"subconcious Anorexia" As A Form Of Self-punishment??

[crazy8]

I wonder if anyone else has had this experience before....

I am a 26 year old woman with C-PTSD and depression. My episodes cause vomiting episodes a few times per week and a generally stressed feeling in my stomach most of the time. I suffered from eating disorders from age 15-18, alternating between bulimia and anorexia/extreme exercise and starvation. I haven't been aware of any purposeful efforts to be anorexic lately or TRY to lose weight, but I keep losing. I'm becoming quite thin (115 lbs at 5'7" with a muscular build from being a collegiate athlete). Sometimes I realize I haven't eaten in many hours, so I'll go to the kitchen, get some food, but then don't really want to eat it. I absolutely hate the feeling of being full, I much prefer to feel empty. I watch the scale go down every week or two and enjoy the feeling of losing weight. I like to look at my body, see how many ribs I can see, etc, and like the way it looks. I feel like I would be happy if I kept losing. People's concerns about my thinness make me feel uncomfortable, but I think deep down a part of me likes the constant reminders that people care, because I have such low self-worth right now, feeling undeserving of love and attention.

I'm not TRYING to lose weight, but I like the fact that I am, and sort of want to keep losing weight.

I wonder, am I subconsciously trying to make myself suffer in anorexia as a form of self-harm? (I do engage in other, more obvious, self harm behaviors during my flashbacks sometimes.) If I eat a normal-sized meal, I feel sick, so eating more would actually also be self-punishing, making me vomit, etc.

Has anyone else experienced this before?

 

[Queen Boudica]

Sounds like anorexia to me and it doesn't sound subconcious. You are enjoying the feeling looking at your ribs, you are aware of it. Get help now before it gets out of control.

 

[franciemarnie]

What is your therapist's take?

I never had Anorexia, but I was nauseated all my life since childhood with no physiological problems causing it. I was also 5'-7" and about 115 on average. Also muscular from work outs. I never felt hungry because I felt sick. Food was a bother. I ate what I needed to to keep going. No enjoyment of food.

For me, I connect it to the self perpetuated neglect and abuse I internalized in childhood. I have vomited from stress but it's been rare.

I think it is tied up with the complexity of issues at the heart of your trauma, but I'm no doc.

Something will need to change in a deep way I think for you to feel differently.

When you can eat, please eat healthy - like something with protein. I lived on peanut butter sandwiches for years because I read once that if you can't eat much, it packs in a lot of good stuff.

 

[crazy8]

I haven't explicitly told all of this to my T this yet, but I plan to. I have had so many other issues that were in need of attention first.

I'm not usually hungry, I just either feel "empty" or "full." It's strange. Food just isn't interesting or very tasty anymore. It's also possible that I just don't enjoy food because I'm depressed. (starting taking an SSRI a few weeks ago for that).

@franciemarnie I eat pretty healthy - I actually work in the nutrition field. I do keep high calorie foods like peanut butter around me constantly, too, to encourage myself to eat. I just don't really want much of it.

 

[Abstract]

I do see multiple red flags in what you say. I too have had a similar history to you. In fact I had eating disorders for almost 30 years and thought I would never recover.

As I went along what was involved changed as did my mindset. I would say that it got more and more complex as the years went on and that it more and more showed the true most powerful underlying issues I had.

I had the shame about people noticing that I had lost weight but not the secret satisfaction with their concern but what you describe is extremely common.

It is also common for it to be a form of self harm and deprivation. It can be very strongly linked to a rejection of our needs and bodies/physical selves.

Not being able to tolerate feeling full and getting satisfaction from being empty is also classic. As is a disconnection from body signals.

I won't say too much but for manyy with abuse or assault in their past feelings of being full or eating can also be triggering or a stressor. That is essential to get past in order to be able to eat.

Don't feel pressured to answer but what role did purging have for you in the past? In what context are you being sick now? What are your feelings before and when does it happen?

I would also be interested to hear how recovered you were at your best. In other words, did you ever find it a pleasure to eat healthily and were you ever able to have normal hunger and satiety signals?

Well done for looking at this.

