Sad thing - When you tell your therapist all your abuse and she can’t hug you because of boundaries.

[Wendell_R]

Along with towel idea, is there something you can do "together?"

I think you're trying to gently push your limits, while also understanding that if you push too hard the exercise can become counterproductive.

Suppose you each have a basket of colored stones, and you take turns placing one stone at a time onto a table between you. You each have your own line of stones.

Suppose you take turns, with each person describing in only a few words one thing they see in the room.

 

[Abstract]

It’s one of those case-by-case, moment by moment judgement call things... that can and often does change over time... as people’s instinctive responses change to conscious decisions. I

Think this is very true. And *touching* on the attachment stuff - I have had very intense conversations on here before with others about touch. Maybe the person I am thinking of will pop up on here at some time! ;) I think some of what is ideal is down to the individual, both parties concerned, where you are at at the time/day and a whole lot of other things. Importantly as Friday said the whole pandora's box of the sexualisation of affection when there has been past sexual abuse. But then there is also more lasting attachment patterns. Some people believe all will be healed with physical touch in therapy but in truth they have a preoccupied attachment pattern and touch in that context is so obviously going to head towards somewhere horribly painful. That is one of the times those boundaries are invaluable. Even when they are very very painful and the person thinks they are the last thing they need.

Not saying that is your situation Snowflake as I don't know your patterns. But its a great topic to speak through with your t as can bring up lots of enlightening stuff.Congratulations on your disclosures by the way...

 

[hithere]

Has to do with my "inner child" who picked her to tell our story to. Her/my shame is very powerful.

This is what I did, too. This is why it's hard to understand, too. This is also why the "token" from the therapist can represent a hug and really feel very healing.

 

[lostforgottensoul]

They can ALSO go from sobbing in your arms one moment, to trying to sleep with you the next, to beating the living hell out of you if you try and pull away.

^^^ Me!

I'd freak if my therapist touched me! But that's just me!

Then she said it’s especially not safe to give sexual abuse survivors hugs

It can lead to transference. So, most certainly should be heavily discussed and then if allowed, heavy boundries on either side should be out in the wide open and adhered to for sure! In my opinion anyway.

Heck I don’t look at her. I just hug a pillow and stare at a wall.

Neither do I! I fiddle with something in my hand (and my therapist replaces that something with something else if I tear that first something up) and stare at the floor, or the side table that holds a lamp and a clock. If my therapist wants eye contact, he will almost get on his knees to try to meet my eyes and then I will usually look out the window over my right shoulder which he can't compete with so he'll generally change the subject at that point or try to redirect it to make me feel safer.

I certianly would do this very slowly, if it's done at all. But, it sounds like you guys need to talk about it more. It sounds like it's a heavy boundry for her. And maybe for you too if you don't even look at her? Maybe you are trying to go too fast and maybe it just feels like you need a hug from her when, what you actually need maybe something different entirely? Maybe ask her why you could be feeling like you need a hug from her when you can't even look at her? Maybe talk about that feeling and why it's there? Just a thought.

 

[Snowflake]

ask your therapist if you can have something from the therapist to keep that will be a symbol of a hug, something from the office space NOT a gift--something like a paper clip, a sticky note with a heart drawn on it, a pebble from a planter, a book mark. That type of thing. Gifts should not be given in my opinion. This giving of a token to represent a hug actually works when clinicians have a no touch rule. It also helps between sessions for those who have abandonment trauma.

I was interviewing therapists recently and went to one who is in her 80's. She wanted to hug me and it totally whigged me out, and I stepped backwards as far as I could. However, it was very healing for me that she had such an open generous personality. This is just her personality-to give a hug for the intense and painful conversation we had just had.

Okay I’ll try

Think this is very true. And *touching* on the attachment stuff - I have had very intense conversations on here before with others about touch. Maybe the person I am thinking of will pop up on here at some time! ;) I think some of what is ideal is down to the individual, both parties concerned, where you are at at the time/day and a whole lot of other things. Importantly as Friday said the whole pandora's box of the sexualisation of affection when there has been past sexual abuse. But then there is also more lasting attachment patterns. Some people believe all will be healed with physical touch in therapy but in truth they have a preoccupied attachment pattern and touch in that context is so obviously going to head towards somewhere horribly painful. That is one of the times those boundaries are invaluable. Even when they are very very painful and the person thinks they are the last thing they need.

Not saying that is your situation Snowflake as I don't know your patterns. But its a great topic to speak through with your t as can bring up lots of enlightening stuff.Congratulations on your disclosures by the way...

