Other Autist

[No More]

I really think this is something that would be super good to take to your psychologist/psychiatrist.
There’s such a massive overlap in symptoms from different disorders, I may be remembering wrong but I believe you may have asked about the possibility of TBI recently, which could also explain a number of your symptoms.

Im not urging you go take this to a professional because I want to invalidate your thoughts, much the opposite. Because all of those disorders are going to have really really different treatment plans. It’s like trying to use a hammer when you need a drill. You won’t be getting the most effective treatment until you get a good, correct diagnosis/‘s. Then you can work on solutions that work for /that/ diagnosis, and sort out the best coping mechanisms for each symptom depending on what they are attributed to. I don’t believe a GP that’s met someone once a year for 10 minutes can diagnose this stuff. If you have a long term professional that knows you well - take it to them.

 

[alt]

Because maybe it isn't autism, and maybe it is something you can be treated for that will help. Even if it is autism, maybe someone who has worked in a professional/expert capacity can share things they have learned--both in their studies and from other clients--that might help with some of your symptoms (every one of which, incidentally, I've had and I do not have autism).

But... I have had this all my life. I live with it. Why would anyone help me with it. Oh, wait, do you all think I won't go back to the doctor at all? I will. I am going there to ask about TBI and a few other things. I want help. The brain fog is debilitating.

I just don't want to talk to them about the suspected autism. I see NO reason to. There is no treatment.

But what if--just hear me out here-what if it isn't autism? Or, what if there is someone who might actually know more than you do about autism that can share things with you that might help?

Sure. But if it isn't autism, then the screenings by the medical professionals might find out. And I can still have my suspected autism as my own diagnosis, without telling them. It probably would only make it LESS likely that I'd get the right diagnosis, if I told them about my autism suspicions. They might be so fed up with me, they'd give it to me. I want them to check for other things.

Oh, I totally get this! I lack trust in anyone claiming to be a "professional." I have more trauma from professionals than I do from my childhood. But I'm still gonna go to a cardiologist for issues that *could* be my heart instead of rejoicing that I diagnosed myself with something else by reading scientific articles and talked with others who had similar issues. I'm going to do all of that, BUT I'm also going to go to the doctor and present my symptoms and my findings. If I don't, I run the risk at some point of dropping dead from a heart attack.

Of course, because that is different from my situation. To go to the doctor and say "I think I am an autist" doesn't help me. It would possibly even divert the doctor...

This statement alone points to issues beyond what one person can deal with. Oh, I get it. I self-diagnosed a condition I ended up needing brain surgery for because no one would listen to me. But I took my findings to a doctor that finally did hear me and did further testing. We know ourselves the best, but we DON'T have the training or experience with clients/patients to always make the appropriate changes that will improve our health.

Oh, that isn't what I meant. I have ALREADY been screened 3 times for bipolar. I have grown up knowing many of the bipolar patients of my mother, who is an expert on bipolar disorder. The GP made a mistake, that he has apologized for. He should have read the psychology reports before coming up with suggestions. I forgive him. He is quite young, and tried to help me, but he is grasping, due to not knowing why I have this damn brain fog. I really want him to help me, and then I don't want him to get diverted by bipolar suggestions, when I know I don't have it. I don't know it because I think I'm better, I know it cause I have 3 screenings behind me BY EXPERTS, saying I don't have it. I also don't want him to be derailed by my autism suspicions. I want him to focus directly on the problem and find out what causes it. In the meantime, I'll focus on the autism suspicion on my own. I REALLY don't get why I need a professional diagnosis for this one.

 

[alt]

I really think this is something that would be super good to take to your psychologist/psychiatrist.
There’s such a massive overlap in symptoms from different disorders, I may be remembering wrong but I believe you may have asked about the possibility of TBI recently, which could also explain a number of your symptoms.

Im not urging you go take this to a professional because I want to invalidate your thoughts, much the opposite. Because all of those disorders are going to have really really different treatment plans. It’s like trying to use a hammer when you need a drill. You won’t be getting the most effective treatment until you get a good, correct diagnosis/‘s. Then you can work on solutions that work for /that/ diagnosis, and sort out the best coping mechanisms for each symptom depending on what they are attributed to. I don’t believe a GP that’s met someone once a year for 10 minutes can diagnose this stuff. If you have a long term professional that knows you well - take it to them.

