Maybe it never really happened…

[Sideways]

This comes up periodically. I’m looking at potentially doing some ketamine or mdma augmented therapy, so I’m confronting some of the fears I’ve got about that, which is why it’s come up (again!) now for me.

I have this contradictory relationship with my lack of conscious recall (or…just plain old amnesia…or, avoidance, or DID-related memory issues…whatever is driving that lack of ability to just “remember and know”). And, it’s particularly relevant because MDMA, while substantially more expensive, tends to have a particular relationship with trauma memories and that may determine which route (if either) that I go down.

On the one hand: what if I have an epiphany that it never really happened, and this is all just conflation? What if my brain has made this up, conflated illness or distress with experience, and here we are with a bunch of BS memories that have completely fked my life? (I get that this can happen, unintentionally, particularly with bad therapy…and I’ve had some bad therapists in the past!). How could I possibly cope with discovering that my own brain, my own insanity, is the only thing responsible for all my suffering?

On the other hand: what if I have an epiphany that it really did happen? Any of it. Even just one of my abusers having done those things, and I realise that it’s real. And the safety blanket of “it may not actually be real memories” gets taken away…how the fk do I cope with that? I don’t think I want that life.

Both of those options seem equally terrifying. Both of those options seem like things that I don’t think I’d cope with.

In the past, I’ve given others here pointers (which may or may not have been helpful) about how to deal with the ‘what if it’s not true’, or (equally awful), ‘what if it is true’ conflict. Can’t for the life of me give myself any good advice right now.

The augmented psychotherapy wouldn’t be to directly target whether my memories are real / reliable or the things I know remain memory-gaps (we’re trying to poke at the dogma that I still hang onto, whereby I am fixated on my own perpetual suffering as some sort of homage to my abuser), but the past, and my relationship to it, would inevitably come up. And those 2 fears are the big ones holding me back from diving in to the opportunity I’ve been presented with.

I hang onto “it may not have really happened” as a coping strategy. And it’s a pretty important one for me I think.

So, experiences with dealing with / coexisting with / overcoming either of those, or any other insights, would be awesome.

 

[anthony]

How could I possibly cope with discovering that my own brain, my own insanity, is the only thing responsible for all my suffering?

Whether real or not, its still your brain doing the deed, whichever side of the fence you're on, when it comes to this framing. Think about that, sit back and let it sink in... and how mad it may make you regardless the outcome.

My thinking goes a little like this... if it didn't happen, best day of my life. Especially if it fixed the problem, OR, lessened it significantly, allowing me to get back into life like I was.

 

[Muttly]

If it didn't happen, there was a reason your brain created the stories. And yes, that's awful, but if it did happen that's awful. The awfulness is something you have already been living with and have gained a lot of coping skills. I don't want to say it doesn't matter, because of course it does, but it's like if you got paralyzed. How it happened matters. Understanding how might change treatment to a degree, but ultimately, you are still deal with what your body can and can't do.

I hang onto “it may not have really happened” as a coping strategy. And it’s a pretty important one for me I think.

Oh sure, I get this. I suspect your brain is like me. What sort of incontrovertible proof would you need to rule out *any* chance it didn't happen.

 

[ninja]

What I'm hearing (correct me if wrong) is that you are wanting to let go of the internalized dogma that, when activated, can lead you to re-enact self-defeating behaviours. There is a hope that ketamine or MDMA assisted psychotherapy could help with that. There's also a fear that through the process, you might end up having an epiphany that gives you some kind of certainty about whether the abuse happened or not, which could be destabilizing because you sometimes rely on the uncertainty to cope. I'm also hearing that something seems to have shifted for you that is making this opportunity feel less scary / more doable than in the past.

I have a few questions that you can of course feel free to answer or not.

Before that though, I want to name that I resonate a lot with the hesitance you feel towards ketamine / MDMA / psychedelic assisted psychotherapy. A significant part of my hesitance comes from the fact that I’m not a big fan of pushing past resistance without taking ample time to understand it. Just naming my position because you may hear it come through in the questions.

- How do you feel toward the hesitance that you're feeling?
- Have you tried ketamine, MDMA, or anything like either of them in any quantity in the past?
- If you imagine a scenario in which the augmented therapy does exactly what you are wanting, what does that look like?
- What would you say has changed that is allowing you to consider it more seriously this time than in the past?
- What makes "it might not be real" an important coping strategy? In what situations do you turn to it? How often does that happen? Is it the only strategy that works for you when experiencing a particular kind or intensity of distress?

Regarding false memories, I guess my take is that yes, we've learned that memories change each time we access them and our brains tend to search for 'completeness', etc. We've also learned that CSA is unfortunately much more common than we want to believe. So, like, possible that you've made it all up? I guess. Likely? Personally, I think it's much more likely you've misremembered some specific details, rather than being wrong about everything.

The other thing I'm thinking about - Say you did have an epiphany that gave you more certainty one way or the other. Who's to say whatever you saw / experienced / felt / came to "know" would be more truthful? The medicines might give a sense certainty through an experience, but that may or may not be "real". You know?

Of course, please take what serves and dump the rest.

