Purplemunchkin
Gold Member
Hubby says he sometimes feels like he is inside a bubble watching his life as though it was a TV programme.
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General Trauma Work & Skills You Learn - Sufferers, Please Respond
- Post starter MandyLou
- Start date
- Status
Hubby says he sometimes feels like he is inside a bubble watching his life as though it was a TV programme.
Hi @MandyLou.
For my husband & I, forgetting about right & wrong or normal or should be’s helped us a great deal. You know, the old ‘you can be right or you can be happy’ kind of thing. For us, we decided to really only worry about the deal breakers in the beginning of the worst of my symptoms. It took a little while for both of us to really figure out what they were & it wasn’t really until each of us had upset the other that we did know what they were at all. We’d check in with each other but when we’d decided we had them pretty well covered, we got together & went over our lists. Like I said, wasn’t about right or wrong, it just is what it is. I guess we need what we need. We didn’t really go into the why’s of them (not sure if we totally knew them). I was just ‘ok’ & what can I do to help meet your need. Honestly most of the time (on both sides) the answer was, well I’m not really sure I can do that & we would work it out together until we came up with something that we could do & the other would feel as those their needs had been met. I may be stating the obvious here, but it was a real revelation for us.
Regardless of whether is was something coming to the surface or a complete over reaction, our go to became…are you ok?...what do you need? (& then wait & listen – very important)..is there anything I can do to help? (& just believe them whatever it is, even if the answer is no & go about business accordingly). I know it’s hard not to be needed & sit by watching someone you care about hurt. But honestly, the best thing you can do (for everyone), I believe, is to just go about doing you. I don’t believe it is anyone’s job to fix another person. Even if it was, you couldn’t anyway. I’m a firm believer that everyone is responsible for their part in a relationship. Nothing more & nothing less. For me, out of his love & care for me & wanting to help, sometimes he felt more like a carer & I a broken thing, which just doused fuel onto the flames. The other side of it too, for me, was that I really needed to see normal from time to time. Normal expectations of me (sometimes through tough love) & also normal responses from him. There was a huge retraining element for me.
I don’t know about the trust thing, but for me getting close seemed more like an instinct. I would liken it to burning your hand whilst cooking, then after dinner having a shower before bed & when the water hits, that same area feeling as though it is being burnt for the first time again. Obviously this is irrational otherwise the water would be burning your entire body, but burn it does & you pull it out to the side anyway. It just is what it is. I don’t think it gets any more personal or intimate than when someone deliberately wants to, & does hurt someone to the point of taking or nearly taking a life. But, as with the burn, as the ‘stuff’ around intimacy gets dealt with, the responses to those situations also subside. But it’s hard work & it takes two to tango. Both parties have to be fully committed to working at it. One can’t do it on their own or for the other, no matter how much they want to.
Just on the lack of empathy. My husband often remarks on the pedestal he can put me on sometimes because of how much I care about others & their wellbeing. And this is the same person, where my friend’s car got broken into & her wallet stolen. You would not believe the carry on (as far as I was concerned ;)). I feel violated she goes on, & she was obviously distressed. My reaction..oh well, cancel your cards & get yourself another one….come on lets get going. Not one of my finest hours (of many unfortunately). But then she said something that really hit home for me. She said, but you don’t understand. This is the worst thing that has ever happened to me (& it was too). My heart sank. I couldn’t believe I had been so cold to her. I felt really awful that I had done that & terribly awful for her. And I showed it with a completely blank, bewildered look on my face & went & sat in the car & didn’t say anything (what an asshole :bag:). I learnt how relative it can all be & because I went through something so horrific, that I often miss what can be shocking or hurtful to others, & only see them like nothing more than an annoyance or inconvenience because that’s what they are to me. You know, it’s not life or death, who cares, you’ll be right. This lack of sympathy came up in my marriage to. I can’t remember what he did or the consequence of it (says it all right), but one day he was all pissy with me cause he’d done something & I had just continued along my merry way doing whatever it was that I was doing. Another one of my finer hours…not :wtf:. My response….what did you want me to do?...ur not bleeding or anything. It never occurred to me that he just wanted to know that I cared. So I thought ok, I can do this. So the next time a similar situation arose…& I responded exactly the same way :banghead: (another of my finer moments). But I did think..oh shit, this is where…& said, oh are you ok?. Well we just looked at each other…& then burst out laughing. It was terrible. Pathetic attempt. But I worked on it. I knew it was important to him. And so it should be. We all deserve to feel cared about & cared for & I do care about him & it’s something I can do that can help make him feel that way.