Oh, of course I will go to the GP with my brain fog. I have been in and out of different doctor's offices for this problem since 2017.

I just don't want to go there and say "I think I am an autist". I feel that would just derail the focus on my brain fog.

 

[alt]

If you don’t feel you need a diagnosis then why diagnose yourself? I don’t feel I need a diagnosis and I haven’t diagnosed myself, I believe I have cptsd symptoms but I never say I have it. Because I know I can’t diagnose myself.

I do need a diagnosis, for my brain fog. Or , rather, I don't need a diagnosis, I need someone to find a way to fix it. I am tired of it.
I however, do NOT need to know if I am an autist or not....

I wonder what is making you feel so strongly about this? Yet so strongly not to get it confirmed? sounds like you could afford to pay for someone you picked and trusted to assess you.

I felt happy about realizing I might be an autist because it makes sense. So many of my inner experiences with people, hurt over being misunderstood all the time, fears of being labeled a psychopath due to people not seeing my emotions, wondering how people's facades and judgements seem so different from mine. Feeling like an alien since I was a child, being hyper sensitive, yet be treated as if I have no feelings, etc. etc. etc.

I don't need a diagnosis, as I really think it will divert the doctors, more than help me.

if it helps to put a framework around you to help you understand yourself, I get that as a possibility. But to be so sure, that is the issue everything is highlighting here as a worry.

A worry? Really? Was that what people expressed? I sort of expected curiosity when I made my first post, instead I got nothing like that. This is what I talk of, such incidents of being misunderstood, just make sense if I'm an autist. I have totally different ways of thinking than others. I obviously wouldn't rule out bipolar if I thought there was the slightest possibility that was what caused my brain fog. And I obviously wouldn't keep my autism a secret from my doctor if I thought it could help him find out what's wrong with my brain. I thus WILL mention the TBI possibility to him, but I don't want to mention the autism possibility.

 

[No More]

I just don't want to go there and say "I think I am an autist". I feel that would just derail the focus on my brain fog.

Ah, I’m sorry I must have misread. I am pleased to hear you are planning on going back & trying to get some answers and solutions!

Just so I’m sure I understand what your getting at - are you saying if you mention autism to your doctor, they will seize on that and absolutely attribute your brain fog to that, rather than taking the time to investigate if it could be due to TBI/ another reason?

If that’s the case then I would agree the best thing to do is to give them all your symptoms/problems and let them run the testing that needs to be done. Hopefully they’d consider that neurodivergence naturally as part of that.

 

[Weemie]

I just thought you were trying to bully me. I read your words as slurs, meant to put me down, meant to make you look superior,

3. Do you think I should take your post seriously in any way?

Thanks for the mansplaining.... ;-p

I think you calling her an asshole and a bully (and assuming her gender, and saying shit like "consider for a moment the following questions, and for your own sake, please really think about this and do some internal work on yourself: should I even take you seriously?") for simply recommending you gain a legitimate diagnosis after describing symptoms of bipolar disorder absolutely comes across as you attempting to act superior, not @Sideways.

Actually - it’s nothing like that at all. I don’t doubt that it feels great to finally have ‘an answer’ or a community of sorts that you feel like you fit in with. It’s more like saying “You don’t need a diagnosis to just know you’re the same as someone with a ruptured ACL”. You very much need a diagnosis - because the overlap with other conditions is huge.

The fact that you’ve managed to persuade yourself so convincingly is concerning. It’s definitely going to hamper actual diagnosis and treatment. But if you have a pre-existing Bipolar diagnosis? It’s time to get back to your doc to get your meds sorted out.

This was her opening post. There was absolutely nothing in there that warranted your response - there were no slurs, no assumptions, there was no insults or put-downs. It was you lashing out because you felt unable to entertain the possibility for five seconds that how you come off? Is actually consistent with bipolar mania. Which is why - in a feat of what I can only assume as astonishing patience - instead of stating you have bipolar, Sideways told you that you should seek a proper diagnosis and clarify your actual diagnosis.

Since bipolar can be treated with medication and autism cannot. Because again, the overlaps in these conditions are significant.

