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What Do You Do When Your Therapist Can't Understand Your Trauma?

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I think what makes therapy an awful thought is the very fact of the inherent 'attention' it involves.

I find leaving final & a way out of facing it or having to deal with it or worry. But I also think most of the 'horrible' things I feel or fear or when I feel mistrust it's mostly due to anxiety & all this 'stuff' & the past & fear & memory impairment (not being able to remember 'why' someone is trustworthy etc). Then my mind finds an explanation that's 'present-related'. But for me the real truth is "Don't talk, don't tell", etc & fear fall-out.
 
I agree ghotiff and scout86, that it is a really important skill to have and develop. Please don't interpret what I'm thinking as me wanting to be 'right' either but since you have pointed that out, it has made me ponder the dynamics of comfort v's empathy, when someone asks for either.

A child is seeking comfort and empathy when they ask for a hug. Are they the same thing? I'm not sure and would be interested to hear what others think about that. When our kids ask for that, we give the hug and we validate their distress either verbally or nonverbally. We wouldn't be giving empathy if we just hugged them and told them to move on from that or 'don't cry, it's not relevant what you feel'. That moment they are seeking us, is when we take the opportunity to validate their feelings and facilitate how the distress is being expressed and experienced.
 
A child is seeking comfort and empathy when they ask for a hug.
I think you're right. they aren't the same thing. Recognizing and sorting out "feelings" is not something I'm good at. I'm not sure I could define either of these or recognize them when I saw them. But the general idea I have is that they are different, and it's probably an important difference.

'don't cry, it's not relevant what you feel'.
That's something I can relate to, way more than what I think @ghotiff is talking about with a child receiving a hug when they ask for it. But, since we're struggling towards "normal"....

@Junebug, the tape that runs in my brain says "Anything you say can and will be used against you!" LOL I think we're supposed to be working towards better internal messages though, right?

@joeylittle , it looks to me like what you're experiencing is a problem caused by your traumatic background. And it looks like some version of it exists with others as well. Which, I think, means it's in your own best interest to work your way through it with your therapist. I'm guessing it's something he's seem before. (As I'm typing, I'm thinking "Better you than me!" LOL But, like I said earlier, I can see a similar confrontation looming on my horizon too.)
 
Okay, here comes Heather's opinions on therapists (again).

The first thing that therapists can't do is step into your shoes or your body to feel, know, taste, touch, smell, hurt that you've been through. They can only hear and see what they can to help you. Some can connect with empathy which helps a great deal and some are too clinical in nature to have any kind of "connection" to you in regards to your devastation. In fact, many therapists disengage from their clients because the situation becomes too much for them to handle and then some of them altogether are so black and white on issues that we, as clients, want someone to understand us, not give us psychological mumbo jumbo that makes us more confused and upset.

Second, depending upon your type of PTSD you have, you NEED to find someone that specializes in this field, not just find some therapist who you think MIGHT understand you. I was SOOOOOO fortunate to find someone that specializes in non-military PTSD that will get to the bottom of all of my issues that I have (and yesterday, he wondered how I'm still breathing!!!). Call your insurance carrier and find out if there is a therapist nearby that specializes in PTSD trauma. I was EXTREMELY fortunate. I will be praying for you.
 
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I will too. :hug:

Yes @Ladyghosthunter getting to the bottom of beliefs does take ability, compassion, & communication and trust. Otherwise it's too scary to go there.

Thanks for the reminder @scout86 . We are supposed to be trying to 're-program' ourselves. :eek: :hug:
 
@Ladyghosthunter, my therapist is a trauma specialist. And actually a very empathetic therapist; he's just not reading me correctly and I am unable to fix it.

Thank you all, again for your thoughts. I'm really intrigued by the analogy to a child asking for a hug. I think the way that behavior develops is through the parent first demonstrating that hugging is ok by offering physical comfort as a response to any negative situation. It's interesting that in this instance I'm identifying as the child, and I feel that I don't have permission to initiate.

All this has put me into crisis mode, somewhat. I did send a very long email, but it still did not come right out and say it. And in and among the halting attempts to express myself there was a lot of other stuff that I am struggling with that I feel afraid to talk about...he's asked to do a session tomorrow to go over the email.

Is it possible that this is all some very odd version of transference? I would never in a million years equate him with my captor, except that I feel a very similar level of inner confusion.

@Mystery , you talked about complicity as survival. Intellectually I understand the idea - experientially I do not recall ever reaching a pivot point where I understood what to do in order to survive. It was all so far beyond my understanding of people, sex, violence...that is the way in which I was very very much a young person.

