Relationship He Told Me To Leave So I Gave Him Space And Now He's More Upset

[Kiki]

I love my husband with all my heart. He's the best person I know, he's usually quiet but so polite and sweet. Hes very kind and very supportive of my career, and always wants what's best for me. But that's where the problem is, even when hes having an episode (he's 23 and a combat marine vet with 2 deployments, we've been married for over a year and he's been out a year exactly) he thinks he knows what's best for me. And his idea of what's best is me leaving him bc he thinks he's a burden. Here's what's happened today.

He was trying to buy something online using his laptop. The website was down, I know bc i check on my computer, and to top it off his computer charger wasn't working when his laptop was at 5% battery. I asked him if he wanted me to help him order it over the phone then all of the sudden he snapped his laptop in half and threw it. I had a really rough childhood and even up until my late teens I was scared of my father because he'd break into my mom's house and break stuff during his episodes. I know it sounds weird but when I'm scared I hide in the bathroom because that's what I did with my dad. So I made a beeline to the bathroom and just sat in there collecting myself. He started saying a bunch of stuff and for the past 3 days its been rough with him (we're in the middle of buying a home with his va loan but everything in regards to paperwork is great, we're in escrow right now) so everytime he's started getting triggered I go to the gym or walk around the apartment complex to give him space because he usually says "I dont want you here, leave me alone, don't talk to me" and such. So today I decided to run some errands while he was upset, because I had to run them regardless. His ptsd has caused me to be more independent but when we first got married I was extremely codependent. On the way out he was telling me how I always abandon him and run, which hasn't really been the case I just started giving him space by physically leaving during this week. Previously I'd just go to our bedroom or my computer room. Anyways in the 10 minutes I was at the grocery store he blew up my phone with calls and texts telling me to "not come back home" and that he "doesn't want to be married to me" because he's "so f*cked up and a bad husband" and he pretty much repeats that idea but with more colorful words. I Reply after I'm done at the store bc i didn't want to go in looking like i just cried. So when I reply I tell him "I was getting the water and I'm going to the gym after but I'll be home" he starts accusing me of being with another man and that I shouldn't come back and that all my stuff is going to be outside.

So I didn't come back. I got scared. I called his best friend and asked him for help. His bf said that my husband wasn't picking up so when the bf got back in town he'd check on him in person. My husband ended up answering his bf (5 hours later) and then the best friend told me that I could go home and justin seemed fine. He was wrong. My husband was not fine. At all.

I had been gone for about 7 or 8 hours total and in those hours he took all of my stuff; clothing, toiletries, books, shoes, everything, and put it all in the living room. So when I got home from being at only the gym, grocery store, and with a friend, I was shocked that all my stuff was in the living room. I took a bag of toiletries to the bathroom and unpacked them quietly then took and shower. When I got out I went straight to bed
He came in the room and told me I "abandoned him" and that I "ran away." And then he kept saying "admit it" so i replied which wasnt the smartest move because he was upset. But I said "I love you, I went to the grocery store and was giving you space because you were mad, I love you" and he kept telling me I abandoned him and that I dont love him and called me a liar. Then he told me I better not be here still when he gets back from his night shift at work. This is at 10:40pm

So after he locks the door I wait. Then I go clean up the mess. I put back all my stuff. I tape the blinds he ripped up. And I did the dishes bc we made an agreement previously during the week when he was balanced about me doing the dishes before he comes home from work. So he comes home at 5am and flips on the lights. Our cats all greet him and he asks them (we talk to our cats) "is she gone? Did she leave?" Then he goes back to check outside I guess to see if I'm out there somewhere. Then comes back in and comes to the bedroom sees me laying down. I pretend to sleep bc honestly I'm tired and don't want to say anything wrong. He wakes me up and asks me for my pair of car keys to our shared car. I tell him no, he doesn't argue much and then goes into the living room. He been in there watching TV. Now he's alseep on the couch.