I obviously wouldn't rule out bipolar if I thought there was the slightest possibility that was what caused my brain fog.

Also, brain fog can be a symptom of literally every single diagnosis you've already mentioned you have - literally including bipolar disorder, so it's weird that this is the reason why you're ruling it out.

A worry? Really? Was that what people expressed? I sort of expected curiosity when I made my first post

I'm also not sure why you'd expect different if you're proclaiming that you are 100% autistic, don't need a diagnosis, know better than your absolute myriad of health professionals across the board, are attributing symptoms that actually have little to do with ruling out autism vs another disorder, lashing out at members who recommend assessment, etc etc etc.

And I do get it. I've studied psychology and neurology for over 16 years and even taught a course on Introduction to Clinical Neurology, so very often when I go to the doctor I'm on an even playing field - but that's exactly why I understand how important assessments and evaluations are. I think condemning people for what honestly comes across as, "having the audacity" to suggest that you could be wrong, comes off as superior.

I understand that you've had multiple assessments for bipolar disorder by experts in the disorder who stated you don't have it, and that your GP is not qualified to actually make that diagnosis - but this is not information that you shared in your opening post, so it looks like you are being unnecessarily hostile to people who are wondering about the potential impacts on your displayed symptoms of bipolar disorder.

(And you cannot deny that even having three assessments? Means that they also saw the possibility, and that possibility was significant enough to test you three times.)

I thus WILL mention the TBI possibility to him, but I don't want to mention the autism possibility.

And finally: you should seriously consider how this will actually impact your care going forward, because the care of someone who has autism + PTSD, or autism + TBI, or even autism + bipolar disorder, is going to look incredibly different from someone who is neurotypical as folks with autism express these comorbidities in different ways to people who are neurotypical. If you actually do have autism, it 100% could mean that you fail to receive a correct diagnosis of other issues.

That all being said, you're well within your rights to again - suspect that this is a disorder you have. Just like I suspect I have ASPD treated through years of therapy and self-reflection. It is not the same as saying you have it, because you are not diagnosed with it, but if that distinction doesn't bother you? (As it does not bother me.) There's plenty of reasons why you should confirm it, if you can, but as a patient you have the right to direct your own medical care.

 

[Movingforward10]

I do need a diagnosis, for my brain fog.

I don't need a diagnosis, as I really think it will divert the doctors, more than help me.

Highlighting those two things. Because I wonder if there are various things going on for you which are highlighting both your need for a diagnosis to help with the brain fog and the need for no diagnosis for other symptoms.

If the label autism suits you, fine. If you resonate with it and it makes sense for you. Fine. I feel like that with cptsd. But we can't diagnose ourselves, so what I think people are highlighting is you being open to other things. But , it's your life and you get to decide how you feel. I just wonder what you wanted from this thread as the responses are and the exchanges are coming across as unproductive.

I don't know when the brain fog started, but peri menopause could also be something to throw into the mix.

 

[Tinyflame]

Hello, much has been said in these posts, but will add only one small note.

From what you described @lillesnille you are 2e , or feel you are (gifted and neurotypical). There are a lot of resources for 2e individuals.

But what stands out to me is very basic; within the neurodivergent -or medical- community, one is not encouraged to identify themselves as their condition: one would have autism, not be autistic. Moe than semantics, it indicates the world of difference(s) between people. And as enticing as something can be to identify with, especially to bring order in to one's life, that does not make it necessarily accurate, or mutually exclusive to the presence of other disorders or conditions. Especially factoring in the potential relevance of selective processicng, or even denial (denial being a form of self-protection, and is not objective or based on intellect), just to name a couple of obvious things (not suggesting they apply, but they can). If it were me, I'd ask myself why a response bothered (me) so much. Because it's just a response, and a (respectful) attempt to help.

Some of what has been mentioned is very disturbing- your mother teaching you to fake empathy (it can be taught)l a dr talking about the risk of amphetamine addiction relative to ADHD (i am pre-assuming?; this is rarely seen if actually a necessary prescription, and has the opposite effect if titrated properly).

