Needing Order

[RussellSue]

The older I get the less patience I seem to have with other people's lack of organization, predictability, efficiency, reliability, etc., especially if it wastes any of my time. I was met with a situation recently where I was dealing with someone with poor organization that mucked up my (real or perceived) time-frame repeatedly. I permanently exited the situation - I cannot deal with this.

When I was younger, I was a lot more apt to sling insults at someone for wasting my time on account of being flighty or disorganized but I could tolerate a lot more. Now, I just walk as soon as it is clear that the person I am dealing with doesn't care or isn't likely to do things differently.

Does anyone else struggle with this sort of thing - a nearly violent need for predictability, order, efficiency, reliability, etc?

 

[Recovery4Me]

You have been supportive of my questions of late, so I thought that I might give it a whirl.

Before my complex PTSD became my constant companion- I majored and graduated in Graphic and Fine Arts. Unaware of what my disability was- as life and PTSD progressed I held the illusion of needing more outside control. I went back and completed degrees in Accounting. How is that for needing control?

I don’t know if this is conveying my message correctly however, what I am attempting to offer gently is this...
I was not aware that the key was in myself. Others (albeit) may be on different frequencies, but tolerance (not necessarily indulgence nor enabling) is very instrumental to negotiation, socialization and maintaining healthy relationships.

Yet, I do understand where you are coming from and often have to give myself pep talks in order to not ‘walk away‘ as you posted. As much as we wish otherwise, there will always be someone out there to help us learn patience (coughs). Take care.

 

[RussellSue]

I went back and completed degrees in Accounting. How is that for needing control?

This brings up something I had not realized. My husband has GAD and teaches math because "it never changes." He is a classic anxiety-ridden control freak complete with regular bitches about co-workers not being professional, responsible, etc. even though he hardly ever sees them. But of course, this is the guy I run my issues with the world by in order to figure out if my frustrations are reasonable.

I was not aware that the key was in myself.

12 years ago, I was diagnosed with Obsessive Compulsive Personality Disorder but the dx did not stick because the guy who gave it to me was canned for drunk driving/child endangerment about a month after giving it to me. My next therapist seemed to think he had been picking on me as I was sober in spite of my problems. But I never really thought it was wrong.

Having had the ridiculous upbringing I had, an integrated dysfunctional personality built on the anxiety of trying to improve things totally makes sense to me. I was later told by a mental health professional that if I thought I had a personality disorder, I probably did not. Probably is obviously not a definite. Whatever. It made sense to me.

After 16 years of therapy, 20+ collective years of sobriety (over two long-term periods) and a few years of school counseling before all of that, I still consistently struggle with what feels like a traumatic response when I am suddenly told to put my itinerary down in certain situations - most dramatically in situations where someone else is supposed to be helping me and maybe aren't doing so in a way that makes sense to me. I've done plenty of real work on myself and feel confident I understand my part in these situations but my internal response never changes. The only thing I get better at is not creating wreckage with other people.

Whatever I do outside, on the inside, this monster boils up, grabs the paperwork, turns it to ash with flamethrower breath and tells the person helping that they ought to try next time and to screw off and then walks out (while tipping over file cabinets on the way).

Sometimes I am sure this is a reaction to not being able to trust or rely on my parents, other times I am pretty sure I'm just an asshole

Whatever it is, all these years into it, I'm always fighting with myself, asking myself what I am doing wrong (to a crazy-making degree which seems to point back to OCPD) and attempting to fix things.

This last situation had my therapist's seal of approval. He said it really didn't sound like this woman was doing her part or her job and that I could stop feeling like a failure for knowing I could not work with her.

Still, the aggravation and anxiety were WAY too high. I don't know if it's GAD or cPTSD, possible OCPD or a combo. It bugs the shit out of me that all these years down this recovery road, I can still find myself as agitated as I get over people just being people.

Thanks.

 

[Recovery4Me]

Whatever it is, all these years into it, I'm always fighting with myself, asking myself what I am doing wrong (to a crazy-making degree which seems to point back to OCPD) and attempting to fix things.

I really hear you and understand part of your drive for a moral compass among fair or equitable resolutions. Attempting to fix things for me is from codependency or as an adult child of alcoholics. I too, bounce off my T. and the board here at times to stay within a spectrum of normalcy, despite my multi-label jousting.