So he's only done this thing where he moves my stuff once before. It was about a year ago when he was still in the marine core on active duty. I visited him and planned on staying with him for a month. He had an episode, which at the time was far far far more intense than this one. But I ran in the middle of his episode and he didn't chase me, so I just kept going and ran in the darkness of joshua tree, ca at 1am in the morning with nowhere to go. His mom picked me up bc honestly it was stupid of me to do that, there's all kinds of animals out there and it was freezing. We sat in her car for a bit. But when we got back to the house all of my stuff was in the living room. By the time everything cooled over a few days later he explained that he felt abandoned. He has abandonment issued from childhood bc after his parents divorce in highschool his dad moved from california all the way to alabama to run away from his mom. So I told him I wouldn't run from him again. Fast forward a year later here we are having the same argument.

I typed all this out because I have no where to turn or anyone to talk to. I've been on and off the phone with the veteran crisis hotline but every time it's a different person. And I don't want to talk to friends about it because none of them have dealt with veterans or ptsd. The closest vet center (they offer counceling for spouses/family of vets and vets) to me is an hour away and it's clear I can't leave for that long or go that far atm or he'll panic and get paranoid.

I'd really appreciate it if anyone gave me some feedback. I miss my husband and I'm worried about him. Our apartment is really small so it's hard to give him space in here when theres literally only 4 rooms of space.

 

[Kiki]

Also I forgot to add this: he was willing to go to couples counceling through the vet center before his episode. But during this episode he said he'd never go. He previously went to one on one counceling for about a month for his ptsd, 4 months ago. But stopped going bc the therapist was triggering him. Tbh I don't think the therapist was trained to work with veterans bc he kept making my husband relive his worst deployment memories but "with a more positive outlook" so it was all really off putting and now my husbands really not into the idea of going to counciling.

 

[TheMinsterman]

Sounds a lot like the push and pull dynamic.

My SO/ExSO does this a lot, pushes me away, wants to be left alone, wants to "just friends" etc, then on any other given day she is upset at a self-deprecating Facebook post about being alone with wine on valentines day, saying she feels she is missing a piece etc. There seems to be extreme swings between get the hell away and no, please, I don't want you to go away.

It used to really phase me, now I've sort of taken it as what she will be like in the midst of a bad episode.

 

[Virtues]

Kiki, not a supporter, but I am a Marine, so I feel like I have some insight to give to your situation. It sounds to me like this is not his PTSD but rather his abandonment issues. It sounds to me like this was a problem even before his deployments from what you've said above. True, his PTSD is more than likely compounding the issue, but the heart of the problem sounds like it runs deeper than his PTSD. I can tell you (and everyone is different) I have never played a "push-pull" game with my wife like he is with you. Tell her to leave than get mad at her when she does; there are some deep rooted issues there that are not combat related. I have felt often that my wife would be better off without me; I have even gone as far as packing a bag and leaving. I have tried suicide because I've thought that was my only way out. I have never told my wife to get out of our house though. I have never told her to leave and then accused her of cheating on me. When he tells you to leave he wants you to stay and take the mental/emotional abuse. That's what this is ABUSE! I'm sorry to be so blunt, but PTSD does not = the right to abuse someone, and I get sick of people (especially vets) playing that card. I'm not you, but if I were you I would give him this ultimatum (and be damn ready to back it up) either you get into individual & couples therapy or I am leaving and I am never coming back. You may think that's what he wants because he put all your stuff on the living room floor, but trust me, there is nothing that scares him more than the idea of being alone. You have to be prepared not to come back though, or he will never get the help he needs. This is just my opinion. From my perspective this is NOT his PTSD this is something else.

 

[Powder]

The "good stress" of successfully buying a house could actually be adding to his reactivity. I know 'excitement' over life changes like this can also add to my PTSD being more noticed in my body with faster heart rate. I don't notice this, until there's a loud sound or something, and then, I jump about four feet into the air.

I have done some of what your husband has done, in fact, just weeks ago, when I was very upset by some of my husband's behavior that I still think is not great, but I catastrophize about it, like suddenly, he's changed into someone else, or that he was always this way and I just have been making excuses or in denial.

