Can't See How To Move Forwards

[Jane.l]

Hi everyone, I haven't been here for a while but I need some help, advice, ideas ....
So I have been in therapy 3 years we have done some really good work but I am still struggling with flashbacks, nightmares, panic attacks etc I have come to realise that most of this is held in place by a huge amount of toxic shame. I have always found it really hard to talk in therapy as I tend to dissociate very quickly but trying to talk about this particular topic is becoming impossible, I have tried taking notes, we have tried walking and talking ( or rather not talking) - now my T only has to ask me what I want to talk about and I zone out.

I am massively avoidant and I know my T is pushing me to try and get me past that but it's making me feel like I am crap and that I am never going to be able to talk, which means I will be stuck in this hell forever - I think perhaps the issue is that I can't stand being vulnerable in front of anyone but how do you get past that?

I think I am frustrating my T and I understand that, he has told me to spend this week thinking of how I going to be able to talk about this, so now I feel I have to find an answer!!! He says be as creative as you like and one of the things I like about him is that he will always try anything I think might help..., so literally anything you can suggest might help!

Just wanted to add that I do have a really good relationship with my T and I can chat quite happily with him until we touch on the deeper stuff.

 

[Ronin]

One question: What's your source of pride?

I found shame is best defeated with pride, step by step. It's lil bit harder to find pride in one's own abuse and very compromiting situations, but still, you're here now & you're working your damnedest on that beast, so you'll get there.

 

[Kintsugi]

My T and I had a long talk about this yesterday. There are a lot of holes in it from me blanking out because we talked about a lot of stuff, but I do recall that she was saying she didn't want to push me to dive into my trauma unless she was confident I could handle the fallout until our next session, and she was saying that in order to dive in anyway I would have to be comfortable enough with her to be very vulnerable. She was particularly insistent that I would need to be in a place where I felt comfortable not just being honest about what's going on in my life outside of therapy (which I am bad at doing) but that I had to feel comfortable bringing my feelings to the table in the moment, able to express for instance that I was angry with her and be honest with those feelings.

I just sort of stared at her the whole time and was like, "That's gonna be awhile." We don't have a relationship where I really trust her in the sense that I feel safe talking about things that are really bothering me. Right now, mostly what we work on on that front is being able to acknowledge that which I do not want to talk about. It is enough for her right now that I am able to express that something exists that I don't want to talk about. As she said, "Then at least we can be in cahoots about what we're not discussing."

 

[Sandstone]

Good to hear from you again!

trying to talk about this particular topic is becoming impossible

Do you mean the topic of shame, or the topic that underlies it?

I think I am frustrating my T and I understand that

All that matters if whether you are frustrating yourself. His feelings about it are his problem.

I have two thoughts about how shame works in me. First, I feel that shame is something I "ought" to feel. It was used as a child to control me, and prevent me expressing stuff that disturbed my parents. There is definitely a link in my mind with experiencing shame and being approved of.

Second, it protects me. I watched

Janina Fisher's short clip on Combating Shame Through the Body. She asks how I feel when I alter my posture to express less shame. I feel tearful. So I conclude I'm using shame to protect myself from feeling distress.

There is also some interesting stuff in https://www.myptsd.com/threads/expo...ve-for-shame-based-responses-to-trauma.54819/ . There are several links that might set you in a useful direction

 

[Born to Run]

Could you write it down at home and take with you? Email it? Can you say it out loud at home and record with phone? Are you a crafty person and make a painting/drawing about it? Is there something you really like to do and can focus on and at the same time speak about it? If there is so much pressure to do it now, that does not make it very easy for you either, it seems to me.

 

[shimmerz]

She asks how I feel when I alter my posture to express less shame.

This is smart. Love it.

 

[Jane.l]

Hi thanks for replying, it's taken me a while to get back I had a 'blip'! @Sandstone - I think it's the 'evidence' I feel I have for why I feel guilt and shame so I guess, it's the topics surrounding that I am struggling with because of course I don't want to reveal the bits I hate the most. The u tube clip was really interesting and I found a great article on guilt and shame thank you, I am finding it hard to concentrate enough to read it and take it all in and work out what the hell to do! i do feel pressured I can't bear another silent session - they make me feel so self destructive.

@Born to Run all good suggestions - I am meant to take notes but I find when I get there I can't give them to him! We used to email and I found that useful but it caused some problems - however perhaps I could email the notes the night before, that might work.

Got therapy tomorrow, feeling like I don't want to go!!

 

[watundah]

So, so familiar but happy to report it's getting much easier.

Writing helped a lot. Write, share, and give him something to work with. Does he ask you lots of questions or do you sit in silence like fries under a heat lamp? If not, tell him to ask you questions! Keep a feelings journal, I email all of my inner child writings and the change between us has been huge. I wrote my personal history and emailed that. That felt big to me.

Vulnerability is freaking terrifying. I believe that every time we share something with our therapist and aren't rejected/ridiculed/judged, be it words, art, writing...it puts little chinks in that protective wall. Micro baby steps is the best that some of us can do!!

Stay with it. Sometimes I have words in my head in response to her questions and I push myself, force them to come out, reminding myself that it's what I have to do to progress. Even a few words feels like Ive succeeded sometimes.

 

[Suzetig]

I so know that feeling of not being able to talk about stuff that I really do want to talk about - there's something I need to talk through that I can't get to at the moment and I'm starting to think I never will.

I wonder though if your anxiety about therapy is effectively re traumatising you? Could you communicate in some way that silence isn't helping you, that instead of leaving it to you to lead things, your therapist does this? I notice you've tried walking and talking, could you try a different room, swap chairs etc? You could email ahead of time - not necessarily the "big" issues but stuff you feel ok enough talking about? Your therapist sounds like a star, sometimes you really do just need to keep turning up and wait it out. I've lost count of the sessions I've left kicking myself for not saying what I needed to. It's horrible but part of building the relationship.

 

[Jane.l]

I have told him often that silence feels damaging to me, I get stuck with all these images in my head and lose the ability to speak if he doesn't pull me back - I have emailed him this week to explain this again!!! I think perhaps the issue is that he thinks if he doesn't let me be avoidant I will have to find a way to speak to him but it doesn't work that way for me, I can't speak if I am zoned out. I do need him to ask me questions that really helps but I think he feels if he doesn't have notes he doesn't know what to ask, so perhaps emailing them ahead of the session would help, if he is ok with that.

 

[Suzetig]

I guess I'd wonder why it's not ok for you to be avoidant. It's sounds like he's trying to force your process - if you're feeling avoidant, it's there for a reason, trust yourself to go at your own pace - he should be matching you, not pushing you along.

 

[Jane.l]

Yes you are right it is my process, I think I was excepting his pushing because I have flagged it up as the thing I need to work on but you are right this needs to be at my pace, I have got in a mess working at his pace before. I need to remember that, I think I feel guilty because it's been 3 years and he must be banging his head on his office wall as I leave but that's his issue. Actually that's really helped take the panic out of it thanks, I think that's what I need to talk about in T tomorrow.