Anyway…just sharing some stories..don’t know if it helps you anymore or not.
For my husband & I, forgetting about right & wrong or normal or should be’s helped us a great deal. You know, the old ‘you can be right or you can be happy’ kind of thing. For us, we decided to really only worry about the deal breakers in the beginning of the worst of my symptoms. It took a little while for both of us to really figure out what they were & it wasn’t really until each of us had upset the other that we did know what they were at all. We’d check in with each other but when we’d decided we had them pretty well covered, we got together & went over our lists. Like I said, wasn’t about right or wrong, it just is what it is. I guess we need what we need. We didn’t really go into the why’s of them (not sure if we totally knew them). I was just ‘ok’ & what can I do to help meet your need. Honestly most of the time (on both sides) the answer was, well I’m not really sure I can do that & we would work it out together until we came up with something that we could do & the other would feel as those their needs had been met. I may be stating the obvious here, but it was a real revelation for us.
Regardless of whether is was something coming to the surface or a complete over reaction, our go to became…are you ok?...what do you need? (& then wait & listen – very important)..is there anything I can do to help? (& just believe them whatever it is, even if the answer is no & go about business accordingly). I know it’s hard not to be needed & sit by watching someone you care about hurt. But honestly, the best thing you can do (for everyone), I believe, is to just go about doing you. I don’t believe it is anyone’s job to fix another person. Even if it was, you couldn’t anyway. I’m a firm believer that everyone is responsible for their part in a relationship. Nothing more & nothing less. For me, out of his love & care for me & wanting to help, sometimes he felt more like a carer & I a broken thing, which just doused fuel onto the flames. The other side of it too, for me, was that I really needed to see normal from time to time. Normal expectations of me (sometimes through tough love) & also normal responses from him. There was a huge retraining element for me.
I don’t know about the trust thing, but for me getting close seemed more like an instinct. I would liken it to burning your hand whilst cooking, then after dinner having a shower before bed & when the water hits, that same area feeling as though it is being burnt for the first time again. Obviously this is irrational otherwise the water would be burning your entire body, but burn it does & you pull it out to the side anyway. It just is what it is. I don’t think it gets any more personal or intimate than when someone deliberately wants to, & does hurt someone to the point of taking or nearly taking a life. But, as with the burn, as the ‘stuff’ around intimacy gets dealt with, the responses to those situations also subside. But it’s hard work & it takes two to tango. Both parties have to be fully committed to working at it. One can’t do it on their own or for the other, no matter how much they want to.