I agree with Florian that the Abandonment issue is part of PTSD, but seems to stem or have roots in childhood and/or his first romantic relationship.

Was he abandoned by a romantic partner early in his life? If so, he could be waiting for that abandonment to play out, because deep down the hurt is still there and the trauma of it left its mark.

There could be a "too good to be true" fear going on with the home purchase and with you. You work out, you're responsible, and this may be a bit threatening, in that with his PTSD diagnosis, which, for me, took over a decade to accept deep down, probably makes him feel vulnerable.

 

[Kiki]

Kiki, not a supporter, but I am a Marine, so I feel like I have some insight to give to your situat...

Hey Florian, thanks so much for your reply! I definitely know I'm being emotionally abused. And when he's in the right mind he admits his behavior is detrimental and that he needs to stop. But admitting is one thing and taking action is another. But hes fully aware of how hes hurting me, hes just really lost right now. I don't mean to keep making excuses for him, and he's even called me out about enabling his bad behaviors towards me, so I know I need to set boundaries and stick to them. I always cave in because I feel guilty about his suffering.

He does have abandonment issues, and he talks about them when he can. But thats where the PTSD kicks in and all of the sudden its him against the world, there's no grey area and everything is black or white. And everyones an enemy. It also doesnt help that he has TBI, which a therapist told me could be the cause of his emotional numbness. I know that I cant take this any longer because it's starting to damage my mental and physical health. It's hard for me to eat when I get anxious and during his last big episode where he left for a week, I lost 15lbs. I'm 5ft6in and weigh 125lb. I've never weighed so little at this height. So I know this cant continue because I'll have nothing left to give. Since we're in the middle of buying a home, and I'm doing the paperwork for the majority of it, I cant abruptly give him an ultimatum and leave. It could possibly put us in a place where we'd both be homeless. So until we have the stability of a home I can't make any moves that could cause us to lose a home that we're so so so close to getting.

An update on the situation: I sat with him in silence and watched a documentary for about an hour on the couch. He didn't tell me to leave or anything. After the documentary I put another one on for him then got up to go to the computer room. He asked me from the other room if I called the realtor yet to tell them that "we don't want the house." I told him I don't plan on doing that. And he said that I "better get ready to pay half the mortgage."

He's made a threat like that before when he was mad, that I need to pay "my half of the rent" because we're "roommates and no longer married" but then he tells me that he'll never file for divorce and keeps harassing me to serve him papers when he's having a mood swing. Then after the rage passes a day or two later, maybe even a week, he'll tell me he's sorry and that he didn't mean it. When he comes back around on his own, I'm going to tell him that he needs to go to couples therapy or individual therapy.

 

[Kiki]

The "good stress" of successfully buying a house could actually be adding to his reactivity. I know 'excite...

You're completely right about the "good stress" part. Before his episode he told me that he's really excited and happy about getting this home because it was the one that we really wanted and he wants stability. And he also was raving about how hes excited for his dad to see our new house and was hoping that this new home would give his dad a reason to come to california for a visit. I felt heart broken when I heard him say that because his dad is a flake the majority of the time, I assured him that we'd be living there for a long long time and if his dad doesn't come right away then he'll probably visit eventually.

We went to the same high school before he got sent to bootcamp, he enlisted when he was 17, so I know who his first girlfriend was when he was on his first deployment. She was his first horrible romantic experience. Over all that woman was horrible, like terribly insensitive and very flirty, and also tried to entrap him by faking a pregnancy. She cheated on him during his enlistment and he never knew who it was with. But during their argument she told him, TRIGGER WARNING "I hope you get blown up when you go over seas." After that they stopped talking. Later on when me and him started talking, he brought up his ex, and I made the terrible mistake of telling him who she cheated on him with. It was one of his close buddies from our hometown. When I say this woman was awful she was so past terrible. The reason I know who she cheated on him with is because she was blabbing to half of our hometown (its small where we're from and our highschool grad class was even smaller) about how the man she cheated on my husband with was "so much bigger, because hes black." She was just really racist and horrible. Anyways moving past that my husband is still very sensitive about the whole situation, I myself am a biracial black woman, and he gets really nervous that I'd leave him for someone of the same race for the same reasons why his ex cheated on him. I've tried to tell him so many times that I love him for him, and that when we have sex I'm satisfied fully because he's not selfish at all and listens to me. But his ex really really did a number on him.

