General What are they thinking?

[NaeNae75]

I thought it was pretty brilliant....

I agree completely. Your entire post was eloquent, and....brilliant!

 

[NaeNae75]

This has been my lesson over the last...oh my goodness, almost 2 years...When my sufferer "ended" things, I was in the midst of my own crisis, and I needed his support. I didn't have his support (because he had been triggered, blamed me, stress on top of stress on top of stress happened, and so he got rid of me), so it forced me to take a good, hard look at my own crap.

I started therapy for myself, and am on my own journey of healing now, and realize I'm the only person I *can* heal. I'm trying to escape and reprogram a lifetime of training to be codependent.

It's been one of the hardest things I've done, and I refuse to give up on me.

Meanwhile, my sufferer and I still do fun things together all the time. I can relate with the "no serious discussions" thing - I realize at some point we will HAVE to talk, but for now, the only people who need to "define" our relationship is us - and that can be done at our own pace.

Hugs, if you accept! I'm glad to read your "report". It seems like you're doing awesome job! Do what makes you happy!

 

[Freida]

I don't really feel the need to rehash all of it on his re arrival, because I just want to bask in the joy of his return, so to speak. I

well here's a random to make it even more complicated! :laugh:
I was thinking of my "return" in January and .... I have no idea what we would rehash because I'm so totally out of it emotionally during the month. If hubby said "we need to talk about how you behaved" I would probably get cranky because, well, I don't know how I behaved. I can assume I've pissed people off so I ask him what kind of apologies I need to make and to who. But trying to hold me accountable for behavior that happened when I was checked out? Yea----that would be a problem because if I don't feel anything how do I feel something about it? ouch. :banghead:

 

[NaeNae75]

well here's a random to make it even more complicated! :laugh:
I was thinking of my "return" in January and .... I have no idea what we would rehash because I'm so totally out of it emotionally during the month. If hubby said "we need to talk about how you behaved" I would probably get cranky because, well, I don't know how I behaved. I can assume I've pissed people off so I ask him what kind of apologies I need to make and to who. But trying to hold me accountable for behavior that happened when I was checked out? Yea----that would be a problem because if I don't feel anything how do I feel something about it? ouch. :banghead:

So interesting, but I think I get it totally. That really is the other side of the coin on why trying to talk about it after the fact just really doesn't work. Generally for him, if we talk about it during un-symptomatic times, he withdraws a bit, because it makes him feel poorly about himself. The other aspect of it is exactly what you're pointing out here...he generally doesn't remember. He forgets about some of the good times too, when he's symptomatic. It's kind of funny when you think of it.

Do you think that during some of the times you're in the middle of an isolation period, or the time leading up to it, that you're numb? He usually seems depressed or angry leading up to this, but now he seems almost numb. Like telling me his ability to feel romantic love is broken. He says it started when his friend got killed tragically this spring, and he was numb there for a bit, but then he "thawed" for quite some time, and now he's "numb" again...like he completely forgot the middle part. But this level is sort of a new thing, I think.

Because it's a newer thing, but not totally new, it does worry me a bit here and there. But overall, I think him just starting therapy a couple months ago might be magnifying things. I don't know for sure, because my crystal ball is in the shop....darn it!

 

[Freida]

Do you think that during some of the times you're in the middle of an isolation period, or the time leading up to it, that you're numb? H

hmmmmm this is going to be hard to answer because it's about times when I'm not really here :laugh:

I think it goes like this..... When an anniversary is coming I start getting agitated (polite word for bitch woman from hell). I start to physcially hurt in places that are related to whatever happened then and I start feeling trapped. Air raid sirens start going off in my head regardless of what the anniversary comes from. ESCAPE is the only thing I can think of. It is overwhelming so I start to shut down -- go numb to everything else.

annndddd now that I think about it.....I have two kinds of numb.
There's the numb where I can't interact with people because my brain is eating itself and it is taking everything I have not to board a plane. That's when I'm most likely to shut everyone out. And if you ask me I'll probably tell you nothing is wrong, get away from me, stop talking to me, I don't like you, I hate you, I can't love you, GO AWAY. So I'm not really numb, it just looks like it.

Then there is the numb when I don't care about anything or anyone. That just... happens. I'm not sure why. Maybe overwhelmed? I know I get like that when someone hurts me -- from that point on they are dead to me and it doesn't bother me. I'm numb to THEM. I don't mean to make it sound like it's something I can do on a whim -- more something that just happens at a certain point in my brain.

I think I also get like that when people want to be too close to me when I'm feeling guilty about whatever it is I've done in the past. That might be where he is at now -- badly triggered and unable to face his actions and figures if you knew the truth you would never forgive him. So - overwhelmed = shut down. And yep -- there is no reasoning with that. If there was I would be able to tell hubby about my own actions. But if I try to talk about it my brain just kind of unplugs

I would also guess that something about his friends death has badly triggered him and he's not dealing with it well. What was it? Who knows? Then he got past it and got re-triggered by counseling?

