How Do You Behave In Order To Fit In?

[Dana1010]

Don't think much of that field, @Friday, but don't want to hijack thread, so will keep quiet.

 

[Friday]

Spoiler: As this no longer makes sense, as the post it was responding to was edited.

@Dana1010 that's about as accurate a statement as the field of psychology was usurped by hippies in the 70s and turned into an anti-science ideology.

Just because a fringe group uses any discipline, especially completely incorrectly & for a brief period of time, hardly negates the entire field. There are whackadoodle nut birds who use every academic discipline on the planet to support their ideologies & dogma. From Anthropology to Maths. That they usually pervert the discipline to an extent it becomes pseudoscience! Phrenology, being only one example amongst far to many to even think of coherently.

Anthropology is broken into 4 Divisions; Archeology, Biological, Cultural, & Linguistic. All 4 are science based -some harder science than others- and while Cultural Anthropology (and it's cousin, Sociology) are certain softer sciences than Biology or Chemistry? They're still sciences. Using the scientific method. By overwhelming majority, by scientists. (Not just political extremists) Who study the exact dynamic of social structure -that @EveHarrington was talking about- across thousands of cultures/sub-cultures.

((AKA I don't think it's thread-jacking to point out that there is actually a well respected scientific discipline that exists in the world -and every major university- studying & publishing on the exact topic at hand.))

Will there be wingnuts in the field? Of course. There are loonies in every academic discipline. Will there be extremists, capitalists, & lunatics who either misuse, or misinterpret the theories & data collected and presented? Of course. There are bloodsucking leaches with ill intent who use every single discipline to their own advantage. Are any of these the majority with anthropology? Nope. Just like Ad Execs may make use of psychology in order to sell shit, and hate groups may make use of medicine in order to substantiate ridiculous claims of racial superiority. But neither psychology nor medicine are dominated by either. Nor anthropology. It's a respected scientific field. With thousands of books, peer reviewed journals, & papers filling hundreds of libraries. On the ins & outs (and in-groups & out-groups) of every culture & subculture one can think of. From mountain climbers to motorcycle clubs, tribes in far off jungles to the suburban PTA.

 

[EveHarrington]

They have.

They do.

It's called Anthropology (specifically cultural anthropology), of which there ar...

Will check it out. Thanks.

 

[heyheyhey]

I personally don't necessarily think having PTSD makes it hard or impossible to fit in.... i think it's how we feel about ourselves based on our PTSD: that is the struggle. Both my badass counsellor and my good friend, who both have PTSD, are very magnetic, social and popular. I'm sociable, I love a laugh and a chat but sometimes I'm pretty mood swingy, can tend to feel bad about myself - if I am anxious and depressed then it can be hard but I deal with it by chilling out, shutting off a bit or having some alone time and then I'll come back and be chatty and have fun. I think it's also just accepting that we aren't as odd and crazy as we feel like we are - I get thoughts like "I must seem so crazy" - but I can assess the thought and know it's just anxiety - anxiety from PTSD makes you feel crazy, but that's all it is - you aren't weird or abnormal and no one is picking up on it. I always remember something from a CBT workbook that said that when anxiety feels so intense and real you are often convinced that EVERYONE must be picking up on it because of that, but it's really just a strong internal feeling that no one is really noticing or noticing anywhere near as negatively as you think they are.

You're also not defined by your PTSD, and sometimes you're just having a bad day - it doesn't mean that you can't fit in all the time. A bad day is just a bad day. everyone has one and everyone needs their own space. I also like to think that so many people, most people, have experience of anxiety and depression - so it's really not that weird. And good friends will be there for you, and if they aren't then f*ck them, on to the next. Life is harder to deal with with PTSD, but you're not any less worthy of friendship and you're not anymore defective or less able to fit in - you just need some more space or time or whatever it is.... and that's okay.

Really, you need to hang out with people you are comfortable with - who you can trust, be yourself around and who you can feel relatively safe with: all hard with PTSD, but that's why you're picky right? I also like fun people who can get my mind off of it and who I can lose myself with. Sometimes obviously you can't, but I just be warm and friendly and limit how much time I spend with them and how much sharing I do; I'm not going to spend anymore time than I have to with people who stress me out or who I can't trust - it's not a good mix for PTSD, so I just limit my time to people I feel good with as much as possible.

I don't think I'm like some oddball weirdo coz I have PTSD, my friends love me for who I am and people appreciate me for who I am, I'm not defined by my PTSD - though it can really f*ck with my self-esteem and make me feel anxious and depressed - I can just notice that and give myself what I need and take space from people and know that I am more than that.

 

[aut555]

I personally don't necessarily think having PTSD makes it hard or impossible to fit in.... i think it...

Yes. Yes, and finally yes. I am abnormally normal according to this and so is everyone else. :)

 

[anthony]

I am looking for specific ways to act so that I can fit in and actually start making friends do that I'm not alone for the rest of my life.

As you don't want, be yourself, style answers... then you can makeup anything you want based on your request here, because what you're asking for is how to pretend to be someone else.

I'm not sure what you think is more deceptive and dangerous - who you are or trying to fake being someone you're not?

Friends, being what you are looking to engage here -- come in all flavours. You have a forum of people, some of which are just as screwed up as you, and others not as screwed up as you, and others screwed up way worse than you -- who are all in common and being themselves.

Friendships whilst being screwed up still happen. Maybe the question is... where are the right places to look for friends?

 

[Friday]

I think I need to clarify.

Fitting in means that you are an accepted and welcomed and valued person in a group.

