abuse patterns. One guy gaslights and spoke to me incredibly abusively to me. A group of people stood silent. I want to scream at them. All of them. I don't know if I will stay or leave the church.

I believe in God and I would do anything to follow Him. I believe he works in so many diverse ways and I go to a church that is pretty accepting of that.

I have made some good healthy healing friendships in the church. I ahea run into dysfunction that has triggered my past stuff to the point it has contributed to worsening of PTSD.

I struggle too, if I should stay or go.
Right now I just want to throw these damn cupcakes at the building.

 

[Chosen]

I think throwing cupcakes at the building would be hilarious!

 

[Deleted member 1860]

I just want to let you all know I've been reading over this thread and all the replies. I want to respond to individual replies, but am still thinking it all through. [That's sort of my pattern when I make my own post as I need time to process it all.]

As for my dad, he came to me and disclosed more of what has been happening to him at church. Turns out that someone has bullied him and even threatened physical violence. The guy who did it was actually asked to leave the last church he attended (in some sort of twisted way he actually brags about it like its a badge of honor...sort of weird). My dad told me that he has made the choice to transition to another church in the area, one that we've been to a number of times. I was a bit shocked (but then again, not) as I know what this community means (or at one time meant) to my dad.

But, I'm still processing it all. I'm not sure if its taking me so long because I'm pretty numb right now and can't feel much of anything.

 

[Deleted member 12723]

I do not go to church but my faith is alive and well and thriving. It was a personal choice I had made after leaving a cult like church. In fact God revealed to me who he really is when I was not going to any church at all.

I think I am a very spiritual person who does not believe in the institution of a regular church anymore. Just my thoughts and I am so glad that you are really sorting through this very complicated problem and sure hope you find the solution that you can live with.

I do not understand why your mother who is a atheist is attending your church now.

 

[Eagle3]

I was also raised in a Christian cult and have since transitioned to a more individualistic style of worship. i still attend services every week, but because the actual service is such a huge rage trigger, I just go help in the kitchen and volunteer as security so i can have freedom to wander about the building and chat. It gives me the social aspect, my walk with God is not inhibited in any way, and I still have the connection with a like-minded community (even if I still think they tend to be just as cultish sometimes). You have to find what works for you, and rest assured in the knowledge that He completely understands what you are going through. I hope you find a place to worship in peace.