OK, first since you seem to want to debate in lieu of discuss and it may not seem to be "my debate" rather it is bec's... Well, for the community to be in the know I have throughly discussed this for days with her. So now people have an idea why I am butting in.
O.K. So isn't grabbing a gun that someone puts in your face and challenging them to pull the trigger A SERIOUS HANDICAPPER?
Well, most people's (not everyone is like you apparently) reactions are. Much like the woman who can stay frozen during the entirety of an attack, or a hold up. Which is the topic. A person's unique response to trauma. Maybe you can snap out of yours and be aware and in control of yourself but not everyone has that luxury and many try to come to terms with that fact. You are judging her because she reacts a certain way. Like she had control over her own reaction in the face of trauma.
We can't avoid all traumas, but we CAN learn better ways of coping with threats than daring someone to kill us. I'm baffled that that's being discussed as something to be accepted as being beyond control.
How? Please enlighten us all all to change our very basic instincts to any given trauma so that we may implement this should we ever look down another barrel, cornered to be beaten by a man 2 and 1/2 times our size... I would love for you to share this as I have yet to see a single person here claim to know how to turn off the fight, flight, or freeze reaction and get their head wrapped around something horrifying to them. I would have loved to known how I may have been able to not freeze and then flee the 2 dead babies who I could have saved if I had my wits about me. Please enlighten us! How do I prepare for another rape, fatal accident, or kidnapping? I would really love to know the regimen to turn off my instinctual responses. For now I will be thankful people here were able to explain to me and my doctor's how the brain works at those times and indeed I did not have control over my reactions.
I didn't "waltz" through the wards, btw.
Your previous post certainly made it sound like a walk in the park! Almost to me bragging how you could go through one of the worst areas in Houston with no attack on yourself.
But when we have PTSD, it's especially important to learn to take care of ourselves. Don't you think?
I think it is extremely important PTSD or not. Also to teach our children responsibility so they know what is high risk and what isn't. Those of us who had any part in poor choices that contributed have to accept them and try not to do it again, but I find here this is rarely the case. I am one of the few who have a part in some trauma. But this has zero to do with trying to understand the concept of fight, flight, or freeze. Once you are facing it the rest matters very little beyond that scope. It helps in healing past trauma not facing new ones no matter how you got there. Shit happens, whether you are in the ward or in river oaks (houston terms for others).
If I had kept floating around the ceiling---dissociating because I was responding to that particular rapist the way I responded to my step-father's sexual abuse when I was a child---I would have been raped. If I had responded to my ex the way I responded to that rapist, I might have been killed. I guess I'm just lucky, huh?
More than you even realize apparently. Because this has zero to do with mental strength or weaknesses. You posses an ability many don't have and you I hope are damn grateful for. Many freeze and are raped. Are they somehow less than you because of this? I hope you would say not.
PTSD symptoms... For example. Panic attacks. The oh god I am dying right this damn minute call 911 types. I have so I know what they are like. I have gone whistle buggy route for some. With much intense time and work I can get most on track without drugs and hospitals. Instead of just saying it can be done and I do it so every one should be able to and try to figure out out loud why others "won't" I try to relay to others who have it how I did it and wish the best of luck in their battle and empathize and continue to offer advice to try to soften their ordeal. (man that sentence ran on!) So again relay to us how to do this, would be a wonderful *new* thread.
How is it empowering to tell somebody that they can't LEARN how to manage their response to threats and triggers?
Again please enlighten the community if you think this is so simple. A gun in your face is a trauma, not trigger. Triggers can in time be managed by most, but certainly not all triggers for all people! Examples... The the names known here and watching them in time. Self. I had to move from Houston as it was a trigger and no way in hell I would even be able to breathe there to begin to have hopes in healing. Bec, same issue. Anthony, again cannot be around the bases. Moves were needed for us all. I am sure others here the same way. Matter of fact I know others are here some triggers cannot be overcome.
How is acceptance being confused with empowerment? So much guilt and shame are part of confusion to our responses. We try to work through it. I have not seen someone empowered by their flight, fight, or freeze. Maybe some are empowered by the fight and why it is not spoken of much. But I see
here a desire for understanding in hopes of acceptance of them self. Because the *fact* is not all people can be taught how to respond to trauma. Much like the other things we go through it is not the same for all. Case in point soldiers are trained hard to respond a certain way and some still cannot once faced with it. And that is intense training for a trauma they are knowing they are going into, no surprises. You can be conditioned after much exposure I think, but not just taught. You have no clue until you look down that barrel in real life.
Examples
Empower- 1. to give power or authority to; authorize, esp. by legal or official means: I empowered my agent to make the deal for me. The local ordinance empowers the board of health to close
unsanitary restaurants.
2. to enable or permit: Wealth empowered him to live a comfortable life.
Acceptance - 1. the act of taking or receiving something offered.
2. favorable reception; approval; favor.
3. the act of assenting or believing: acceptance of a theory.
Understanding - 1. mental process of a person who comprehends; comprehension; personal interpretation: My understanding of the word does not agree with yours.
2. intellectual faculties; intelligence; mind: a quick understanding.
When somebody says that they've invited someone to shoot them, I think that it's a bit odd to respond with "that's beyond your control." I think the person should be baffled enough by such a self-destructive impulse to see it as complex psychological phenomenon that needs to be taken apart and defused. That requires seeing this reaction as something that can be changed. Our lizard brains do not say freeze, run, or 'grab the rock that Ugh is threatening me with and press it against my forehead while daring him to hit me with it'. Where does that come from? There is a real answer in there that's worth looking for.
Odd to you. I found it very odd years ago people would ever dream of leaving their kids in burning buildings. Impossible though on the news a lot. But I also learned I have no idea how I would react and seeing so many different reactions to trauma there is certainly no cookie cutter mold! If there were then this forum would not exist. It would all be fixed by now.
You know after discussing this it may be very much like freeze. I see gun and I feel I have already died, you just curl up and take the death as you are already dead. How do you know that is not along the same lines? We don't know and she mat not. But you are not posting in a matter to seem to want to dig at this deeper though you say it now. You were judging and acting trollish towards her over her responses to trauma as if she has control. Why not go try this in a rape thread of they could have done something about it? Because you would be kicked? You are playing a head game with bec and it is a crock, insensitive, and rude.
You can toss in the question "where does that come from" like you really want to know while the rest of your posting are treating her like she should react a certain way and is in the wrong or attributed to it herself in some way. While to others here you have acted supportive. I think you have a target on her myself here. Why? No clue.
If someone told you they were suicidal would you tell them that's involuntary? If you remember in Deer Hunter, Nikki eventually did lose, and the lesson was not that it was involuntary for him to play Russian Roulette. Understandable with what little was known about PTSD at the time and the context of the film, but totally unnecessary now.
WTF does this have to do with anything? Suicidal is nothing like this and is comparing apples and oranges and you are talking about a movie or book??? No clue.