Thanks-took 4+ years

 

[Orange Phone]

Oh, my therapist has loaned me two books over time. One from early on that I still have. I will return one day. The other is a book that had a personal, intense inscription written in it that I returned right away. Her sharing that with me meant a lot. I don't know the details but her willingness to trust me build the bonds.

I like the idea of something small but "personal"... I am sure if I asked mine would provide. I just have me/ my inner child moon at her photo.

 

[Snowflake]

^^^ Me!

I'd freak if my therapist touched me! But that's just me!



It can lead to transference. So, most certainly should be heavily discussed and then if allowed, heavy boundries on either side should be out in the wide open and adhered to for sure! In my opinion anyway.




Neither do I! I fiddle with something in my hand (and my therapist replaces that something with something else if I tear that first something up) and stare at the floor, or the side table that holds a lamp and a clock. If my therapist wants eye contact, he will almost get on his knees to try to meet my eyes and then I will usually look out the window over my right shoulder which he can't compete with so he'll generally change the subject at that point or try to redirect it to make me feel safer.

I certianly would do this very slowly, if it's done at all. But, it sounds like you guys need to talk about it more. It sounds like it's a heavy boundry for her. And maybe for you too if you don't even look at her? Maybe you are trying to go too fast and maybe it just feels like you need a hug from her when, what you actually need maybe something different entirely? Maybe ask her why you could be feeling like you need a hug from her when you can't even look at her? Maybe talk about that feeling and why it's there? Just a thought.

So true-good idea

 

[whiteraven]

In other words with the history I’ve had he will be like h*ll no lol. Dang. I may still try if I can get myself there but at least I can be a little more prepared for the no. I’m okay with accepting no usually from anyone for anything, too okay, one of my issues actually, but hearing no from him seems potentially a little devastating.

Like someone else here said, it's a very individual thing for both client and therapist. My therapist and I hug at the end of every session. He feels very safe, like he would do nothing to hurt me, and if it were a problem for me we wouldn't.

I do think it's really good to prepare for whatever response you get. I know what you mean about his saying no would be devastating. I often don't say things (to my therapist and just about everybody else) because I'm afraid of the response.

 

[Snowflake]

I hug my therapist. SHe will often come sit next to me and put a caring arm around me and after a difficult session we will have a quick goodbye hug. As long as you are both in agreement and giving and receiving of hugs knowing the professional relationship is not at risk then why not

So nice :)

 

[Mach123]

Ok so, this is a hard one and naturally you feel like that and yes, it hurts. I'd say if I could gently offer advice that you need to trust her and she didn't want to hurt you and (if she's a good trauma therapist) she knows it hurts. That's a lot to ask I know.

My therapist and I have done some body work. She's gotten right in my space. We've done emdr which I felt probably was the most invasive, intimate really, and it was hard for me especially because she was directing me and touching me, positioning my hands and stuff. She asks me before she gets close to me always.

A few months ago I asked her to hug me and she said no, she didn't think that'd be ok and I was like ok, that's fine. We have been together a long time and the trust built up. IDK why I did that, I just woke up that morning and I thought about it and I thought well, do it and see what she does.

Any time during the first couple years I would've reacted much like you did. I used to go in there all mad about the previous week and pick fights with her lol. Last week I said "I've been fighting with you since the day I walked in here," she said "you have," and we had a good laugh.

Therapy is hard. I think it's part of your process. When it's hard she says "welcome to therapy dude."

 

[grit]

I think on a good day, you may understand that everybody has the right not to touch even if their jobs is to care and provide empathy.

Not sure how long ago, but accepting the limitation of another human, especially in therapy, can be healing because imagine if a person demands same from you at your job.

She cared. She listened but perhaps it was too raw to add a touch.

PS. I am not saying it is wrong or right but I do recall one time the therapist coming behind me by mistake, and I thought I was dying. Why? Because I was completely in my trauma mode. I hated. I hated. But today I realize wow...that is how deep I was gone from the here and now and if that therapist would have touch me by mistake, not sure what could have happened.

I am not saying this is similar or even close to you but your therapist would be better off hanging you not after you shared something so deep. a neutral moment. you were probably too overcharged.

 

[Orange Phone]

I think on a good day, you may understand that everybody has the right not to touch even if their jobs is to care and provide empathy.

Not sure how long ago, but accepting the limitation of another human, especially in therapy, can be healing because imagine if a person demands same from you at your job. She cared. She listened but perhaps it was too raw to add a touch.

This is a very good point Grit. It is about agency and we all should have the right to decide. Yes there are "professional" boundaries, but there is also the person behind that.