However, learning to let go, when to let go plus how to let go (while sitting in discomfort) is a lifetime journey for some of us. Perhaps, by questioning ourselves - it is a form of tribute to the authentic manner in which we wish to live.

 

[RussellSue]

Attempting to fix things for me is from codependency or as an adult child of alcoholics.

This definitely hits home and I think that because I have so many other things going on, I often fail to remember that I am, first and foremost an adult child from an alcoholic home. People get angry for reasons -- as my T pointed out the other day, I don't need to support a court case in order to have the right to be angry or to create a boundary but so often I get myself riled up in supporting my case that I have 3 extra helpings of frustration by the time I finally make a decision about how to respond to a person or situation. Instead of mentioning a concern early on, before I have made myself crazy, I often wait until I have enough evidence to argue that I am right and the other person did it wrong, as was the case this last time.

My T also said that it is possible that I run into a lot of people who really are not high achievers and that it irks me because I really do work/try hard just to function and yet there are plenty of people out there who don't put a lot of effort into what they are doing. This is not really my business until it affects my life but it doesn't take long to get under my skin in that case. Having that bit of jealousy wrapped up in it definitely fuels the fire.

Insert five more paragraphs about what I learned today here.

I am reminded of one of my very favorite quotes: "We are a narrative species. We exist by story-telling - by relating our situations - and the test of our evolution may be in getting the story right." - Roger Rosenblatt from "I am Writing Blindly."

I guess what I am saying is that this is a much more complicated problem than I originally realized

 

[Recovery4Me]

I guess what I am saying is that this is a much more complicated problem than I originally realized

I am glad that your Narrative Challenge requires all those wonderful & complicated parts of you to come into a form of agreement. Each label brings an additional ingredient that often can help another. I know your responses as well as support have assisted me at times. So there is value in your chapters and courage within your step. Take care: it was nice to chat with you along our journey.

 

[Friday]

Does anyone else struggle with this sort of thing - a nearly violent need for predictability, order, efficiency, reliability, etc?

I have no interior sense of order, so I have to create it, externally.

 

[Survivor3]

The older I get the less patience I seem to have with other people's lack of organization, predictability, efficiency, reliability, etc., especially if it wastes any of my time. I was met with a situation recently where I was dealing with someone with poor organization that mucked up my (real or perceived) time-frame repeatedly. I permanently exited the situation - I cannot deal with this.

When I was younger, I was a lot more apt to sling insults at someone for wasting my time on account of being flighty or disorganized but I could tolerate a lot more. Now, I just walk as soon as it is clear that the person I am dealing with doesn't care or isn't likely to do things differently.

Does anyone else struggle with this sort of thing - a nearly violent need for predictability, order, efficiency, reliability, etc?

Adolf Hitler struggled with that.....!

 

[Friday]

Now, I just walk as soon as it is clear that the person I am dealing with doesn't care or isn't likely to do things differently.

Yep. I may not actually trust or respect the person... but I’ve gotten a hellluva lot better at “allowing” other people the right to make their own decisions.

(IE trusting that they know their own minds/hearts, and respecting the right to make those decisions, about their life, for themselves. Personal accountability / agency.).

You go be a f*ckwit by yourself, thanks. I’d rather spend my energy on amazing people, doing brilliant things. The only way you’re going to rise to my caring? Is to be worth a jail sentence for feeding you your teeth. Some people are worth that, but they’re few and far between. Idiots and assholes, meanwhile, are a dime a dozen, and bore me.

So I’ve also learned to respect my OWN time & energy, life & decisions, a bit more.

 

[Recovery4Me]

Is to be worth a jail sentence for feeding you your teeth.

That is darn near what I say all day long as I navigate people during my tipping points. I am so relieved it is not just me. Thank you for your candor during your post.

 

[RussellSue]

Adolf Hitler struggled with that.....!

Thanks! I feel so much less alone

I have no interior sense of order, so I have to create it, externally.

That's me. It's when a list or a schedule gets tugged around too many times that I start feeling like I am descending into chaos. If other people want to do that, that's cool but I can't go on that ride with impunity. It's too damned much work and usually for a shit payoff.

 

[Survivor3]

Thanks! I feel so much less alone

I was worried that you wouldn't see the funny side of my joke. Because it was just that. Any chance to humiliate a disgusting man like that! I totally get what you were saying and understand. The world can be frustrating sometimes when we are trying to make headway or get things done. Best wishes to you. S3