He always tells me that it is too good to be true, because unlike a lot of other people in his life, I don't say things out of anger. Because I know you cant take them back. So he's been getting his way for a while and i've been giving him a lot of slack because of the transitioning to civilian life. And on top of all of this my mom is a mail man and we got the counter offer on the house solely because my mom know the family who lived there. So he knows how much of a "too good to be true" blessing this really is, and hes openly stated that.

 

[Kiki]

Sounds a lot like the push and pull dynamic.

My SO/ExSO does this a lot, pushes me away, wants t...

Yeah I'm starting to get that way, like I expect him to do the push and pull. But he had an episode that wasn't too back about a week ago and he remained pretty in control for being so angry. Thats why I'm so shocked that it got to this level yesterday

 

[Virtues]

Kiki, I also suffer from a TBI, but I don't think that's what causes the emotional numbness. As terrible as war was, as awful as it was, there was something compelling about it. This is probably what is making your husband's transition so hard. We did what we did day in and day out and we never felt so alive as we did when we were so close to dying. Our bodies were flooded with Cortisol, adrenaline, & norepinephrine in large quantities on a daily basis. It was like the biggest rush, or high you could have created. Then we came back to this life and nothing seemed to make us feel anymore. There are a couple videos that really do a good job at explaining this phenomenon about why vets miss war. I think this will definitely give you some insight into what your husband is going through right now. The man who does these videos is not a vet, but he is a war correspondent who was at Restrepo Afghanistan. They are a couple really short TED talks and give some incredibly profound insight. I really hope you watch them.

Sebastian Junger: Why veterans miss war

Sebastian Junger Our lonely society makes it hard to come home from war.

The last video kind of steers away from PTSD which I'm not saying your husband doesn't have PTSD (because I have PTSD too) but I still found the video to be very helpful as the point he was trying to make about the "alienation" of society still affects us, and I think is only compounded by having PTSD and makes the alienation that much worse.

 

[Kiki]

Kiki, I also suffer from a TBI, but I don't think that's what causes the emotional numbness. As te...

Thanks Florian! I'm going to watch those videos, I've been on the internet doing so much research but sometimes it more of a civilian perspective. so I'm glad that you're sending me ones that you think will be helpful. It means a lot. He always talks about how he feels useless now that hes not using the skills he learned in infantry, he was a machine gunner and a sniper. Before he met me he planned on joining some type of private non-US military group that fights isis, im not really sure what that means or what it is. But after we got married he said he couldn't live life that dangerously while being with me and now his responsibilities have changed. He works as a freight stalker right now at a grocery store and he told me that he feels horrible and annoyed that the fact that he's capable of doing more meaningful stuff but instead hes stocking groceries at 4am. He only got the job to help us qualify for the VA house loan, and plans on quitting it and going to a tech school after we get the house. I know he misses the idea of protecting and helping in a way thats immediate and uses his gun skill set. I feel really guilty about the fact that he hates his job so much but hes making the sacrifice of maintaining it so we can get this house. I told him he could quit and I could pick up a second job that's not freelance, and he gets really upset about that because he wants to be the sole provider so I can continue working from home.

if it's not too much can you give me some tips and feedback about your transitioning period from the mc to civilian life? How did you cope, and did you decide to get help yourself or did someone have to help you get there?