Just on the lack of empathy. My husband often remarks on the pedestal he can put me on sometimes because of how much I care about others & their wellbeing. And this is the same person, where my friend’s car got broken into & her wallet stolen. You would not believe the carry on (as far as I was concerned ;)). I feel violated she goes on, & she was obviously distressed. My reaction..oh well, cancel your cards & get yourself another one….come on lets get going. Not one of my finest hours (of many unfortunately). But then she said something that really hit home for me. She said, but you don’t understand. This is the worst thing that has ever happened to me (& it was too). My heart sank. I couldn’t believe I had been so cold to her. I felt really awful that I had done that & terribly awful for her. And I showed it with a completely blank, bewildered look on my face & went & sat in the car & didn’t say anything (what an asshole :bag:). I learnt how relative it can all be & because I went through something so horrific, that I often miss what can be shocking or hurtful to others, & only see them like nothing more than an annoyance or inconvenience because that’s what they are to me. You know, it’s not life or death, who cares, you’ll be right. This lack of sympathy came up in my marriage to. I can’t remember what he did or the consequence of it (says it all right), but one day he was all pissy with me cause he’d done something & I had just continued along my merry way doing whatever it was that I was doing. Another one of my finer hours…not :wtf:. My response….what did you want me to do?...ur not bleeding or anything. It never occurred to me that he just wanted to know that I cared. So I thought ok, I can do this. So the next time a similar situation arose…& I responded exactly the same way :banghead: (another of my finer moments). But I did think..oh shit, this is where…& said, oh are you ok?. Well we just looked at each other…& then burst out laughing. It was terrible. Pathetic attempt. But I worked on it. I knew it was important to him. And so it should be. We all deserve to feel cared about & cared for & I do care about him & it’s something I can do that can help make him feel that way.
Anyway…just sharing some stories..don’t know if it helps you anymore or not.
- Admin
- #76
anthony
Founder
Interesting our empathy level at times, when someone carries on about something that ourself would consider a non-event. Yet to them, major life changing situation because they haven't experienced anything worse yet. Interesting...
- Post starter
- #77
@tacit,
Thanks for your response. Yes, I think that’s great that you try to understand when you’re being hurtful and put some effort into showing your loved ones that you care for them and love them. However, there are some people who don’t understand what it’s like to another’s heart… no matter how many words, adjectives and descriptions you use to make your point. I think some people just innately lack the ability to empathize and you’re not going to install that in them by telling them how you feel. It may feel something to them on an intellectual level but it won’t make sense as to them wanting to change how they act, etc. When people don’t care… they just don’t. You can’t make them care. Some people just don’t have that gene and I’ve come to accept that.
Yes, it does take two to be in a committed loving relationship and want to grow together, to draw close and understand one another. With all the issues added, it does take a tremendous amount of effort to work towards that goal on daily basis.
Thanks for your response. Yes, I think that’s great that you try to understand when you’re being hurtful and put some effort into showing your loved ones that you care for them and love them. However, there are some people who don’t understand what it’s like to another’s heart… no matter how many words, adjectives and descriptions you use to make your point. I think some people just innately lack the ability to empathize and you’re not going to install that in them by telling them how you feel. It may feel something to them on an intellectual level but it won’t make sense as to them wanting to change how they act, etc. When people don’t care… they just don’t. You can’t make them care. Some people just don’t have that gene and I’ve come to accept that.
Yes, it does take two to be in a committed loving relationship and want to grow together, to draw close and understand one another. With all the issues added, it does take a tremendous amount of effort to work towards that goal on daily basis.
- Post starter
- #78
- Admin
- #79
anthony
Founder
We'll agree to disagree on that. Empathy has nothing to do with minimising another's experience IMHO. Two very different things, and in actuality, minimising an experience can have a time and place for effective use, especially when a person needs a swift kick in the backside to get themselves motivated and out of a funk.
- Post starter
- #80
Well, yes @anthony , it does have to do with minimizing another’s experience of pain/difficulty regardless of your empathy level. Whether or not you are able to empathize with another matters very little if you are not able to recognize their pain and communicate your empathy. Yes, sometimes you have to redirect your efforts to regain focus and continue functioning but if you’re healthy enough you’re not going to do that for that purpose only… regaining focus and wanting to keep going forward should never outweigh the well-being and security of someone you love… if it does, then you’re harboring a lot of negativity and not letting yourself work through things effectively.
