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Understanding Anger

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Love can also be behind anger. A drive for survival can be beneath anger. A deep compassion for the wider world can be beneath anger too.

I've asked a few questions to understand your understanding on this subject, but you've not answered. There remains too many alterations in what you say from post to post, for it to be an understanding of anger.

If you would answer a question - do you feel the pain that you describe?
 
I always thought that I did not experience anger. However this week I realised that I did, but in a very immature way. I had a typical temper tantrum because I could not get my own way. I was frustrated that I could not make things right - the way I wanted, so flipped out and ranted and raved ( quietly)

I felt better afterwards.

I did not vent off at anybody - it was much more an internalisation - and I sobbed and sobbed.

Not sure why I am telling you this, except it was a new learning for me.
 
Love can also be behind anger. A drive for survival can be beneath anger. A deep compassion for the wider world can be beneath anger too.

Take that a step further. Do you want to be driven by peace or anger?

If you would answer a question - do you feel the pain that you describe?

In another thread...or maybe this one...lol.. I shared I want (ed) to dig up my grandfathers grave to stomp it through the center of the earth (core) sending him on his way to the moon! I quickly realized he isn't worth my time. What is of value is the peace and understanding in my heart. He can keep his rage. :)

Does that answer your question?

In another
I've asked a few questions to understand your understanding on this subject, but you've not answered. There remains too many alterations in what you say from post to post, for it to be an understanding of anger.

Your list of questions were taken out of context in your effort to manipulate this conversation. ~shrug
 
I agree with @shimmerz and @medowsweet.

Anger is an emotion that is neither good nor bad. It is hard to experience anger. We can use anger in rageful or hostile ways that are abusive and horrible and never ok. I do not by any means condone hostility or rage. I have been deeply hurt by those who expresses anger in very destructive ways. My aunt was extremely skilled at cold rage and it still gives me nightmares. I myself have screamed and yelled or given someone the silent treatment. It does not resolve anger not heal the injury and hurt. It's harmful and horrible to others and to myself. I have also struggled with anger that I turned inward. All these destructive from of anger did not help me or anyone else and are things I still feel ashamed of (working on forgiveness).

For awhile, I had convinced myself all anger was bad and wrong to feel or to express in any way, I did everything I could to just let go and intellect use my way out of anger. It wasn't all bad for me to do that, but it wasn't a good way to live. It caused other problems.

it has taken a lot of work for me to realize anger itself is not good or bad, and that I can actually use anger for good purposes. It's been deeply healing for me, and it has reduced the pain of the past in huge ways. The other ways of dealing with anger did not help me heal.
What I see in this thread are the many ways people try to rationalize their anger.
@Survivor2Thriver
If people were seeking to rationalize hurtful and abusive expressions of anger, that would be one thing...

But I don't see anyone seeking to wrongly justify healthy expressions of anger.

You posted with what seemed like an intent to understand anger. People have had a very lively and interesting discussion. You have responded to people's writings about the very serious subject of anger with "lol" (which I assume means laugh out loud) and by saying all anger is folly and then saying everyone is trying to rationalize things. You make a lot of assumptions, very negative and critical assumptions. You assume the worst of intentions behind people, even to the point of accusing their questions to better understand you (something you have said is very important) by refusing to answer and them calling them manipulative -judging heart and intentions so severely on little to no evidence.

You may not recognize your own writing as angry, but it sure comes across to me as very judgemental, that all anger is wrong and people only feel anger because they don't understand, and you ignore their questions and continue on with more judgement-filled statements - which is usually a sign of anger coming out sideways rather than in a more constructive and direct way. That's how you are coming across to me. If you are not angry and you are not seeking to judge or laugh about people's serious comments here, then please do reconsider your way of communicating to people.
 
Do you want to be driven by peace or anger?

Every moment is changing. In one moment, anger is the feeling that drives us, in another peace drives us. But bothe peace and anger have the potential to create harmful or healing circumstances.

A person driven by peace may have the courage to walk away in one situation, as they may fawn and remain captive in another situation. Likewise, a person driven by anger may find the courage to save a child from abuse in one situation, but they might abuse in another.

To place feelings into black and white boxes like negative and positive, in my opinion, limits understanding of how to respond to those feelings.

Does that answer your question?

No it didn't answer the question that I asked. I asked if you feel the pain that you said was beneath anger?

Your list of questions were taken out of context in your effort to manipulate this conversation.

Ok, that is your view. Is it a fact? no, it has no basis in fact at all.

It is a choice of view, and a choice in how you have responded. Whatever you feel, you have that choice. You could equally have taken the questions as questions from a person trying to understand you better, or you could simply have looked objectively at the questions and answered them as directly as they were asked.

In this situation, because it isn't an immediate threat, there were many choices.

Does your response show a person driven by peace and feeling joy? in my opinion, no, it doesn't show that.
 
For example, I am volunteering for an organization that helps end child trafficking in the US. I have learned a lot about this reality. The more I understand all sides of the issue, the more angry I get!

If you don't see the above quote as an unresolved anger issue that certainly is your right. It is your life.