 

[crazy8]

@Abstract thanks for sharing. Sigh, I wish I could answer your questions. The truth is, I am usually not able to understand how I feel when it comes to my deeper problems, not yet at least. So my answer won't be "complete." All I really know is my past anorexia/bulimia was rooted in feelings of inadequacy, the need to control, self-hatred, and striving for the perfect body for a female athlete. My abusers were very proud of me for my athletic successes, so I imagine there's something going on there on a subconscious level, but I really have no idea. Unfortunately, I remember very little about my emotions back then, and still understand very little about my emotions now.

Now, when I think about certain things, I vomit (sometimes unintentionally, other times I do help myself throw up by using my fingers, only when I'm almost about to throw up anyway). Just thoughts about my own inadequacy or about my past abuse cause me to vomit, and I often don't experience any emotions (that I am aware of) when this happens. Other times, if I am triggered, I'll go into an all-out emotional flashback and the vomiting can be quite emotional and scary then.

I think it's time to bring these thoughts to my T. Sigh, maybe someday I'll understand my emotions like you, Abstract. I just have trouble knowing what I should worry about, what emotions are important, etc.

Thanks for all your thoughts.

 

[Abstract]

Ah. Thanks for sharing more Crazy8.

I find it hard to discuss as lots of shame but stopping getting sick was one of the hardest things I have ever done. It turned out it was my only way of experiencing and expressing anger amongst other things.

Sounds like one of your initial motivations was to have an athletic body and it was associated with your abuser then too.

I just wanted to share that that it does not have to be a motivation for ED's at all. I have to say that for most of my history it really had almost nothing to do with food or body in a normal sense.

I glad you are going to ask about this. I found that confronting these things required me to work through stuff that had happened.

If you want to speak about any of this to me then feel free to. I shall try to watch out for the thread.

 

[Deleted member 1860]

No, this is not subconscious. You are VERY conscious of your behavior and the effects of your behavior. This is flat out denial.

You have an unhealthy BMI. My rock bottom healthy BMI is your current weight and I'm shorter than you.

You're engaging in dangerous self-harming behavior. Nobody else is going to rescue you. Please reach out to your therapist.

 

[Abstract]

I just wanted to add that a BMI of 18.5 to 20 is not suitable for most population groups and is more aimed at Asia.

Don't get caught up in BMI as having what you describe is not OK. ED's are more than anorexia.

It is also dangerous not to have your electrolytes and other blood tests monitored with the amount you are getting sick.

Good luck!

 

[crazy8]

This is flat out denial.

It probably sounds insane to you when I say that I truly cannot easily see what is happening to me. It sounds like it's so obvious to you guys. I don't aim to put you all in the position of responsibility for "rescuing" me. I often do not understand why I feel certain things, or what my emotions are based on or cause me to do. As you know, trauma histories can often distort our perceptions of truth. I think I did need to hear these responses, though, before realizing it was serious enough to bring to my T. Yes, I'm truly that emotionally disconnected from myself...

 

[Abstract]

I believe I understand what you meant, Crazy. People have often, on some level, perposely and consciously aimed to get thinner with ED's and therefore don't recognise that it can still be an ED when they are not doing this; and in fact don't realise that some people never do this with ED's.

I understand the level of disconnect you describe. I always think it is impossible to put into words how disconnected I was or how unable I was to tell what was problematic and what wasn't. You need treatment for this though.

 

[radicalgratitude]

@crazy8 I have been just waiting for a time when it could hypothetically be considered "on topic" to mention that your picture looks delicious! I love chocolate-covered strawberries.

In many ways, I have had the same struggles recently, just with probably a higher starting point as far as weight/BMI. I also have a history of anorexia. My T did consider it to be an issue and with her help I was able to cease the behaviors and weight loss. However, I can relate to everything you wrote (i.e. I have a low tolerance for feeling full.) For me it is directly related to my trauma issues.

I didn't feel like I was trying to lose weight either even though I was engaged in various forms of "body checking" and paying attention to how much I was eating and exercising. My T considers what I did to be a form of self-harm.

I was in denial. I had "fully recovered." I can't afford to be in denial anymore especially now that I have been considering "not trying to lose weight" again...