Scapegoating In The Family And Its Consequence.

[Deleted member 12723]

(((Philipia))) i really feel for you. I was slow to get over things and not very good at getting over things. I held grudges. My heart goes out to you for what you suffered and endured growing up, You sure are strong now. I admire you for your inner strength you have cultivated.

 

[Philippa]

Thankyou. It is hard to be around people who are so very different in the way they operate to how you do. My father is a very tough guy, and he gets over things very quickly. Things that would take me weeks to get past he will be over within a day or so...not even a full day, maybe a few hours. It's hard to be around people like that. They are like bulls in a china shop, but they think they are nice and normal.

I guess self-acceptance is the lesson. I'm a pretty sensitive person, and they all think that is 'gay' or a bad way to be, but I actually think it is a great quality and I find a lot of value in being sensitive in this world...but it sure isn't easy to be sensitive in a world full of people who aren't.

 

[Deleted member 12723]

My sister is like a bull in a china shop. I am having some difficulties with her and I am letting go and trying to relax. She is dying and I have a phone only contact with her. She is very tough too. She is very street smart and has had a very rough life. I feel bad for her but I have to be careful with her too. She is a big gossip and two faced. I have to be very careful what I say to her. I have seen her angry before and she is pretty scary when she gets angry. She is very attached to me and very possesive of me. It makes me feel uncomfortable.

 

[Philippa]

Yeah, I remember you saying a while back that your sister is like that. It's no way to have relations when you have to be so careful around someone, not to tick them off if they are slightly psycho, which it does sound like your sister is, unfortunately.

 

[Deleted member 12723]

Yes she is a little bit psycho, I am ok as long as I have phone contact with her only. Lucky that my husband is sick and we are not able to go to see her. She makes me feel really uncomfortable. I am trying to keep it surface and superficial. I do not tell her anything. She is so self centered that she does not know how we are. I am glad for that. I am taking a long look at her. And I do not like what I see. It has changed since she is dying. She is not in good shape. She works very hard in a casino and when she goes home she spends all her time in bed. So I am not worried about her coming over to my house.

She is very jeolous and insecure and I think you are right she is afraid her daughter will like me more than her. She is very very immature. But I think now she is harmless to me.

I will keep my distance. I hate this but I do not know what else to do. I could not live with myself If I cut her off again now. I will support her through her dying process from a distance.

 

[Abstract]

Gizmo,

I don't have it in me to write much today but wanted to give you a quick response as I can tell how hurt and confused this issue makes you.

The problem with the situation that you describe is that she doesn't really love you. She loves an extension of herself. We feel it when we are an object or when our real selves are disregarded. It is an extremely crazy making and insidious feeling and hard to express or put ones finger on.

The other problem with this type of behaviour is that it makes it really difficult to disengage without guilt as on the surface the person can appear really loving. That tends to make us feel that our anger and distress is out of proportion to the situation. But really it isnt and is rather telling you something.

Do you have a history of taking care of others needs at the expense of your own? Have you ever discussed how you feel with her directly? Safe hugs to you as I can hear how much you are hurting.

 

[Deleted member 12723]

Abstract I could hug you. You nailed this one. You explained it very clearly and it makes so much sense. She does not love me. And you are right she loves an extension of herself. This makes so much sense. It is crazymaking and insidious. You are so right.

Yes I have a history of taking care of other people at my own expense.No I have never discussed with her how I feel. I feel bad because I cut her out of my life two times at different times for years.

I am really hurting about this but now I feel alot stronger as you have cleared the fog away and I can see what is really going on. It explains so much. Thank you so very much for your response. I hope you feel better. I really appreciate this. That is why I feel like her thing. I am her object like a teddy bear. One she cannot control. I will keep the phone calls briefer. I have felt so sorry for her. But your explanation makes perfect sense. Thank you so much. I feel so much better and more sain than I have in a long time.

 

[Abstract]

I am glad it helped. What you say makes total sense.

I also think if I put it another way she probably loves you in the only way that she is capable of. She probably does not have the capacity to see others as separate. That does not at all mean that you have to give up your wellbeing and stop protecting yourself. You have a right to protect yourself.

The only way I manage to tolerate my relationships with people impaired in this way is to be sure I never just give in to their concept of me. I am sure to claim my real self in any way I can in the small periods of time that I subject myself to these relationships. I do anything I can to stop feeling that I am being taken over.

Take care GIzmo. This stuff is hard.

 

[Deleted member 12723]

I have alot to learn. You are so right on. This is all she can give. I need to assert myself more with her and define myself. I will continue to protect myself and my family. I will cut the phone calls short instead of her taking over and deciding how long we talk. I have been so confused for so long. But it is like the scales are falling off of my eyes. I do not feel loved at all. that is what has been so confusing. She has been taking over and she rambles on and on. She always says I love you and that is when I get sick to my stomach. I have so much to learn. Thank you so much for helping me to finally figure out what has been going on.

 

[Philippa]

My father is the same as this. Always trying to convince everyone how compassionate he is, and always saying he loves me unconditionally but then behaving in ways that don't convey that or add up to his words. They are actors. I am not an object and you are not an object to possess.

It is all about their own issues, and I've had to do the same thing...start telling him that no, I don't want to talk to or see him, that he isn't just entitled to my time and to see me whenever he wants...I actually have a say in the matter as well. He's getting the message now, although he is still trying to use my other family members to rope me back in.

I wasn't thinking too clearly yesterday to reply to my brother, but I have now opened the door to him contacting me again, but I intend to say that if he is acting on my father's behalf, then forget about it, I'm not interested, until he genuinely takes himself off to a therapist and commits to dealing with his issues...which he never will.

Taking back control in these small ways will help to establish your sense of being an autonomous, powerful person. And indeed, she isn't thinking about you at all, your sister is all about getting her needs met at any cost, and your needs simply aren't important to her. She is attached to what she can get from you...not you as a person. It's parasitic really.

 

[Deleted member 12723]

Wow Philipia, you sure nailed that one. You are so right. I have not every looked so closely at her before like I have today.She is attached to what she can get from me. She has her own agenda. It is parasitic. Thank you for explaining these things to me.

I will be prepared the next time she calls. I will not listen to her talk about other people. I will cut the phone conversation short. It is not about me at all. She is using me to further her own agenda. She is not getting much from me. But i will change the rules. I do not know what will happen, it should get interesting. I will refuse to discuss the people I do not want in my life. It is like I have been under a spell. I was feeling miserable. I was unhappy but did not know what I was dealing with. Now I know. I am going to go and jounal some more about this. Thank you so very much.

 

[Abstract]

This is all she can give. I need to assert myself more with her and define myself.

I think it is particularly potentially problematic for those who are used to putting others first as in childhood they tend to have been taught to not have a self. That means that it is easier to then loose oneself when you meet up with someone who sees you as an extension of them. If we are not careful we can become complicit.

For me what has helped is to truly accept who these people are. Its much less upsetting once one is not looking for something that one isn't going to get. I remind myself that it isn't personal. It is just how they are and what they are capable of. Its also why only walking away in a conflict situation is seldom a good option for me. I need to say or do something little to claim myself so that I don't feel complicit. But that is different for me as I don't have an issue with anger or loosing control. As I have felt more able to claim myself I feel less threatened by people like this.

I hope that makes some sense. :confused: It may not be relevant but I thought I would share.

:hug: