"The other person" in a CPTSD relationship

[Anon1]

Hey guys,

I had a little knock back after finding out my ex with CPTSD is engaged to another guy, five/six or so months after saying she'd like to get back together with me.

I will get over that and move forward again, but while chewing things over, I had a thought and I wondered if anyone has any insight into it.

I wondered if my ex ever *really* saw me as a separate person, and I wondered if this would be a symptom of some people's CPTSD?

I threaded some things together, which might be drawing links where none exist, but they are:

- Talking about manipulation a lot - when she first kissed me, she muttered into my ear something about her 'manipulative girlish ways', which I thought was a strange joke or quirky pillow talk at the time(!) She also told me 'I could manipulate the sh*t out of you to move here, but I wont...'. And made jokes about her dad being wrapped around her finger etc.

- She made off the cuff comments now and then, saying things like 'I love that you're like my Ken doll that I can dress you up in different clothes when we go shopping, and you'll just wear them' (Which was strange, because we'd never been clothes shopping, and I'm actually quite particular about what I wear...)

- She was desperate for kids, and one of the main reasons she gave (possibly the only one actually) was 'they regulate me'.

- She said that in her younger years, she wanted kids but didn't want a husband - and only wanted to marry because you needed a man to have a child (she said "later I realised that it would be nice to have a husband too").

- A few weeks before we broke up, she said "I think I'd like to date other guys because I'm not sure what I want in a man". I told her I understood, but that I'd also be dating other girls if she did that. She was shocked, and immediately retracted the statement. Later she said "When you said that, I realised I didn't want it." - But I was amazed she was surprised... as though she expected me to just kinda... be 'on pause' while she did what she liked...

There was more than that too - just... general behaviours... general expectations... ways of relating... I didn't realise at the time exactly what it was, but now I wonder if she saw me as separate to her; or as an extension of her, there to fulfill her needs.


Further to that... I still find it so hard to understand how she can be so devoted to her faith... and have the qualities of genuine humility (she once asked an older lady at church what to look for in a husband, and the lady replied "Don't look for the charismatic man at a party, look for the one who stops to put the chairs away at the end of the night"). She journaled a lot, and studied her Bible... she had all these notes in it, underlined and highlighted...


There were things about her that were so easy to fall for... I sometimes wondered if they were performative, or mixed in with selfish motives... but I can't believe that they ALWAYS were...


Well... just wondered if anyone has any perspective on this.


[I may delete this post in a few days - I don't like the idea that she might stumble across it one day - it's more specific to us than some of my previous posts have been]

 

[Friday]

I’ve had 3 men ask to marry me, seriously, only after a day or so. 6 after a week. A few others her and there…but loooong before your ex got engaged. One of them? The blink & seize? After a few minutes. I DID eventually say yes to him. I said no to all the others. Also to him the first IDFK how many times. I’d just be being me, being completely normal, and he’d light up and demand I marry him. And then he was killed, before we could. And I’ve missed him, ever since.

You take it as an insult, a sting, a betrayal… how “quickly” she moved on from you.

Don’t.

The MOMENT you broke up? Your paths diverged, your lives diverged.

Clinging to her actions as a reflection of YOU? Is simply incorrect. Understandable, as you still care for her, and are tangled up over losing her… but wrong. Her life, her choices, right or wrong or somewhere in between? Have. Nothing. To. Do. With. You. They don’t reflect on you, much less define anything about you.

If you’re up hung up on tHe timing? 5 months? Try 5 years, 5 decades, 5 days, 5 minutes. The TIMING of someone else’s choices? Is all about them. Not you.

 

[Anon1]

I’ve had 3 men ask to marry me, seriously, only after a day or so. 6 after a week. A few others her and there…but loooong before your ex got engaged. One of them? The blink & seize? After a few minutes. I DID eventually say yes to him. I said no to all the others. Also to him the first IDFK how many times. I’d just be being me, being completely normal, and he’d light up and demand I marry him. And then he was killed, before we could. And I’ve missed him, ever since.

You take it as an insult, a sting, a betrayal… how “quickly” she moved on from you.