I meant to hit on this earlier, but got distracted by sociocultural standards of behavior. :P

I think your definition of "fitting in" here, is hugely important. In no small part, because that's nowhere near my definition of "fitting in". Accepted AND welcomed AND valued? That's a helluva trifecta.

Yes, we're talking about normal everyday adult fitting in

And it reads nowhere near such a commonplace-everyday sort of thing. Nor easy. For anyone. If you think most people have that, everywhere they go, every day, you're wrong. Its not something everyone else has and you don't. And no wonder you never feel like you fit in! Really. It's a lot more like the standards one holds a marriage to. As in, not something one can expect to find in most people/places, nor at most times in their lives.

The shorthand for those 3 items together, to my mind, would be respect. On the side of respected-loved, instead of on the side of respected-feared.

I suspect you might find more traction, in what you're looking for, in researching that. Not "how does one fit in?". Both the individual items on your trifecta as well as; how does one become respected? The caveat on respected, is welcomed. Respect tends to set people apart a bit. Whether they're loved and respected, but especially if they're feared and respected. It's a very rare thing for someone who commands respect from an entire group, to also be 'one of the guys'. Which is a big part of why that trifecta of accepted-welcomed-valued blows me away. This is no small goal. It's a hugely worthy one, and more power to you, good on for wanting it and working towards it. But you're also downplaying it like crazy, and I think, until you give it the weight it deserves, it will continue to elude you.

 

[Ladyghosthunter]

I just left a forum that I really liked because I was different. Apparently they don't understand that with PTSD...you have ups and downs like depression and at times, you go overboard and, anyway, one of the moderators told me I really didn't belong because I was inaccurate in some of my postings and well, that triggered me terribly. I felt as if I wanted to tell this b**ch that her forum moderation was substandard but I took the highroad and left. I deleted my postings and everything because, when you don't belong, you leave. I feel like crying right now as it is a trigger for me. I had some laughs there but now, I'm crying. I'm sad to leave but I'll ending up "sucking it up" because that's what I'm supposed to do, right?
I guess so.

 

[EveHarrington]

As you don't want, be yourself, style answers... then you can makeup anything you want based on your reques...

I think I was unclear----oops! I apologize.

I actually meant I didn't want "JUST be yourself" sort of answers that didn't go any further as being myself isn't necessarily the problem, rather I struggle with mastering social cues and social interactions. I am sorry I wasn't clear. I don't want to be a fake person in the least. I mean for example-----sometimes I know I can be too intense and energy filled, and that makes some people shy away. I've learned to tone it down over time and behave in a way that doesn't overwhelm others. I'm not being untrue to myself or fake, just toned down, lol. I guess this sort of thing is what I meant.

I know I write vague posts. My problem is that I tend to post when I'm upset and when I'm upset I am not so verbose. I know it's something I need to work on.

 

[anthony]

sometimes I know I can be too intense and energy filled, and that makes some people shy away. I've learned to tone it down over time and behave in a way that doesn't overwhelm others.

Based on this, then you're doing just fine. If you have identified a social cue problem with yourself, and have addressed it, then honestly... it shouldn't be an issue that stops you being yourself.

I think the issue may lay simply in you not finding the right group to choose from for friends. That can be a little more tricky. Certainly time consuming, as it takes experimentation into different things wayyyy outside your normal routine, testing to see where you fit well with others, doing nothing other than being yourself.

Me personally... I often just make fun of my own PTSD at times, as it becomes a social ice breaker. Not something I normally do, but I have do it, and I keep it in my arsenal for use, especially if I get quiet and I am making something uncomfortable. Sometimes... the best way to talk about an elephant in the room is with humour. If we can't make fun of ourselves, well... the world becomes a boring place.

 

[Mach123]

I was for the most of my life, unable to do anything about this. I was constantly getting triggered/triggering myself and responding. My behavior was "episodic". I would feel it coming on and be unable to control it. (Did you ever buy something and get the overwhelming, out of control feeling that you had to return it? lol Did you do it over and over? This is just one example) I know now those feelings are not real and I don't respond, not as much anyway.

Understanding this on some level and trying to hide it/control it I could never function in a group and always failed miserably. Getting to see that this was going on with me through years and years of hard experience I understood with complete conviction I was completely trapped and was never going to be able to do anything about it. In other words I knew the situation was irrelevant. I was trapped in myself. The same thing was going to happen every time. I was right.

Things did change finally however through an unlooked for chain of events. I have not tried any new "group" situations and have no plans at least for the time being to do so. The changes I've achieved are evident in the people around me, by their reactions and the way they treat me. I have ventured out slightly, after a long period of what I'd call "convalescence" and I am actively involved in my "getting better."

Now I know how to act or rather I don't act the way I used to. I was hiding something, that was what was wrong. Even from myself, I was hiding something. I was so afraid someone would see, you know? So afraid someone would see me. Now, I'm not hiding as much and a little at a time I act like myself, like I am. It's the abuse that made me like that. There was a real pattern in my behavior and I couldn't deviate from it. Now it is so much easier because on some important level, I know I didn't do anything wrong.

 

[heyheyhey]

As you don't want, be yourself, style answers... then you can makeup anything you want based on your reques...

Love this Anthony :).

Also, don't sometimes screwed up people have more to offer? Empathy, compassion, understanding, depth, intensity? As well as what is rough and messy? Isn't it sometimes one in the same?

And sorry Eve if my post came across 'be yourselfy', I think that's more me just rallying against the PTSD feelings of not being 'normal' or mostly worrying that i am seeming strange and 'crazy' when I am feeling very panicky... It's my way of telling those feelings to f*ck off. It can definitely be hard not to feel that way sometimes :).