Struggling with self hatred as usual but with a difference.

[Abstract]

@digger1 you are totally right that there is obsession there. I used to think of myself as easy come and easy go, sensible, no fuss. Not too pleasant to discover that when it comes to therapy I am neurotic, paranoid and it seems pretty much incapable.

A lot of it comes down to lack of trust. Lack of trust of others would be one thing but I have realised it is the lack of trust in myself and in ability to be able to perceive what is happening and protect myself that is the biggest issue. This is what keeps me going over the past and analysing it.

My work on self awareness and mindfulness has changed my life and it may well be enough to enable me to stay aware in therapy but the distrust is still there.

A break from thinking about this is what I need. I am tired. When I have tried to take a total break then I turn on myself. It seems there is a part of my brain that is determined that I need help.

@Mayday yes, how you describe your experiences usually feels very close to how I work. It feels familiar.

So basically that's the compromise

Exactly! Your example describes it very well. This is what I have to do all the time and I have become much better at it. That's why I can't have a total break. It's always about compromise and sneaking things in. I sometimes have to tell myself I am doing things for a different reason to the one I am. I have been doing this with issue and slowly moving myself in the direction I need to go. I am just very tired and it feels like the part of my brain that has been expending the most energy is fading. It feels strange.

Thank you for writing what you did.

 

[Abstract]

he payoff of staying where you are versus moving forward

Oh there is definitely a payoff and I am quite aware of it. I don't have any trust whatsoever that therapy won't further damage me. I also have a lot of doubt that I will be able to tell if that is happening and therefore contain that damage.

I guess it's a matter of believing in the essence of something but having big trust issues and internal conflict that block it taking place. The blocks are a manifestation of those fears and that distrust.

can you see how you have successfully dealt with PTSD?

Hi change, I tend not to do goals and rather leave things to develop organically as extra pressure shuts me down so I relate to what you describe. In many ways a could write a long list. Including a lot of success with my general symptoms. My general PTSD symptoms are way down compared to 6 months ago. All of them I think. It's hard that therapy is still such an issue.

 

[Abstract]

@scout86 thank you.

Everything you brain is doing was, or is, "adaptive" in some way

Yes I do agree. I can see a lot of logic in what this side of my brain is wanting to achieve. There is a logic to it.

Thankfully I pretty much defeated my perfectionism or managed to get it under control at least. I am grateful for the other work I have done as this would be way harder without it. Lovely to hear your positive experiences.

@Ninja

critical and analytic 'eye'. This energy turned inward is very difficult to control because it tends to lack the necessary sensitivity.

Very well put! I sometimes think awareness or insight without self compassion shouldn't happen. It's like putting a weapon in the hands of someone irresponsible.

Letting things happen in the background works for me too. I have to do enough of whatever it is to keep all the needs met (not getting treatment, making steps etc etc) and then "sit back" a little and that helps. I just wish my psyche could go to bed for a week and not think. :-/

Thanks for the support.

 

[Abstract]

More later folks...

 

[Abstract]

@Britt.f7 thanks for your kindness and support.

 

[Abstract]

Parts. I have been thinking more and there are ways I don't want to approach this. I am open to changing my mind as I go along and if I find I need to. I also have absolutely no problem with people wanting to do it differently or needing to do it differently if that makes sense. I suspect there is an endless spectrum of what people experience and what each person personally finds useful.

I want to continue it being me and sub me's if that makes sense. I also feel no need to put a name to it and have a label for it either. I think I am perfectly happy to just see what works and try to find concepts that are useful for me. I am guessing that there are useful things I can gain from all different approaches to parts work and that I can leave the parts that I don't find useful and work from there. As I said before, I am willing to change my mind as I go along.

"dealing separately with parts" means "separating parts more".

Bedbug, you are right. I think it's partly an indication of me not feeling stable in a sense. I guess I have put a lot of energy into holding things together and being in control of the disconnects.

@DharmaGirl You are very brave. Thanks for the support when you are struggling so much.


@radicalgratitude thank you for your helpful post.

I can identify with that fear.

