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Poll Your Children And Your Abuser

Have you allowed your child/children to be around your abuser?


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    19
  • Poll closed .
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Sexual offenders cannot be cured, and all the parenting skills in the world cannot cure that.

It is actually true there is no place on the planet that claims to have a cure for sex offenders.

Adequate and sensitive parenting skills are the key factor in many sex offenders choice of the next child to groom. All the parenting skills in the world actually means the sex offender won't try and groom that child. They will, at times, admit that in conversations.

So I have to disagree with you on the parenting skills not being able to stop child sex abuse. (Unless they are the actual sex offender.) Then what you are saying is, unfortunately, correct.
 
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That is why general parenting needs to be addressed. Keeping a child around a known predator has nothing to do with building a healthy bond with her/his parent or with them getting self confidence and good boundaries as well as assertiveness skills. It also won't take away the mental health issues and personality disorders of the parents of these children which is part of what is responsible for their parental deficits in the first place.

But there is no safe bubble in Australia that you can take your children to that is sexual predator free. You might no know someone is a sexual predator but they still are there. So cutting off from one in your family doesn't help you in all the other spheres of you and your child's life.

How would that have happened Ms Spock? If your father was typical predator then he certainly wasn't going to volunteer.

It depends on the country and what programs are in place. If going into treatment is an option rather than incarceration. That can be incentive. If the family withdraws until treatment commences then that can be incentive.


How can anyone really make sure supervision happens all the time.

It is just like being able to make sure a baby doesn't drown in shallow water or fall off a bed. You are mindful of what you are doing.

In Australia there are contact centres where supervision happens under the watchful eyes of psychologist.

The parents bring another two adults for each child. The child has the parents watching them as well as the other two adults.

The more people continue to be around them without the truth being addressed and as if they are not dangerous the more the message to others is that they don't need to be careful.

The point is the monitoring by family, friends and staff that the truth is addressed.

I have seen the opposite happen over and over gain. The sexual abuse occurs. The eldest in the family discloses. No one wants a sex offender in their family. So the one who disclosed loses everything - family, school, church, social activities. Then everyone goes on as if they don't need to be careful

I must not have communicated clearly. If a child was to be around a mother's or father's sexual abuse well of course the truth would have to be addressed. I am not saying any type of secret keeping would go on. Once this is addressed and monitored word gets out and the monitoring can go on in a range of social networks.

What happens now is some people go back and hope that things will be better for their child. This type of denial keeps the cycle of abuse going on. So when informed, mindful and thoughtful people go back - with plans and strategies. The first link in the change of intergenerational sexual abuse is broken.

Then as there are no ongoing strategies around child protection people just go on hoping for the best. If a survivor and his or her child has contact with the perpetrator then every thing has to be discussed and on the table - which doesn't happen if the survivor stays away. If a man or woman is monitoried for their sexual predator ways - then everyone is involved. There is no secret keeping.

I believe in treating all perpetrators with humanity and attempting rehabilitation but I cannot see how planning to put a 2 year old around a known paedophile and thinking you can teach them to protect themselves can ever be wise and ever be anything other than plain dangerous.

One thing is age appropriate discussions and at age 2 you would talk about safe feelings and icky feelings depending on the child. And of course I don't mean a 2 year old would learn the skills to protect themselves. This is why the whole family and community need to be involved.

All parents should be building good relationships with their children and making sure they have good assertiveness skills but there are a lot who don't. Assertiveness skills and self esteem help but not enough to protect people in many cases.

It seems to me that I must not be explaining the concept of supervised access. You build in safety Plan B's for unscheduled accidents of situations. The child is simple not left alone with the offender. And assertiveness skills particularly when encouraged in children means the sexual offender won't bother with this as child who has a parent with assertiveness and good self esteem will communicate very quickly any distress. Being undetected is paramount. So a good parent who has a healthy attachment with their child - they simple won't bother. Particularly when each member of the family and friends are watching.

This is not like playing Russian roulette. There are strategies and programs worked out surrounding all this.

There will be dangers where we don't expect them but I cannot see how choosing to put danger in your house is ever the answer to that problem.

But everywhere else that danger is there. So perhaps it is best to learn to manage it and learn the skills to identify grooming behaviours so you not only protect your child in this situation but in all the arenas of life as the sexual predators are everywhere.
 