The numb thing is an interesting question. I'm hoping other sufferers will weigh in because I'm curious how it works with them

 

[NaeNae75]

I know I had a period in my past that I spent a portion of my life living that way. I felt like I was doomed to relive trauma over and over and over, that I tuned out so I didn't commit the bad "S" word. It was total survival. I think it happened for a long time after my grandfather passed (he and my grandmother were the only people I completely trusted in my childhood). I just didn't care about anything, even though I was living what looked like a "normal" life on the outside. Maybe more like dissociated. The times I've been numb towards everything, even people I loved, like my kids....was when I was depressed to the point of wanting to end my life. I think I tried to be numb so I could....but then also numb so I didn't because I knew I couldn't leave them alone with the rest of them (the abusers). But I hated almost everyone and everything. I knew I loved them, but I was too overwhelmed to save any of us...but at that extreme it was short lived at any given time - like a couple of hours. I remember staring in my reflection in the mirror talking to myself as if I wasn't even willing to be me because I disgusted myself so much. Yeah...looney tunes!

But I don't know if I've ever been the kind of numb he is...maybe when my "real therapy" started... I honestly can't remember because I don't think I was really there mentally. Maybe that's where he is right now. I know he feels a lot of guilt...no shame. He's ruled by it. This is hard, because there's no "motivation" I can give him that's really going to help until he thaws. I pray he does. I think he will. He seemed a bit better yesterday on the phone....maybe me not pushing anything and him accepting that will help.

This in odd territory for me, a whole different level... I'm not petrified, but I would be lying if I said it didn't make me uneasy. But...I have faith in him, and really I have faith in me. I'll be okay either way, even though I prefer it to be WITH him. lol

I really appreciate all of the time you spend delving into this. It's interesting. Everyone's input is so raw and beautiful!

 

[EveHarrington]

Freida,

If you were told not to run, would you want to run even more?

Cuz that’s where I am right now.

I would have bolted today but my dissociation was too much to drive, and I was in a borrowed car.

It’s not off the table though.

 

[Freida]

If you were told not to run, would you want to run even more?

Lol wave that red flag and watch me go!!

I think it depends on the how and why they were saying it.
Acceptable things to stall me...
Its not safe for you to drive right now
let me come with you - I promise not to talk
Will you do a plan before you go so I know where you are headed if I promise not to contact you
Do you want to stay here and I will leave for a bit? ( good when I just need silence)
Do you want to talk to bestie before you go? (Good when I'm frantic and haven't thought to call her. She is about the only person who can pull me out of a full on run)

Things to say guaranteed to make me bail
Don't you dare
If you take off we are done
Why can't you get it together
Why do you need to leave
Aren't I enough for you ( and all its variations)
You do this every time you ...insert word hereI

I think the biggest thing is when they make it about them. If they are trying to keep me safe that's one thing. If they are all whine whine why are you leaving I'm out.

(Sorry supporters..I know how that sounds ...but........)

 

[EveHarrington]

Lol wave that red flag and watch me go!!

I think it depends on the how and why they were saying it.
Acceptable things to stall me...
Its not safe for you to drive right now
let me come with you - I promise not to talk
Will you do a plan before you go so I know where you are headed if I promise not to contact you
Do you want to stay here and I will leave for a bit? ( good when I just need silence)
Do you want to talk to bestie before you go? (Good when I'm frantic and haven't thought to call her. She is about the only person who can pull me out of a full on run)

Things to say guaranteed to make me bail
Don't you dare
If you take off we are done
Why can't you get it together
Why do you need to leave
Aren't I enough for you ( and all its variations)
You do this every time you ...insert word hereI

I think the biggest thing is when they make it about them. If they are trying to keep me safe that's one thing. If they are all whine whine why are you leaving I'm out.

(Sorry supporters..I know how that sounds ...but........)

On the one hand....

I am being asked to stay so that I can get help. I can’t get help if I run.

On the other hand....

If I run, they want to know where I go. Oh hail no. Where I live, if I run like last time, I could be in one of nine different states, in the amount of time that I drove last time. Right there is my safety, and I refuse to give that up. If I tell them where I am, what is the point in even running? I run to not be found. This is a non-negotiable.

 

[Freida]

I don't necessarily tell them where I will be...just a general direction. I'm headed to somewhere at the beach in my car or I'm flying to Europe or that I don't know. I don't think it is fair to leave them wondering if I'm alive or safe. Which is why I send at least one text a day to tell them I'm still around. I think too it depends on who I'm leaving behind. Hubby or bestie? We now have decades of history so I know how they stress about my safety AND that they will respect my boundaries. But in the early days with them or with someone I don't know as well? Nope. I'm out. I'll text ya so you know I'm not dead..don't ask for any more.

I think it's a trust thing---and that takes a long time to build. For me it takes years before I'm willing to give up my hidey holes.

 

[EveHarrington]

Freida,

My therapist said the two week delay in breaking up was genius! I told her I got the idea online (from you), adapted from your two month divorce rule. She said it gives me a necessary delay when I’m freaking out and running away.

 

[NaeNae75]

Freida,

My therapist said the two week delay in breaking up was genius! I told her I got the idea online (from you), adapted from your two month divorce rule. She said it gives me a necessary delay when I’m freaking out and running away.

Good for you, @EveHarrington !