 

[Freida]

There's a new treatment for fibro that involves ketamine and one of the doctors down here suggested it. I ran it by my therapist and she has some big concerns for something that may put my brain into free fall without a mental health person nearby

Will it tell me my memories are real? Maybe
Will it tell me I'm just a nutjob attention seeker who made it all up? Maybe
Do I have the coping skills to address which ever of these might come up?
Maybe

Or will it drag me back down into hell and I won't be able to escape?
That's the one that scares me the most. Free falling into memories because my brain is too relaxed to put up the normal walls. Because no matter if it's real or not, for some reason these memories exist.

The VA has been studying this for a few years now and have found it's really helpful for regular ptsd. But the CPSTD verison is a bit more dicey. So my thoughts would be to make sure whoever is with you is trained in trauma therapy so they can pull you out if it goes south

 

[anthony]

Or will it drag me back down into hell and I won't be able to escape?
That's the one that scares me the most.

This reminds of the ibogaine discussion. Do I, Don't I, self argument. On the one hand it is the capacity to heal you, on the other it has the capacity to destroy your mind. Now the results are good - BUT - like everything, there are a number of people that it will basically render you useless the rest of your life, maybe even landing you in lifetime psych hospital, or killing outright, basically from frightening you to death. Its small, yet its there. You could put yourself into cardiac arrest, you could come out with such low symptom levels you no longer meet diagnostic criteria and can be part of life normally.

MDMA definitively seems to be the best of them all right now, under therapeutic supervision. Seems much more controllable for the patient, whilst delivering results.

 

[PlainJane]

Ketamine was life saving for me. I was terrified of the potential to go the wrong way too. Most of my sessions were positively geared and went in line with my set intentions. I think that has been the biggest factor is the prep work before hand. I did have a couple of seesions that were really hard but they weren't debilitating. I have a super solid team that was there through it; that was big for me. I needed to have someone that understood the process inside and out AND let me in on it, and not just someone that was administering something to a patient.

The prep work for me was a few days worth of being particular about what I consumed (everything). I didn't watch any media and only listened to ketamine playlists. I was careful about food and drink. Cycled my intentions. I focused on work when I had to and relied on a couple friends to help with grounding when needed. Nightmares were hard, and I was still dealing with major triggers that made me worry about how ketamine would effect me and what direction my mind would bring me. The scary hard sessions? I was able to lean into and come out okay because of the support with my health care team and the friends that I trusted to bring me back and forth.

Ultimately, it worked out for me. Or still is. I still do maintenance doses.

 

[Freida]

@anthony that wasn't as reassuring as you might have thought

 

[beaneeboo]

I haven't read the responses to your post so sorry if I'm repeating what's been said...

The agonising spiral of was it true or did it not happen and I'm making it up....eggghhh ... for me, this has been one of the most damaging parts of the effects of my trauma - even if i can't always confidently say what my trauma was, I can feel it's been significant from the very dynamic you've described and you're struggling with....

The fracturing of the mind with dissociative disorders is so extreme that we generally can't see is fractured it even though we're looking right at it. Even though we 'know' lots about the mechanism we still sometimes can't see it happening in real time... And it's this blind spot that f*cks things up ...because we start fixatibg on a small part of what's going on and it becomes all-encompassimg / overwhelming.... but it's just a rabbit hole.... the things we're focusing on are sometimes not in a position for us to see fully ... And then we corner ourselves and demand to know: 'It either did happen or it didn't and if it's the former I can't handle that and if it's the latter I'm the worst human being alive on this planet'... But it's a battle between ourselves which is fruitless because there's no way out of this thinking... just spiralling... like going down a maze route which will ultimately lead you to nowhere...

The first thing I've learnt and which i tell myself is that we are unable to recall trauma memories in the same way as non traumatic memories... this is because at the time of the trauma the dissociation interrupts HOW we encode experience the event....We aren't experiencing the trauma events in a full cohesive narrative with detail because our brain is trying hard to get us NOT to experience what's happening.... So it's no wonder that We CAN'T recall more narrative detail when trying to recall the memory How could we recall what didn't go in properly in the first place? It's like asking a blind person to recall paintings in an art gallery then saying they are making it up when they can't do it...

So to recap, the narrative wasn't there in terms of how we experienced the trauma at the time of the trauma BECAUSE OF THE DISSOCIATION... So trying to get back a memory In the same way as we can when recalling other non traumatic memories will NOT happen in the same way... and it's useless trying to....

For me this helps to know because it means the 'Did it happen or did i make it up?' questioning becomes a bit more redundant. And at that point i have to use clues about the fact I have years of complex emotional / psychological symptoms which point me in the direction of having something traumatic happen which I will just have to accept i can't fully see yet. Or possibly ever.

Not sure if the following is helpful but one of my ways to getting out of my 'I must have made it all up' way of thinking is just to visualise myself / my parts at a debating table (you don't need to visualise parts if you don't want, could be anyone)... and i just set up a comfortable spot somewhere away from the debate.... and i watch, observe and listen to the discussion / argument and do nothing more.... i don't try to join in... I just observe. Listen to one side. Listen to the other. I don't get involved. I'm not emotionally invested in what's said. Then i get up and leave. Walk away and shut the door. Not in a rude way. I just go in a neutral way. This process can sometimes help me leave the most incessant of thoughts... creates distance between the obsessive dilemma and me - without shutting it down. Just allowing it and walking away. And no, I am not always good at doing it and it doesn't always work. Ignore if useless!