@ghotiff , I think your observations are really smart. And @Junebug and @scout86 , thank you so much for your empathy. It really does help.

I really just need to muster up some inner reserves of strength or something and tell him what is going on. Without making it so much about what HE should do; I need to express in terms of what I need. And also give examples.

He's not cold. He's unbelievably centered and collected.

I think that my trauma is insignificant anyway - but this I'd reinforced by his calm and centered response to it. I would like to know how he feels about things. At this point in our work together, it would help me to hear his opinion, his actual thoughts, not his non-judgement. Because I do accept at this point that he is not and will not judge me harshly for any of it. Now, I think it's about mutual trust and somehow leveling out what feels to me like a big imbalance of power. He knows everything about how I feel and I know nothing of how he feels.

Is the above paragraph making sense?
 
Yes, it makes sense.

Go back to the child analogy. It's honestly something I'd never thought of before, but I think it's on the right track and is a great analogy.

I think the way that behavior develops is through the parent first demonstrating that hugging is ok by offering physical comfort as a response to any negative situation. It's interesting that in this instance I'm identifying as the child, and I feel that I don't have permission to initiate.
Actually, I think (and this is based on things my T has said, not personal experience) a child is BORN thinking that's ok. They have to LEARN that it's not. "Normally" there's no question about how the need for comfort is going to be responded to. It's early experiences with "non-comforting" responses that lead to the uncertainty. Then, I suspect PTSD itself leads to confusion about what is a "threat" and what it's and that probably factors in here too. From some perspectives (like, probably, yours & mine) there are so many mixed signals that it can't be anything other than confusing.

I think that my trauma is insignificant anyway - but this I'd reinforced by his calm and centered response to it.
Maybe his calm and centered response doesn't reflect his feelings about your trauma at all. Maybe it reflects his confidence that the 2 of you can deal with the results of your trauma. (Maybe it's something else all together. I'm a horrible mind reader!)

He knows everything about how I feel and I know nothing of how he feels.
Boy can I relate to that! A lot of times, when I send my T and email, he doesn't reply and it's like the information, which was often hard to share, disappears into a black hole. I HATE that! He keeps telling me he really reads stuff, like knowing that helps. It doesn't, it makes it worse. Because, just like you said, he knows how I feel but I have no idea what's going on on his side. And I get the impression he totally doesn't get how that could be uncomfortable.

Hey, I'd like to thank you for starting one of the best threads ever. A lot of this is stuff I've kind of been experiencing and this is really helping me organize my thoughts.
 
Joeylittle, that last paragraph really does make sense, when you talk about the power imbalance. It's the thing I get stuck with in therapy. I go into it with an inherent power imbalance that I'm very comfortable with. I need help and am looking for help of someone wiser and 'older'.

Then after a while I start operating from a more adult, rational sense of myself and I begin to fear her judgement or something like that, then I really want to know what the she thinks in order to allay my fears. I asked my T this at the last session. She gave me a kindly worded answer that answered my question and her facial expressions and body language conveyed a lot of warmth and non judgment.

I'm trying to be mindful that you are feeling in a crisis mode so I won't go into too much detail. In regards to complicity and what you say about any pivotal moment. I was held against my will for 5 hours with a stranger. There was never a moment where I had any rational thoughts about what I would do next. I just surrendered to what was going on and coped with about each ten seconds as they occurred. There was no predictability that would have allowed me to somehow understand what to do. I was 32 though, not as young as you were.

As well as that, nothing in life had ever really prepared me for knowing what to do in that situation, no matter how old I was. I have about, no more than one hour of memories from the incident, all the significant parts in snapshot. Well I think so anyway. I believe everything I did was from pure instinct, there was no rational thought whatsoever, very little emotion and I was almost acting the role of someone else, in a drama of this guys direction.

I really hope that you get through this obstacle, I worry too about all the well meaning advice we all keep giving you and how it is impacting you. I hope it's not confusing you further. This will pass, I'm sure you know that intellectually. I think of you often and to say I feel for you is the understatement of the year. There aren't many people who can truly know what it is like to be in your shoes but we can be a dependable sounding board for you, with open hearts and genuine care.
 
I was held against my will for 5 hours with a stranger. There was never a moment where I had any rational thoughts about what I would do next. I just surrendered to what was going on and coped with about each ten seconds as they occurred. There was no predictability that would have allowed me to somehow understand what to do.