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No guarantees that all the skills courses in the world will stop the offender. Maybe from his own. Maybe not from others, as you know. And we are off the main question here, as to whether you would put your child in the presence of your own abuser. For me the answer would be a resounding no.
 
Even people I know who home schooled their kids - had one afternoon where the kids went with some other adults. This was the time that they were sexually abused. What concerned me was why didn't the parents notice the change in the children? Where was the bonding that mean the kids could come home and say straight off - this happened? Given that the kids might not be aware of the grooming - but when something more happened?
 
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No guarantees that all the skills courses in the world will stop the offender. Maybe from his own. Maybe not from others, as you know. And we are off the main question here, as to whether you would put your child in the presence of your own abuser. For me the answer would be a resounding no.

I respect that.
 
Ms Spock. I don't think a single person would not agree that it is helpful to teach children assertiveness and self protection and to try to build healthy family environments. That doing so will help in some situations.

What I don't agree with is that the dangerous act of purposely putting a known perpetrator in contact with a child in way does that. The two are separate issues.

The best way to protect children in the wider world is good parenting and keeping them away from as much known harm as is possible whilst still giving them freedom to grow.
 
Solara said: ↑ "Sorry daughter Susie, I know that my father raped me as a child but I couldn't make waves and upset the family so I decided that it was ok for you to be around your grandfather and that is why you, too, were raped as a child" There has been no discussion on allowing this type of situation to occur. That is a bit of a straw man argument. What is being talked about is supervised access and monitoring along with age appropriate protective behaviours.
I disagree. The thread question is "Have you allowed your child/children to be around your abuser?" The thread topic is not about supervised access, or monitoring or planning for unknown sex abusers who prowl society. The poll /thread is quite clear.

I understand that thread content changes as posts progress, but as other issues arise, it makes more sense to start a thread for that discussion, in the appropriate forum, rather than take a thread completely off point.
 
I am struggling to truly believe that the only thing that keeps people from denying that they have a paedophile in the family is thinking paedophiles are monsters. It seems to me more often about people splitting and not being able to hold the good and bad in their minds at the same time. Something we all do with abusers to some extent.


This seems to actually enable the abusers to continue to get access and groom children.

As you often do Abstract you just nail teasing out the issues.
 
How would that have happened Ms Spock? If your father was typical predator then he certainly wasn't going to volunteer. I imagine most would need a court order. In order to get a court order then someone would have to be willing to support the child and listen to them. Someone in your family could have insisted on your father having counseling and done supervised contact but they weren't able to. Because of their own issues they were not able to think that way and would be very unlikely to be the type of responsible parents one would need to have to ensure supervision happened all the time. How can anyone really make sure supervision happens all the time.

My father is not a typical predator. My father was psychotically violent. I am on the extreme end of the child abuse spectrum. And you have a fair point.

I know what you are saying but people make sure there is supervision all the time at the beach so a child doesn't drown - this wouldn't be turning up out of the blue to have contact in a social situation. It would be openly discussed with the whole/family. It would be mapped out.

The more people continue to be around them without the truth being addressed and as if they are not dangerous the more the message to others is that they don't need to be careful.

And at 15 I went to tell everyone in my extended family about the sexual abuse. And I was wiped by the family and it has meant people have got that message they they don't need to be careful. That seems to be standard fare for sexual abuse people in the circles I have mixed in for a couple of decades now.

I am talking about a very different scenario where everyone would be told - all family members, friends, neighbours and so forth. There would be no secret keeping. There would be no alibis given.


I believe in treating all perpetrators with humanity and attempting rehabilitation but I cannot see how planning to put a 2 year old around a known paedophile and thinking you can teach them to protect themselves can ever be wise and ever be anything other than plain dangerous.

Like pools, cars and other dangerous situations - a two year old would not be expected to learn or take care of themselves. That is the parents responsibility.

You have well thought out points and scenarios. I might start another thread to run some of my ideas past you.

We have four generations of sexual abuse in my family that I have been told about. The ways of doing things have not worked. So I am thinking that we have to be imaginative and be more honest and more accountable.

It was one thing to live through such serious emotional, mental and physical abuse but on top of that to lose your family has left me totally flattened. It is where Combat PTSD people don't understand you have no prior person to return to - they chose to be in a war zone and choose in the military but I didn't chose to be violated so comprehensively and continuously from being a very little person.

Anyway we will just have to agree to disagree.

And for most people if they did have the sexual predator around without real preparation then all that you say is spot on. I am talking about another scenario completely.
 
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