Thank's for sharing this. I often feel very different to the way people discuss these things. The only thing I am sure of is that it isn't just plain critic stuff going on. It helps to hear other people also fear these things.

all parts are welcome

Thanks for saying this. I think this too is why normal approaches to internal critic work doesn't work. It is more complex. There is probably a very intense fear of the loss of containment if I go to certain places. In the last 6 months I have concentrated on getting symptoms down in the hope that I will be able to get myself back in therapy. I have been very successful in reducing PTSD symptoms in general but am aware that I have dampened it all down. I think there is a very real chance that things will come out if I venture into certain places and things that I am not sure I am equipped to deal with without professional support. I'm not sure how to get past that with this and yet still get benefit from it.

I see "parts" as aspects of my single self

Hashi, I very much like the way you address your parts. For me that feels much more harmonious with the way I see things for me and what feels helpful for me. I loosely follow the way Jung describes it. I like the way he approaches human nature and how all this can fit into a spectrum of what is normal.

oing work towards integration and harmony has been huge

Thank you for sharing. I do appreciate it. Your input and everyone else's. I have been crying a lot on this thread which has taken me a bit by surprise.

Hiding, but not somewhere else.

I am wondering how possible it would be to start archetype work at home. It seems a little complex to do so.

@Pencil thank you for the support. I saw they changed things. Managing is the key for all of us isn't it?

Thanks @Ms Spock. You are sweet. That is lovely.

@change :) That is one thing I am good at! I guess I underestimate it's value sometimes. That type of thinking also has it's down side unfortunately.

I'm feeling a little confused and I can't think clearly. There is a lot on here and my mind keeps going in different directions. I need to try to gather it up somehow and make sense of it in a big picture type of way. Feeling a bit defeated but I am also feeling quite touched by this thread and probably more real in some ways than in a while.

Thanks again everyone if you read this. I know I have a habit of pedantically wading through things which can be hard to follow.

 

[ninja]

Abstract, I don't want to hijack your thread but I would like some clarification on something to hopefully better understand:

The only thing I am sure of is that it isn't just plain critic stuff going on.

Briefly, can you give me some idea of what you see just plain critic stuff to be?

 

[Abstract]

No worries at all Ninja. I guess I see plain critic stuff as me experiencing an internal critical voice, even one that is very strong and feels almost separate. I have experienced that before and experience it a lot now - I can sense the difference even though I probably have no hope of being able to describe it. What it feels more like is that that part of mind feels just as strong as other parts. Often stronger. It also doesn't come up on it's own if that makes sense. When it gets bad then I have a reaction to it and there is a response. It's not me fighting a war against a critical internal voice. It's a complex negotiation amongst three (guess) very different strong modes for want of a better expression. It's strings of complex reactions and counter reactions. I can no more stop trying to deal with the PTSD than I can stop trying to deny it. The last time I tried to stop and truly sunk into the "there is nothing wrong with me and I just need to get on with living" I found myself self injuring repeatedly over a period of time within days and had to stop it from happening to my face. That's what drove me to the forum. Sorry if that sounds crazy. That really doesn't describe it but I am afraid it's the best I can do for now.

If it was a "simple" (ha! as if it is ever simple) critic voice (which I have a lot of too) then I am guessing this type of game playing wouldn't be the only way I seem to be able to get past things. .

A lot of how I manage my life is because I work out little ways to get around various parts of me.

 

[Hashi]

I am wondering how possible it would be to start archetype work at home. It seems a little complex to do so.

I think it would be complex to work to any depth. I read about it, went to a two day workshop and then did some sessions with a consultant. Once I'd "got it" I was fine working by myself. It took me a little while to get it though.

At first I found it hard to understand what the light side/shadow side was all about, for example getting my head round the idea that the Bully archetype has a light side as all archetypes do. I have to say that Caroline Myss, whose work was what I studied, isn't very strong on that. It was also a bit of a challenge thinking about the variations within one archetype and which one manifested most for me. Plus getting away from what seemed obvious but wasn't the case. For instance I love art but I don't have a connection to an Artist archetype, in me this is to do with the Storyteller. And there were two archetypes I would never have ascribed to myself that I needed outside help in seeing.