Don’t.

The MOMENT you broke up? Your paths diverged, your lives diverged.

Clinging to her actions as a reflection of YOU? Is simply incorrect. Understandable, as you still care for her, and are tangled up over losing her… but wrong. Her life, her choices, right or wrong or somewhere in between? Have. Nothing. To. Do. With. You. They don’t reflect on you, much less define anything about you.

If you’re up hung up on tHe timing? 5 months? Try 5 years, 5 decades, 5 days, 5 minutes. The TIMING of someone else’s choices? Is all about them. Not you.

Aye, this is helpful you know (sorry to hear about your fiance - that must be super hard).

I think it just stirred things up again - I guess I felt like I'd dealt with it more than I maybe had.

And the way she treated me, and the fact that he threatened me... y'know - whatever, it happens.

I don't want either of them to be miserable forever now.

But it would've felt fairer somehow if I wasn't picturing them all loved up and happy at the end of what was - for me - one of the hardest seasons in recent life.

I struggle to square with it - you sort of think... if someone was genuinely behaving irresponsibly to you, that their irresponsibility will - at least - lead to some life lesson for them, or whatever.

Not that it'll lead to this big reward.

*sigh*, well - I've done my allotted whining for the afternoon now... off to work I go!

(Ps - I take your point. I'll remember it in the coming days!)

 

[Sweetpea76]

The way she treated you does not sound like a PTSD thing, in my opinion. That sounds like personality, or personality disorders. If so, YOU are the lucky one to escape that with most of your mental health in tact instead of a lifetime of that kind of manipulation.

 

[Anon1]

The way she treated you does not sound like a PTSD thing, in my opinion. That sounds like personality, or personality disorders. If so, YOU are the lucky one to escape that with most of your mental health in tact instead of a lifetime of that kind of manipulation.

Aye, thank you!

I appreciate your perspective and the validation.

If I'm totally honest, I've really struggled with this.

I don't like feeling as though I'm 'whining on the internet about an ex' - this forum is an amazing resource, but it's not like her and I are even together now.

It feels like it just had a really deep impact somehow.

I think I've generally done okay at moving forward, but months later, I still feel a bit jittery under the surface.

I still get into a headspace where I'll see the situation entirely from her perspective, think I treated her badly, and then remember that

"Oh wait - no - it was just that I ended up feeling entirely responsible for her moods; and I had to tiptoe carefully around all her triggers, while she treated me however she wanted."

But it's ridiculous how your brain can go into "I'm ashamed and at fault for everything" mode - just accepting the other person's narrative of you, when you know it's totally false.

That skewed perspective where it all revolves around the other person... it really messes with your perception of things.

I find myself questioning my perception of normal interactions now, and I almost feel like I'm expecting girls (especially) to act in ways that I don't anticipate or understand.

I still go through phases of ruminating...

I've just never given so much in a relationship before... to someone who said she needed it because of some horrific trauma... but who also left me feeling totally wrongfooted, and unable to tell up from down, and (in some cases) right from wrong... I mean - I've had to go back and piece it all together again to work out what the heck actually happened.

I look back now and don't even recognise the person I was behaving like back then... it seems crazy now.

And I feel I've run into something that I'd rather not know about the world - that some people will just... do things, and it'll be random, and arbitrary, and hard to
make sense of, and painful.

Some of my friends are really awesome about it, quite a few don't really get it, I don't think... because this doesn't feel like a normal break up to me.

Anyway - sorry for the rant.

I know I'll get over this.

I'm continuing to study in her city, and I'm determined to turn the crap off from last school year, and write a new chapter here.

I'll overcome all of it, I just... needed to get things off my chest here... it's been hard!

[Of course, people go through *way* worse than I have... it's just... this is my first time, and it's been very eye opening...!!]

 

[Anon1]

Tell you what it is -

It's the feeling of going into something with good intentions and no expectations (I didn't want to 'save her' or whatever - just to date her) -

And then suddenly being exposed to a ton of things you have no experience in, and then coming out of it like:

"That MUST have been my fault... she's ill... But IS she ill? And how ill? And what was malicious, and what wasn't? And did she do it on purpose? And if not, why did it sometimes feel so deliberate? And What was me being an idiot? And what was a misunderstanding? Is it ALL me?"

And why did I let her mix me up completely, and then let her blame me for it? It makes no sense.

And the looking back and swinging between feeling like it WAS all me, and then realising like "Actually no... it mostly wasn't me at all!"

 

[hypervigilant]

Just my few pennies worth but she sounds like she has narcissistic tendencies and wanted to pick you up and put you down and was shocked that you had wishes of your own.
After a relationship with a narcissist it's natural to feel confused and disorientated as the reality of the relationship doesn't fit with what you thought it was.
Also feeling shame is extremely common after the relationship breaks down. Be aware nothing is your fault it's just what they do.
I feel you've had a lucky escape

 

[Anon1]

Just my few pennies worth but she sounds like she has narcissistic tendencies and wanted to pick you up and put you down and was shocked that you had wishes of your own.
After a relationship with a narcissist it's natural to feel confused and disorientated as the reality of the relationship doesn't fit with what you thought it was.
Also feeling shame is extremely common after the relationship breaks down. Be aware nothing is your fault it's just what they do.
I feel you've had a lucky escape

Thanks for the reply!

Yeah, you might be right.

The term 'narcissist' has become so trendy these days, that I was previously very wary of applying that term (I guess I still am), but it possibly fits the way things were.

Having said that, I feel *way* stronger in myself now.

Jeez, it took some time... I felt like I'd never piece it together.

Now, I feel as though... y'know... whereas it'd be interesting to know what actually happened there... the most important thing is that I know it wasn't for me.

I've done a lot of self-work, and I feel better now than when I went into the relationship - stronger, more mature, more grounded... more aware of my needs, and more comfortable with protecting and meeting those needs...

I do occasionally miss her, or have days where the pain of what happened still stings (actually, usually it's the latter of those than the former).

I have days now and then where my feelings are catching up with my mind, and the confusion can make me go "What the heeeell was THAT all about...??"

But by and large, I'm way better and actually feel like I'm doing pr-etty good!

As a measure of that progress - the other day, the fact that her new boyfriend threatened me popped into my head and I actually laughed a bit, and thought "Well... I feel like I won, because I actually escaped the whole thing, and got totally clear of her!"

I don't mean to be immature there, but it was liberating.

The next step - I guess - is to move to a place where I feel completely neutral and forget about her.
I think I'm starting to see signs of that, but I guess it'll take just a little more time.

It's helped to have a great therapist who actually seems to understand these dynamics in the way that my last one didn't (my last one used to say things like "You ought to commit to her more, so that she feels more secure around you" etc, rather than saying "Don't commit more until she shows she's safe - and set boundaries!!!")

 

[luffy]

Hey guys,

I had a little knock back after finding out my ex with CPTSD is engaged to another guy, five/six or so months after saying she'd like to get back together with me.

I will get over that and move forward again, but while chewing things over, I had a thought and I wondered if anyone has any insight into it.

I wondered if my ex ever *really* saw me as a separate person, and I wondered if this would be a symptom of some people's CPTSD?

I threaded some things together, which might be drawing links where none exist, but they are:

- Talking about manipulation a lot - when she first kissed me, she muttered into my ear something about her 'manipulative girlish ways', which I thought was a strange joke or quirky pillow talk at the time(!) She also told me 'I could manipulate the sh*t out of you to move here, but I wont...'. And made jokes about her dad being wrapped around her finger etc.

- She made off the cuff comments now and then, saying things like 'I love that you're like my Ken doll that I can dress you up in different clothes when we go shopping, and you'll just wear them' (Which was strange, because we'd never been clothes shopping, and I'm actually quite particular about what I wear...)

- She was desperate for kids, and one of the main reasons she gave (possibly the only one actually) was 'they regulate me'.

- She said that in her younger years, she wanted kids but didn't want a husband - and only wanted to marry because you needed a man to have a child (she said "later I realised that it would be nice to have a husband too").

- A few weeks before we broke up, she said "I think I'd like to date other guys because I'm not sure what I want in a man". I told her I understood, but that I'd also be dating other girls if she did that. She was shocked, and immediately retracted the statement. Later she said "When you said that, I realised I didn't want it." - But I was amazed she was surprised... as though she expected me to just kinda... be 'on pause' while she did what she liked...

There was more than that too - just... general behaviours... general expectations... ways of relating... I didn't realise at the time exactly what it was, but now I wonder if she saw me as separate to her; or as an extension of her, there to fulfill her needs.


Further to that... I still find it so hard to understand how she can be so devoted to her faith... and have the qualities of genuine humility (she once asked an older lady at church what to look for in a husband, and the lady replied "Don't look for the charismatic man at a party, look for the one who stops to put the chairs away at the end of the night"). She journaled a lot, and studied her Bible... she had all these notes in it, underlined and highlighted...


There were things about her that were so easy to fall for... I sometimes wondered if they were performative, or mixed in with selfish motives... but I can't believe that they ALWAYS were...


Well... just wondered if anyone has any perspective on this.


[I may delete this post in a few days - I don't like the idea that she might stumble across it one day - it's more specific to us than some of my previous posts have been]

Totally understand everything you said.
And yes, people with complex ptsd expect you too fulfill their needs but their needs are completely unrealistic and subconscious to the trauma. Their needs is a game, if their needs are met they can feel lonely again. Why? Because no real person can meet their needs except if enlightened but an enlightened person wouldnt be attracted to someone who are not enlightened themselves. The needs of someone with cptsd destroys both the partner and themselves, the needs are secretly designed to push away good lovers and on the other hand chase emotionally unavailable people or third option accept an abusive person (physical abuse etc)

If you want to know why cptsd people are so lovable, cute and humble at times (when not triggered and dysregulated), its because they are partly "dead", so in a sense they actually connected with their soul and/or afterlife. Thats why they feel like angels, they have "multitple" personalities, and one of the personalities comes straight from heaven, their most authentic self if you will. Yes she did the bible or spirituality because she is "dead" enough to see the validity of that reality

Paradoxically the connection to death makes them amazing and authentic in their personal expression (at least in space or hot moments), but their physical self is a hell or nightmare, that's why they try to not live in time, only in space. And they demonize attachment as if it is only bad. They demonize ego and self-focus too. But its their own ego and attachment that is rotten, and they project onto the world that all selfishness is bad, choosing to only see when its bad rather than choosing to also see when self-centeredness is of the benevolent kind (any body is inherently self-centered and self-revolving. Even larger bodies such as a species, or smaller bodies such as a cell).
And also, sense cptsd people are so ignorant with their own past, they forget easily and especially forget (or explain away) their own selfishness. Cptsd cant handle the idea of "something is wrong with me", and yes nothing is wrong with ones soul (the real you) but something can def be wrong with the body and how it currently functions. (Sure, can be right for abusive environment but one can usually live in a less abusive environment later in life if one choose to)

Cptsd creates codependent partners, because they barely have their own body (their own past, harmonious focus on the past), and they barely have their own emotions too. In fact they can feel others emotion litterally because alot of emotion is electromagnetic and located in space.
Anyway, their lack of boundaries and self-past is the issue. Or rather, their self-past very much controls them but they dont want to look at it and heal so they cant make their own ego/body sustained throughout time.

Extra: For some reason cptsd people also becomes very physically pretty or attractive?
I wonder why, could be the connection with death or just the intensity of the emotion doing something to the facia in our skin.
Can also be related to ethos from peoplepleasing or fawn mode.. hard to tell

To be clear I think cptsd people are amazing, they almost have a "lucky" injury which allows them to integrate spirituality to earth.
But they should heal their past so they can find healthy relationships rather than doing and enforcing unconscious traumabonding.
They should also generalize less (trying to predict by understand a man or a woman as opposed to understanding the unique body/ego of their partner). They should be less hateful on generalizing logic too.. because they generalize bodies and feelings all the time. And sure, generalizing is useful sometimes if used right