I'm sorry that was done to you. And don't worry; I'm not particularly triggered by anything that comes from text - but I deeply appreciate your consideration of my situation. I think, for me, probably because of my age there are sections where I was just buffeted about and had very little processing of what was going on - and then there are sections where I really thought that I had choices. I understand now that I did not, but when I was told "do this or that will happen", even when both were bad things, I believed that I was actually choosing. More than anything else, that's probably how the naivete of my age shows itself. I also had no way to imagine being rescued or let go, just because I'd never encountered a story like what was happening to me.

I guess I must have had instinct, but I would never use that word. I need to come to an understanding of how that might have been working. I followed instructions, "made" choices, was totally dominated by the violence of it, or (a few times) felt like my mind broke and completely lost control of myself. Never did anything seem like instinct.

There aren't many people who can truly know what it is like to be in your shoes but we can be a dependable sounding board for you, with open hearts and genuine care.

I appreciate this very, very deeply, and am so thankful for the thought.

Maybe his calm and centered response doesn't reflect his feelings about your trauma at all. Maybe it reflects his confidence that the 2 of you can deal with the results of your trauma. (Maybe it's something else all together. I'm a horrible mind reader!)

You know, I think you're a good mind reader. This is a really important point you've made. Much of my feeling around these events centers on despair. He would never feel despair for my situation, because he absolutely believes we can get through it. One of the things I find reassuring about him is his confidence. I have to remember that.

So why, I wonder, would I want to see him at a loss for his confident words?


Because, just like you said, he knows how I feel but I have no idea what's going on on his side. And I get the impression he totally doesn't get how that could be uncomfortable.

Yes, yes, yes, I know exactly what you mean. We have that happen with emails also. At least with those, I pretty early on was able to tell him that I wanted the emails addressed in session, and so now if I send him one we kind of go through it together.

So, we had a session today. It was rather influenced by a very long email I sent him, in which I still wasn't able to lay everything on the table because I still think my wants and feelings are wrong somehow, and I don't understand them, and I don't want to be less in control of this topic than I already am. But I was able to write to him about how shut down I was feeling, that I was questioning whether or not to keep going, and how much I'm struggling with understanding how to feel about all these events.

Things I did manage to say in session:

I perceive a power imbalance when he knows everything I'm thinking and I know nothing at all of what he thinks. He said I was always free to ask; I said not only did I not know that, I don't know how in the moment to always be that on-top of it. As the conversation went on, he started offering his feelings on things without prompting.

I don't know how to understand what happened to me, and I perceive his neutrality as information; so if he has a non-reaction, I question my own reaction as being out of scale. He responded with his own, very strong belief that a person in crisis is more damaged by the observer also slipping into crisis of their own. That his job is to be steady and practical in the face of whatever he hears from me, because that is the best way to help me. BUT: he also started validating more throughout the session, taking the time to just let me sit with the feeling as opposed to trying to knock it out right away with a different thought.

We both came to the conclusion that the piece I'm missing is simply being able to talk about what happened, not during a processing session or in the context of laying out the narrative - but just talking, freely, in whatever random order my mind is taking things. Now that I'm past the point where everything will set me off into some sort of amygdala response, there are things that I need to wrestle with that aren't about doing the trauma work, they are about facing the size of it and having a way to think about it. (Because, if you haven't noticed, I like to think about things, and reasoning is one of my actual skills: having something so big in my life that I cannot reason my way through causes great discomfort for me. I need space to talk about that. Its technically a bit more Jungian, I suppose. Whatever - just a space to talk.)

And I voiced some of my bigger anxieties: that I was too dependent, that we would never ever finish (or that I'll die before it happens, thereby disappointing him), and that he would come to resent me for basically serving as my personal crisis line.

He assured me that I err on the side of too independent, and that learning to ask for help is something I need to do; that he could be disappointed for me but never in me - and that it's more reasonable to try and work through something than give up - and that if I ever doubted that he cared, I should just remember that he is glad to be on call for me. He thinks its productive and part of the work, to sometimes process things right when they are happening.

What I learned is that I still need to be braver about asking for what I need. And I think he learned he needs to be more attuned to when I start withdrawing, and to slow down and just talk when that happens.

He told me in all sorts of ways that he is sorry for me and that the stories are horrible; but I didn't know how to believe him. That's on me. I don't understand it. And, as I asked above - I don't know why I seem to want him to demonstrate a loss of control, when a huge part of what I value in his skill set is how calm he stays in crisis. He's an excellent grounder.

What do you all think?
 
that he could be disappointed for me but never in me
What a thought! I hate it when this happens, but the mere thought of someone feeling that way actually brought tears to my eyes.

I think the whole session sounds pretty awesome and I'd like to offer a "cyber high 5".