I am sharing how I process anger. Ironically there are people in this thread who are angry and/or defensive I am not angry!!!

Peace to all.:joyful:
 
I do not process anger like you do.

That does not mean my way of dealing with anger is of less value than yours.

You can choose to hurtful make assumptions and read into others words in a very cruel and hurtful way.

I personally am shocked that you seem to indicate not only that if you saw a child being sold into sex slavery, you would feel nothing but peace and joy, and that there is something wrong with me if I felt something different.

I do not want to feel peace about children being sold into slavery. You apparently do. I do not understand that at all. I am trying but you refuse to clarify YOUR stance and respond with more judgement and assumptions about others. No info about you but your harsh criticism of others.

You are not trying to understand others anger. You are judging others ways as lesser than your way and judging all anger as bad.

If you really had peace, you wouldn't keep doing that.

As for me, I will be bowing out of this thread. I have enjoyed reading what others have written and the good thoughts and ideas shared by others. But I don't want to be continued to be judged and have intentions subscribed to be that are not there by someone who feels feeling anger about children being sold into sex slavery is wrong.

@Survivor2Thriver - you do not understand my anger in the slightest way nor do you seem to be trying to do that. You are trying to out my anger into your limited view. I hope someday, when you are ready, you reconsider you view on anger and stop trying to judge were one else for having a feeling. Judging actions is one thing, judging feelings is another.

And you are right in one sense - child slavery is an unresolved ongoing problem around the globe.
 
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Ok Survivor2thrivor (I don't know how to copy your name on here)...I still don't understand this. This is a legitimate question and not trying to make some point or laugh at anything or whatever. Please explain to me if you believe that people are allowed to experience anger in any way, or is anger in your mind a BAD thing?

I just want to understand how you think about it more. I am a religious person, maybe you aren't but I know even Jesus was angry at what he saw around him. I'm sure whatever religion you are...those leaders have faced anger before and not shied away. It's a part of the natural human life. It was something all humans were given so they could live normally. It's a NORMAL reaction and emotion, not to be pushed away, like it seems you are doing.

Maybe if you explain it better I wouldn't get that impression.
 
All emotions are just emotions. It is silly to get so hung up own which ones are secondary emotions and which are primary emotions. People are more than the sum or extremity of their emotions. People are more than just that.

If someone can truly claim to have answers, they do not lie in the emotions they do or do not have. The answers lie in what you have done and what you do and what you will do in the future.

If someone feels a terrible, negative emotion, but chooses to act in accordance with the morals and ethics that guide that person's life, then it matters very little what emotion was felt at the time.

As a woman with PTSD, there have been many moments in my life in which I felt great emotional pain in many forms. I have looked out and seen another person, and have found peace in feeling compassion, caring, and nurturing in the same moment as my pain. There is something greater than the emotions, and that is the soul, the mind, and choice. It exists and it directs me to feel a higher path even when I am angry, scared, or hurt. I am able to feel that while I'm here, there is the opportunity to make the world better for me and/or someone else. Dr. Viktor Frankl, a concentration camp survivor of WWII, also felt that to have the power to remove suffering from another gives meaning to one's life and one's joys and sorrows. He was also a psychiatrist, who studied and argued with Freud and Adler, having been mentored by the later. He believed in the Will to Meaning as higher and more universal than the Will to Power/Pleasure that Freud believed drove everyone most heavily.

The Will to Anger is neither of these, and the preoccupation with anger belies a lack of awareness that there is much more at work in human motivation than emotion. That notion predates Freud and is over 100 years out of date in simplicity.

Survivor, remember that people don't "care what you know if they don't know that you care." Joy and Peace inside are important. But people can go on being very loving, even feeling high levels of outrage and anger. It is good to find one's bliss internally, the point of grace. But that doesn't release the anger permanently. It will find it's rightful place.

Did Jesus feel joy and peace when he died? Did the leaders of the Civil Rights Movement feel peace when they were being threatened and beaten? I didn't feel joy and peace when I ran into the road to save my dog that got brushed by a car to save its life. I felt fear, love, and primitive feelings of "not wanting to sit and watch my dog die." People have differing definitions of "anger" and "peace" which cannot be the same for any two individuals, any more than God or Self could be. There will always be similarities, but no two inner worlds are the same, not even in identical twins.

Chimps who see another chimp about to be killed will heroically jump down and save it, even at their own peril. Researchers are not clear about if the chimp is aware that it is saving the other at its own peril. But it is clear that even animals do not want to watch other animals die and to sit idle.

I think it is a lot of pointless speculation to care so much what an abuser is feeling in his emotions. Who cares unless that is the subject of your Ph.D? What matters is what people do on purpose, how it affects others, and what we can do about it. Human responsibility and freedom do not care what that person felt that day.

If someone's goal is life is to rid oneself of a particular human emotion, say anger, than the other emotions will also be affected. St. Augustine said that only one capable of great evil could also be capable of great good, by choice. Since his time, researchers have noted that some people experience a more narrow range of emotions and do neither much good or bad to others lacking effect upon the world overall. Others are very dynamic and whatever they do, and leave a great ripple effect, good or bad. It is important that people be aware of who they truly are, for that does go out into the world. But it is not necessary to rid oneself of anger in order to do that.