Hopefully I wrote something useful here and is not just venting. Dated an amazing cptsd girl for a year and she recently broke up with me (on real real real this time) and I love her and miss her. I am angry at the world, I can tell she loves me too which is exactly the problem. Her subconscious absolutely can't allow that to happen. The only thing between her and me is her armor and I make it thicker and angrier than anyone would.. because I was too good to be true, I dont exist. I can't. Not unless she leaps and leaps but she hardly did. She belive in her body, unquestionably. Confusing intuition with trauma impulse :/

They also stalk and are on the guard all the time so I feel slightly afraid of her reading this someday too lol (my name is not luffy). Everything is missunderstood when cautious in survival mode, hypervigilance, reading into things falsely (uuuh Gyote song "somebody I used to know" was def about cptsd partner).

But if you are out there Jenny, I really really really love you. Gladly scaring you, because I will refuse to be like your ptsd thoughts, you deserve to feel loved. Period.
If you are with someone else, I wish you good luck and I believe in you

- V

 

[Sweetpea76]

To be clear I think cptsd people are amazing, they almost have a "lucky" injury which allows them to integrate spirituality to earth.

I don’t think their trauma could be considered lucky in any way. Foundational, perhaps, but not even remotely lucky.

I think manipulation, stalking, cheating, ill treatment, etc. are general personality traits. Just remember, not everything is PTSD. We had a common quote here in the supporter section back in the day… “even assholes get PTSD.” Not everything is a symptom, and not all behaviors are caused by PTSD. If somebody isn’t manipulative by nature, PTSD isn’t going to cause that. Somebody who doesn’t think cheating is OK isn’t going to suddenly think it is OK because they suffer from PTSD. They’re still cognizant of their behaviors and responsible for their actions.

At the end of the day, does it matter why they’re treating you badly? They’re still treating you badly either way.

 

[Roland]

The way she treated you does not sound like a PTSD thing, in my opinion. That sounds like personality, or personality disorders. If so, YOU are the lucky one to escape that with most of your mental health in tact instead of a lifetime of that kind of manipulation.

Came here to say what @Sweetpea76 said. She could have personality splitting like where one part of her is all those dark manipulative traits and the other part is this wholesome Christian girl. Could be any of a myriad of personality disorders, especially if you consider splitting too.

Heck, many of those quotes could have come out of my mouth. I have personality splitting, one part is narcissist, masochistic, schizoid etc and the other part is my wounded child and I also have PTSD. But I do my best not to be an asshole.

 

[Anon1]

Came here to say what @Sweetpea76 said. She could have personality splitting like where one part of her is all those dark manipulative traits and the other part is this wholesome Christian girl. Could be any of a myriad of personality disorders, especially if you consider splitting too.

Heck, many of those quotes could have come out of my mouth. I have personality splitting, one part is narcissist, masochistic, schizoid etc and the other part is my wounded child and I also have PTSD. But I do my best not to be an asshole.

Thanks for replying!

I'm sort of responding with some caution, because I've basically completely moved on from the situation now (and I don't want to revisit it in my thoughts anymore). But I still get notifications here if someone posts something, and I'm interested!

So - if you don't mind me asking - what's it like?

I don't want to think in this way anymore, but for a while I was caught in confusion about just who was standing in front of me.

Here's a girl in front of me, and she always looks kind of the same -

But her posture changes, she has a lisp sometimes and not others, her walking style changes, her face stays the same but somehow it changes too (I find it hard to describe).

And she wants to pray together one minute, and threatens to "beat the sh*t" out of me a little later... and then afterwards doesn't really seem to remember; and instead bursts into dysregulated tears...

With other people, she can be fun, charismatic and charming... the minute the front door closes, she's someone different again...

She lies about things my family said to her to draw a reaction from me...

But at the same time insists she wants to be there for me and to care for me etc etc...

There's a lot about her past that she wouldn't tell me 'unless we got married' - and yet she told me horrible trauma stories after a date or two...


I'm not sure what's dissociation in what I'm describing and what isn't; but I can't imagine what it'd be like to experience that.

And I found it hard to understand because she was the same human being in front of me... but also... she was different... how does a person make sense of *that*?