- Post starter
- #81
I’ll give you an example. A nurse has a patient who just died and the family is going through a lot of pain. The death of the patient has impacted the nurse and she has to deal with things regarding the patient’s death. However, she also needs to be emotionally available to the family and take care of some practical things such as calling funeral home, washing up and dressing her patient. The nurse is there for the family, she cries with them because she feels the pain that they are going through however, her job demands her to be there for them in very practical ways as well… so she changes gears to be able to accomplish her tasks. Just because you are faced with difficulty and have things to get done shouldn’t lead someone to close off emotionally to others. Yes, you do pick and choose how to react no matter how empathetic you are, but you should never go through life pushing away every difficulty and vulnerable experience that you need to face and have to experience alone or with others. If you do that for a long period of time you become an impenetrable wall that nothing can enter in any way. Is this going to make it difficult to connect with others? Yes. Is this going to make you feel numb and senseless? Yes.
joeylittle
Sponsor
Sticking my head in just to say - I think it's very different when it's a job, vs when it's a relationship. When I'm struggling with symptoms, and don't have much more energy than to keep myself alive and semi-functional, opening the mail is sometimes the biggest thing I can handle. I need to open the mail, because the bills need to get paid. I can't spend hours listening to my significant other struggle with his workplace politics...I don't have the capacity. Hopefully, when I say 'I'm sorry, but I just need to go lay down and try and get some sleep', he won't get angry for my being neglectful of his needs.
If I were his therapist, he'd have a right to be angry; I'm hired to do a certain spectrum of things, and one of those things is to listen and be helpful. But when I'm his significant other? He should have another option of someone to talk with. And that's not me lacking empathy - that's just me being honest about what I'm capable of - and being honest with someone I would hope I can trust to hear the honesty and be willing to support my need for quiet and sleep.
- Post starter
- #83
@joeylittle
You are missing the point. No, what I mentioned above has nothing to do with a job duty. My point was that if you keep pushing away everything and everyone whom you are in a close relationship with, you’re going to end up in a scary place where you are not going to be able to connect with them because you’ve directed all your efforts away from them. Let me tell you this. Yes, I think if I was trying to be accessible to someone in a personal way in my job, then surely I would communicate something to my loved one, let them know I am here with them because they are significant to me and I’m going to at least try. I don’t want them to act as my therapists, I want them to know that I’d be willing to share more with them and I’m not closing off and disappearing and so everyone close to me is wondering what’s going on and grows to have more and more anxiety about my well-being.
You are missing the point. No, what I mentioned above has nothing to do with a job duty. My point was that if you keep pushing away everything and everyone whom you are in a close relationship with, you’re going to end up in a scary place where you are not going to be able to connect with them because you’ve directed all your efforts away from them. Let me tell you this. Yes, I think if I was trying to be accessible to someone in a personal way in my job, then surely I would communicate something to my loved one, let them know I am here with them because they are significant to me and I’m going to at least try. I don’t want them to act as my therapists, I want them to know that I’d be willing to share more with them and I’m not closing off and disappearing and so everyone close to me is wondering what’s going on and grows to have more and more anxiety about my well-being.
joeylittle
Sponsor
Can I ask - for you, what is the difference between pushing away and managing an illness? I can absolutely see how it looks like pushing away, from a supporters' perspective. And don't doubt that sometimes that is coming from an unhealthy place.
But I also know that there are things, for anyone in recovery - from anything - that need to be left to the individual to be the primary manager of. If you've broken a leg, at some point it's not going to help you to have your wheelchair pushed around every day - you are going to need to start using the leg, and the only person who can do that is you. Some illnesses and injuries have that kind of personal component to them, and I think PTSD is one of those.
So to my mind, 'pushed away' is a feeling, more than a fact - or has an implied judgement on the other persons' actions, when that might not be what they are doing. But - I'm aware that's my perspective as a sufferer who had a really dysfunctional relationship when it came to my mental health. My partner put a lot of pressure on me.
So, I'm curious - in your mind, what does it look like for a sufferer to be working on themselves, in their own space, vs. pushing away?
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