 

[Virtues]

I was in complete denial. I was still active duty when my symptoms were at their worst. I had everyone fooled except for my wife. When the war ended in Iraq and the Marine Corps started to retrograde I was lost and felt useless without a purpose (I was a Corporal at the time). I did a lateral move into Crash Fire rescue. I figured a new job (now that the war was over) and one that would keep me home, out of the field, would be all I would need to get things back on track. I coped with my symptoms by sinking into my work. Because I was a lat-mover I had a lot of catching up to do. I was the honor graduate at my school, I finished top of my class, I fast tracked to Sergeant at my first duty station, but all the while my symptoms were getting worse and worse. The episodes of rage were becoming uncontrollable. I was starting to lash out at work. I was starting to bring my work home with me. I was becoming severely paranoid, thinking that everyone I worked with had it in for me, and all the while was taking everything out on my wife. As a Crash Fire Rescue specialist I ran my fair share of bullshit calls on the flight line and a few medical calls but nothing could prepare me for what I was about to find one February evening in 2013. The years of mental abuse had taken their toll on my wife, and she could not see any way out. She decided to attempt to take her own life by over dosing on a month's supply of klonopin. I wish I could tell you that this was my wake up call but sadly it was not. My wife survived, and within a month I would run another medical call on my house only this time for my daughter who had a fall from her bunk bed crushing the roof and floor of her left orbital, breaking her nose, crushing the floor of her right orbital, basilar skull fracture, and broken occiptal bone. This was the start of my falling apart. We almost lost her in the hospital and the whole time my command was absent, not one phone call, no one from my command showed up to see if we were OK, nothing. When I returned home I was expecting a CISD (critical incident stress debrief) but instead Child Services was waiting on my doorstep wanting to investigate me for child abuse. My command responded by launching an investigation. The investigation was pretty cut and dry, there was no abuse and it was easy to prove, so the investigation ended very quickly, but my hatred for my command grew and grew. I tell you all of this because this is what led to me finally ending up in counseling. By this time I was a maniac. I was the type of guy that was doing 100 mph, weaving in and out of traffic, picking a fight with with someone at a stop light. And it's just that scenario that led me to treatment. At a stop sign one day, with my kids in my truck, I got out of my vehicle with a crash ax in hand, drug a guy from his car, laid him out on his hood and brought my arm back to swing. The only thing that kept me from swinging is the guy had a little lap dog in his car that was barking at me that kind of snapped me out of it. I literally casually got back in my truck and drove away as if nothing had happened. When I got home I broke down into tears and begged my wife to help me. I joined the Marine Corps to help people, I became a firefighter to help people, and here I was becoming what I swore an oath to protect against. In less than 24 hours arrangements were being made to get me in to an inpatient hospital in San Antonio TX. It was here that I was diagnosed with PTSD and unfortunately what started my processing out of the Marine Corps. Since I have been out I have been to several inpatient programs (all by free will) and I am also part of an intense outpatient program were I attend group therapy 5 days a week, individual therapy once a week, and up until recently I was also doing equine therapy once a week, I also meet with my psychiatrist monthly to monitor my medication. My recovery has become like a full time job; I take it very seriously. I want to get better more than anything. What helped me through the transition period more than anything was the equine therapy, and being around other OIF/OEF vets. Don't get me wrong, I still have days, weeks that are bad, but they are becoming less intense and less frequent. The VetCenter is a great resource but another thing to look into is to see if the VA by you has a PRRC (Psychosocial Rehabilitation and Recovery Center) also I would highly recommend equine therapy if there is anywhere near you that does it.

 

[talon]

I love my husband with all my heart. He's the best person I know, he's usually quiet but so polite and swe...

I have not real all this because first few lines i found distressing but the fact is this man has a personality as we all do and having PTSD does not excuse him from bad behaviour. Don't ignore the signs as often verbal abuse can escalate and become serious . You need ground rules and a structured response. He cannot treat you this way because this has nothing to do with anything other than it's who he is. If you can have some respite away that's good . Write him suggesting you have counselling but you cannot go on this way you have a life to . It's his problem but you have offered support and you cannot do anymore than keep yourself safe . Some people hide behind their Mental illness to get their way not acceptable