There's so much of what you're talking about that I can relate to! (Sorry, but right this second I'd rather avoid knowing about your trauma as much as I avoid talking about my own. :bag:) But, I can SO much relate to how you're dealing with it all. Not wanting to ask for help, not thinking it was a big deal, all of that. Also the intellectual processing of things. One of the first things my T told me was that he doesn't think I have much of a connection to "feelings" at all and don't even recognize them. Except "anger". I get anger pretty well, from both sides! LOL

Actually, I'm a horrible mind reader except when there's something about the situation that I can relate to. Earlier in my life, I trained horses for a living. The way it worked out, there are a lot of horses out there that people think are "problems". I suppose I could feel a connection with them. I liked working with them, most people don't, so I did it a lot. I've found that my relationship with those horses is a lot like the relationship my T has with me. That's what my suggestion about your T's reaction was based on. There have been lots of times that a horse was having a panic attack, other people were flipping out because they thought something horrible and permanent was happening, and I was unphased because I knew it was just part of the process, we'd get through it, and things would be better as a result. Or, we'd come up with another plan. "Failure was not an option." I could just see how, if that was the way your T was processing things, it might look kind of out of synch from a different perspective.

So, you'd think I could solve my own problems, wouldn't you? LOL

@joeylittle, I can't begin to tell you how much this thread is helping me! I realized not long ago that I "wasn't asking for help" at all, in any way, and so wasn't really giving my T a chance to do his job. We had an episode a few months ago where some stuff happened, I kind of lost it, accused him of lying to me..... Things have been a little unsettled since then. About the time it occurred to me that I wasn't giving him any kind of chance at all, it also occurred to me that he might give up on me and I wouldn't blame him, he was wasting his time. Yesterday, when he asked what I "thought we ought to talk about, or not talk about", I had an answer for him. Although it was prefaced with, "Well, I don't know about "ought to"....... It's not a big deal. Maybe there's something else we "ought" to talk about." He said, "Well, just for the purpose of this discussion, let's say there's not." So, we actually talked about something. A small, discrete thing that's a problem. A PTSD related problem that has nothing directly to do with "trauma" but still, it was something. It went well, so maybe it's a start. But, this discussion has been a big help in making that one small move. So, thanks!
 
@scout86 , that's a really great breakthrough for you in therapy, well done :)

Your horses analogy makes sense to me. Mine had a problem loading, and it's sort of a metaphor for therapy, with me as my horse... "You want me to go into that new space I've never been? Well, ok, here we go - wait my head is in the new space gotta get out back up!! Back up!!!" And it was really important to remain collected. Eventually we went in.

As logical as I think I can be, I need to accept that I really don't have any way of thinking myself through this.

That's funny you can do anger and nothing else - I'm the opposite, anything but anger. I'm glad this thread has helped someone besides just me.

I'm writing him an email now to reflect back what was significant in the talk to me, and he's encouraged me to use writing as a tool between sessions to put down things I suspect I will be afraid to just bring up. If you want to do more email but having it come up in session, all you need to do is make that the last sentence of the email. You can ask your T when they read them, too - mine doesn't read mine until he's prepping for our session the day before. For some reason knowing that helps me.
 
My T has encouraged writing too, although he never gave me a reason. He wants me to email between sessions and pretty much always says, "I haven't heard from you in awhile." if I don't. Which I often don't, because I "don't want to be a bother" or "it isn't that important" etc. Often, I start an email and delete it. (I do the same thing here a lot too.) Flat out saying "maybe we should talk about this", or something to that effect is probably a good idea. But not yet. LOL I'm still not that sure what I actually WANT to talk about and kind of like having a back door to sneak out.

I never know when he reads my emails. Sometimes I get an immediate answer. Sometimes I don't get a reply at all. Once in a great while, it really matters to me that I get an answer and then I usually get one. (When I forward a wacko email from my mom and say "What am I supposed to do about THIS?!" I usually get a reply. LOL) He has ADHD and deals with it without medication. He says I have many of the same traits. Which means we're both sort of easily distracted in the moment. So we don't usually take a very linear path. I sometimes wonder, on his end, how much of that is "real" and how much of it is "technique". Yesterday, for example, we talk about something serious for a bit, then he'd use his mother's claustrophobia as an example and the next thing you know we're talking about her chocolate chip cookie recipe. LOL Which would probably be infuriating for someone with a differently organized mind. For me, it takes the pressure off for a few minutes and gives me a break and a distraction. I have a feeling he knows perfectly well what he's doing.

Yep, trailer loading is definitely "one of those issues"! I've been surprised to find out how many people on here have/like horses.
 
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