I'm also not sure what source material you would want to use. You might not like Caroline Myss's approach, and I don't know of any others that are written specifically for people to work on this themselves. Motivated as I was, I could hardly read a page of Jung's "Archetypes and the Collective Unconscious". I always prefer someone else telling me what Jung said.

Having said that, I think there would be value in reading about it and finding out about approaches.

I also think it could be good to look for an archetype that has a resonance of strength and positivity for you. That's something that isn't very complex to do. I find it very helpful to "channel" archetypes that I don't see in myself but which have something I feel I need. For me, that has been particularly the Heroine archetype. When I've felt overwhelmed with fear and impossibility, I've asked myself "What would the Heroine do?", "What would the Heroine tell me?". The Knight Protector has been another one.

I also feel no need to put a name to it and have a label for it either. I think I am perfectly happy to just see what works and try to find concepts that are useful for me.

I'm a bit confused. Do you mean there's no need to put a name to how you experience it? I think there's going to be a name for each of the concepts you consider. So the concept will call it something - archetypes, sub-personalities or whatever. Am I misunderstanding what you mean?

 

[ms spock]

This is my favourite band in the whole world Abstract. It fills my heart. I don't know if you would like it.

Dendrite

You can listen to the whole of their album here. It won't scroll down to it but my favourite song is just below the last one you cant see the text for it will play right through.

 

[Abstract]

Thank you @Ms Spock. You are sweet. It's beautiful.

Thanks Hashi. That is very useful.

Do you mean there's no need to put a name to how you experience it?

Sorry. Not at all. What I meant is the whole diagnoses issue. I don't really want to sidetracked into anything like that and rather just want to focus on what feels like it helps me or what could help me and that I can try on for size.

I didn't do very well with Jungs Archetypes and the unconscious either. I own a copy. I understand the basics of the shadow/light concept although it is obviously complex how that shows itself in each archetype and I imagine takes quite some time to grasp.

My other concern with archetypes in a therapy environment is whether a t who is drawn to the concept may be too spiritual for me. Maby if they are multi disciplinary then it will cushion that. I probably do need to consider this before going down this road as I don't want to waste energy only to find myself blocked later.

I wonder if its a good idea to do archetypes at home without getting proper input. It is a complex approach. I am wondering if I should start reading up as a means of educating myself on the principles and as a means of better deciding if I should go down that road in therapy; and maybe see if there are other things I can use for now to help me be less tired and manage this better until I can get myself into professional help. Or do you think there could be some use in picking out just a few and working with what I can? Do you see that as possibly helping me get back into therapy and managing my resources better in the now?

I think I need ways of protecting the parts of me that feel like they are being destroyed and maybe some way of dealing with this very vengeful part of me. That's the immediate priority. I am open to ideas.

At present I do what Mayday described; try to take a step back to neutral ground to defuse it when it gets bad; work on radical acceptance and try not to judge it; attempt to focus away from the issue without any side feeling their agenda is getting undermined. The focus on getting to t is a general background one and not something I think about actively all the time. It is a general goal that I try to trick and shuffle myself towards in a meandering sort of way. When I feel I can I take a bigger step and then deal with the fallout and regroup.

I don't feel I am that far off being able to get myself back into therapy in some respects. My symptoms are also quite low compared to what they are. It's this head stuff that is really causing problems and blocking me and is at risk of doing some damage to me it feels. I am also concerned about what would happen if I actually get myself into a therapist office. What the backlash would be.

I need to try to separate what is just me being avoidant and what I think is genuinely not useful to me.

Has anyone found that even thinking of what a part wants lets out a whole lot of trauma stuff you can't contain and a sense of splitting? Is this a groundless fear of mine? Thanks

 

[Pencil]

Has anyone found that even thinking of what a part wants lets out a whole lot of trauma stuff you can't contain and a sense of splitting?

You have noticed my knee jerk reactions to certain issues - now you know why ;). Panic ensues.