As I am sure you are aware, brain fog (a poorly defined term) more frequently has a physiological basis: peri (and post) menopause; sleep disturbances and apnea; compromised immuno-function; compromised cardio-vascular function; anemia and food intolerances; G.I., including but in no way limited to Celiac disease, even infections, and on and on the list goes. Including a very long spread many a time before cognitive disorders like Alzheimer's disease are at a diagnosable level. And there's a host of genetic conditions and differences the medical community is only beginning to define. It can also be a product of stress (a HUGE factor) and distraction, and definitely a bi-product of emotional upheaval, emotional blows, +/or the necessity for great emotional regulation, a terrible energy vampire. Even trauma mimics ADHD. I seem to recall you posting a thread many years ago about sleep issues, in which you said your dr recommended more exercise vs medication?

I think it would be wise to trust your doctors' expertise or if you don't, find a new doctor. Because their expertise (as with many of the people here) is not lesser-than because they may not have a 180 I.Q., nor is much that is nuanced available through research, it has been learned experentially. For example, I know very little, and yet I know the #1 sign of a heart attack or stroke is denying you are having one. The advice of chewing aspirin is great, except one's mouth will go so dry it's virtually impossible to swallow. Or with stroke, visual disturbances (I don't mean floaters, I mean, "Who filled the room with balloons?") Not what research will state any of that 1st and foremost. but many Drs and providers are aware of the nuances, both between conditions and as per symptom constellation.

I hope you will find relief and be open-minded as you do so. I mean that truthfully, I hope you find useful help.

You weren’t worth the emotional energy that I invested in replying to your post. Every time I get abused by a member for offering a compassionate response, makes me that much less likely to stick my neck out to do it again for the next person.

^^ I understand and would feel the same. But I hope you keep reaching out as many of us greatly value your opinion. And as per all people, the adage take what you like and leave the rest seems relevant. One is very fortunate if others take the time and effort to try to help. It is not mandated, and definitely priceless. When we agree or disagree with the response, we can examine as best we can truthfully why.

 

[alt]

Someone who will actually sit down and listen to you, to your findings, to your history, who is willing to do a real assessment and not just brush you off.

I don't need anyone to listen to me or my story.... I don't need therapy for it, at least not now.

I go to the GP with my brain fog, but will not tell him about the autism suspicions. I want him to focus on fixing the brain fog, not get diverted by all sort of other things. The brain fog must still be treated somehow, cause I cannot go on like this.

It seems like whatever my brain works like, it doesn't communicate effectively with whatever most people's brains are like, and vice versa.

With this thread, I hoped for advice on whether or not I should get a diagnosis, not for the sake of my health or because of maybe having other diagnosis. That is taken care of already. But because of the bias that people have. Most people think of autism as a lack of something, like a disadvantage. But most autists, seem to think that it is just a different way of being, like aliens and humans. There will be a lack of understanding, because communication is different, and the in-between-lines are different. For non-autists, the autists are the aliens. For autists, the non-autists are the aliens.

I loved the rest of your post. You have been through quite the journey, and you understand the frustration that comes with not being understood. I, however, get a "normal" pass. I am seen as smart, fun loving and successful.... Until I met my psychopath - the guy who traumatized me in 2013, I had had 18 years of marriage in a undramatic relationship. I have kids who do well in school, I have a nice place to live and I'm a director in an international corporation. I don't think anyone would know I struggle so much as I do. I don't look sick. Thus why some of the people I met think I am not. My issue is that I don't want to look weak, so I soldier on. I should probably take a break, have a sick leave. Relax. I'm about to burn out. The issue isn't my mood, but the damn brain fog. I spend my days looking like a socialite at work, taking care of everybody I work with, I come home and crash, as it takes so damn much will to push through the brain fog and seem like a smart person in meetings...

One other thing I'll mention is that learning to unmask takes time! Most people who know me personally (and I've been a member of this forum for about eight years, give or take, and I was around when we had live chat as well, heh) do not believe that I lack empathy. (I am also a very self-centered person, which I apologize for - it truly isn't intentional, I just have a very egocentric view of the world, much like a child. But that's why most of this has just been about MEEE.)

I didn't feel like you were egocentric at all!
1. I felt like you told a story that you know very well, and that I can draw information from, if I want. To me it seemed you did it out of care and interest (?)
2. You also seemed to spend a lot of attention to style and not hurting me. It was nice. You don't have to be that careful, but I feel I got to know you, it felt respectful, what you wrote.
3. You opened up to me, I interpreted that as you giving me trust, trying to reach me, caring to do that for me, and at the same time,
4. I could compare your experiences with my own experiences.
This is more than I get from most people, who don't seem to like this way of processing information. I just did the same in my answer to you above, and I don't see myself as egocentric at all. I realize others might see me that way, as I know how to mask this, and ask questions instead, but to be honest, I find it more rude to ask questions than to talk of myself.... I see myself as giving back what you gave, and I liked the exchange with you. Maybe that is childlike? But doesn't it seems to be both more authentic and more reliable than most information given online?
I saw care in your words, but you say you have no empathy? Are you sure you didn't care?

This isn't because they're invalidating me, it's because my mask has been welded to my noggin since I was 17. I would read articles online about how doctors approach bereavement and bedside manner in order to replicate sympathy efficiently. I don't want to say it was a lie, because my motivations for doing this were genuine - I wanted to be well-liked, I wanted to make people feel good and not bad, and I did not want to come across as callous and insensitive. (This is why I say my empathy isn't absent, it's just different - I wouldn't have these prosocial desires if I completely lacked all affective empathy).

oh, haha, yes, that. See. I think we have a similar way of processing this. Let me know what you think (based on what I wrote above)

Learning to present myself as I am, which is relatively neutral, limited emotional expression, etc, has taken time. It's so ingrained in me to rely on these masking behaviors that I often do them without thinking. You will most likely run into these issues as well, and you may encounter those who do not understand why your behaviors are suddenly changing. For me, the desire to unmask came with the realization that as long as I am not harming anyone, there is nothing wrong with my natural affect. It may make people uncomfortable to encounter a dude speaking in a monotone with no facial expressions, but that isn't actually hurting them - it's OK for me to be as I am.

This what you write here, is actually why I was so excited yesterday. Not so much the possible autism diagnosis, but realizing this what you just said.

 

[Weemie]

I saw care in your words, but you say you have no empathy? Are you sure you didn't care?

I have some empathy, it's just not the same as other people's. I have no emotions about you specifically at all. My desire to ensure I do not cause harm is based on my logical understanding of the importance in being compassionate and fostering connections and relationships with others as that is beneficial both for me and for them.

I want him to focus on fixing the brain fog, not get diverted by all sort of other things. The brain fog must still be treated somehow, cause I cannot go on like this.

As I mentioned in my second post (which undoubtedly came across much firmer than the first as it seemed you were being unnecessarily harsh on quite a few members here - but which was not based in dislike or contempt whatsoever as those are emotions I very rarely experience) I do believe this may be a hindrance to your receiving adequate care - neurodivergence interacts with all of these issues differently.

If autism is a possibility it's probable you won't be properly diagnosed with what is actually causing these problems, either. It's also something that can actually be a symptom of autism - but this would depend on whether you've had this for a long time or is impacted by environmental factors. For example the intersection in autism + PTSD could be causing your brain to be sensory overwhelmed which is why you may notice a sharp uptick of symptoms like brain fog even if you weren't born experiencing the world that way.

Most people think of autism as a lack of something, like a disadvantage. But most autists, seem to think that it is just a different way of being, like aliens and humans.

I consider neurodivergence to be just that, divergent. But I can see that your way of relating and socializing is impacted by whatever it may be, and it's important to recognize how being neurodivergent intersects in interactions with neurotypical (or non-autistic) people.

This is undoubtedly why you've experienced misunderstanding on this thread alone - so while there is nothing wrong with being the way you are, there are actually occupational based skills you can learn that are targeted at making life with autism easier. There is actually treatment that can help.

3. You opened up to me, I interpreted that as you giving me trust, trying to reach me, caring to do that for me, and at the same time,

I'm pleased that you were able to gain benefit from my post. For me I have very little issue sharing about myself as I do not typically experience vulnerability with these issues and I am open about them as a way to prevent harm and remain honest. Trust isn't a factor as I do not experience the emotion of trust at all, I consider trust entirely a probability of how another person is most likely to behave.

Not so much the possible autism diagnosis, but realizing this what you just said.

And this is still very important. Self-acceptance of how you are regardless of label - as you'll be that way whether you're diagnosed or not. That much is absolutely true.

 

[alt]

Highlighting those two things. Because I wonder if there are various things going on for you which are highlighting both your need for a diagnosis to help with the brain fog and the need for no diagnosis for other symptoms.

Yes, correct. I have a PTSD (diagnosed) from 2014, and I have the brain fog (starting in 2017) and I believe the autism just helps me understand inner experiences, and has no influence on either of the two others, but that, now that I get it, will help me. It doesn't really matter if it is autism-related or high intellect-related or whatever. The point is that I understood it, through the autism framework, and it doesn't matter more than that. I already doubt the diagnosis, as Friday gave me some things to think about, but the realization I was happy about getting, is still valid.

If the label autism suits you, fine. If you resonate with it and it makes sense for you. Fine. I feel like that with cptsd. But we can't diagnose ourselves, so what I think people are highlighting is you being open to other things. But , it's your life and you get to decide how you feel. I just wonder what you wanted from this thread as the responses are and the exchanges are coming across as unproductive.

i am open for anything. But I had 3 screenings by psychologists/psychiatrists since the onset of my PTSD. They found NO bipolar signs. It is one of the diagnoses they ruled out. Thus it is so tiresome when my GP and people here don't believe me when I say I don't have bipolar, cuz .. it is a waste of time to go down that road again. It isn't that. I need to find the answer, not to go in circles. I know you all didn't have all information, thus why I hoped you'd just accept the "I don't have bipolar" statement. It isn't coming out of nowhere. Instead I feel I have to waste time on, again, explaining why it isn't that. You siding with the GP when you don't even know my story is a bit concerning, too, to me, but maybe there are people here who refuse medical feedback and

I don't know when the brain fog started, but peri menopause could also be something to throw into the mix.

Yes, I have asked the doctor for that, too, but he didn't think that is it. I am not convinced and 2 days ago I asked for an expert opinion on this and some other things. It will be followed up.

You have a high IQ I’m assuming diagnosed by someone? How is it that the person didn’t flag you as autistic then? Especially as you say you aren’t mild.

I was tested by Mensa when they visited my university back when I was a student. The test only measured to IQ 160, but I finished it in less than half the time we could use (I think we could use 20 minutes on the test, and I finished in 10). The test results were then reviewed by some sort of expert, possibly a psychologist. He was the one that said he thought I have IQ 180 more or less.

 

[Weemie]

You have been through quite the journey, and you understand the frustration that comes with not being understood.

And I just wanted to add I do indeed understand this journey. Part of why I gravitated toward my autism diagnosis is that most people can learn to understand someone with autism, but most people absolutely don't understand RAD and how it presents.

People either under-or-over correct with me. Either I am a very nice person who absolutely does demonstrate care and empathy, I am just wrong about my own internal perceptions - or I am a remorseless psychopath who doesn't care about anyone or anything and who wouldn't mind killing you.

People do not know what to do with a human who cannot feel love or trust. Those with autism have usually an over-abundance of affective empathy, the lack is in cognitive empathy. They will feel bad when they know a person is sad. I know you're sad, I just don't care.

Often times I accidentally (and rereading my last post to you I think I may have been too harsh in turn - which was not my intention to make you feel bad, simply an attempt to express why I understood where Sideways was coming from) come across as cold and callous simply because it wouldn't bother me to be addressed that way and I have to remember that it bothers other people.

If you want to see a kid with possible inhibited RAD (according to me, not a licensed clinician) who has begun to integrate socially I'd recommend the documentary I Just Killed My Dad. It's the first time I've ever seen someone like me represented in a humane light. Most of us are presented like Beth Thomas, "The Evil Child." It's considered a childhood disorder but my issues have persisted long afterward.

With Anthony Templet, he obviously does have some empathy (and I wager that he does care more about others than I do) but that inhibited lack of attachment basis is very prevalent in him. It's why he was almost thrown the book at, people thought he was remorseless.

It's why to be honest I suspect you probably are autistic. I recognize that struggle in you and I can see it in how you process information and interact. It's not the same as my struggle but due to my experiences I have plenty of first-hand knowledge of what autism is like. But other than saying that I agree with your suspicions, still can't say that you are one way or another without a diagnosis.