Finding out what feeds one's anger that has set up shop in the human heart is, as you have said, vital to knowing who one is. One should take the time to work at neutralizing it, and using all the energy of the person to reach goals, do good, and feel proud of one's contributions to society is all that is necessary to create a healthy balance in the world. If one feels the need to expel the anger and replace it with peace, so be it. However, Justmehere's example is one of sublimation, which does a similar thing. Sublimation is the process by which a person takes deeply rooted negative feelings that are natural and shared by moral people and channels them for a higher good for the world. This does something inside the person like alchemy. That anger is not the same now it was put to good use.

If we didn't have anger, we wouldn't have MADD Mothers Against Drunk Drivers and people would still be legally allowed to text while driving. Negative emotions motivate people to change the world. If we all smoked pot enough to claim we were no longer angry, we would not do anything to improve the world. We don't need more hippies. We need more angry and loving mothers and fathers, who make the world more accountable and just for the future children.
 
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Has anyone heard of a faraday cage? While flying in an airplane thunder strikes the plane without causing damage to its passengers. That is how I protected my heart. In the mist of all their thunder (stupidity) I fiercely protected my heart. I protected my heart from their anger and shame. Their shame caused my abuse. I understood then as I do now it is/was not my burden to bear.

Love and peace to all. :joyful:
 
There are many ways anger is expressed, I'm seeing many flavors in this thread. Anger isn't just external hurtful rage.

I'm still learning to recognize the many passive and masked forms of anger expressions, but a good indicator for me is when my gut tightens up and I feel instinctually defensive or closed down. This is the body's natural response to someone's expression of anger, the nervous system contracts and defends up. Likewise when someone is communicating from compassion, the nervous system relaxes and opens up naturally recognizing safety.
One simple dichotomy of anger expression is Passive anger versus Aggressive anger. These two types of anger have some characteristic symptoms:

Passive anger can be expressed in the following ways:
  • Dispassion, such as giving someone the cold shoulder or a fake smile, looking unconcerned or "sitting on the fence" while others sort things out, dampening feelings with substance abuse, overreacting, oversleeping, not responding to another's anger, frigidity, indulging in sexual practices that depress spontaneity and make objects of participants, giving inordinate amounts of time to machines, objects or intellectual pursuits, talking of frustrations but showing no feeling.
  • Evasiveness, such as turning one's back in a crisis, avoiding conflict, not arguing back, becoming phobic.
  • Defeatism, such as setting yourself and others up for failure, choosing unreliable people to depend on, being accident prone, underachieving, sexual impotence, expressing frustration at insignificant things but ignoring serious ones.
  • Obsessive behavior, such as needing to be inordinately clean and tidy, making a habit of constantly checking things, over-dieting or overeating, demanding that all jobs be done perfectly.
  • Psychological manipulation, such as provoking people to aggression and then patronizing them, provoking aggression but staying on the sidelines, emotional blackmail, false tearfulness, feigning illness, sabotaging relationships, using sexual provocation, using a third party to convey negative feelings, withholding money or resources.
  • Secretive behavior, such as stockpiling resentments that are expressed behind people's backs, giving the silent treatment or under the breath mutterings, avoiding eye contact, putting people down, gossiping, anonymous complaints, poison pen letters, stealing, and conning.
  • Self-blame, such as apologizing too often, being overly critical, inviting criticism.
The symptoms of aggressive anger are:
  • Bullying, such as threatening people directly, persecuting, pushing or shoving, using power to oppress, shouting, driving someone off the road, playing on people's weaknesses.
  • Destructiveness, such as destroying objects as in vandalism, harming animals, destroying a relationship, reckless driving, substance abuse.
  • Grandiosity, such as showing off, expressing mistrust, not delegating, being a sore loser, wanting center stage all the time, not listening, talking over people's heads, expecting kiss and make-up sessions to solve problems.
  • Hurtfulness, such as physical violence, including sexual abuse and rape, verbal abuse, biased or vulgar jokes, breaking confidence, using foul language, ignoring people's feelings, willfully discriminating, blaming, punishing people for unwarranted deeds, labeling others.
  • Manic behavior, such as speaking too fast, walking too fast, working too much and expecting others to fit in, driving too fast, reckless spending.
  • Selfishness, such as ignoring others' needs, not responding to requests for help, queue jumping.
  • Threats, such as frightening people by saying how one could harm them, their property or their prospects, finger pointing, fist shaking, wearing clothes or symbols associated with violent behaviour, tailgating, excessively blowing a car horn, slamming doors.
  • Unjust blaming, such as accusing other people for one's own mistakes, blaming people for your own feelings, making general accusations.
  • Unpredictability, such as explosive rages over minor frustrations, attacking indiscriminately, dispensing unjust punishment, inflicting harm on others for the sake of it, using alcohol and drugs, illogical arguments.
  • Vengeance, such as being over-punitive, refusing to forgive and forget, bringing up hurtful memories from the past.
--- source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anger
Can anyone recognize some of these expressions of anger in this discussion thread?
 
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