UnKnown-Self
Diamond Member
Another thread sidetracked to the topic of manipulation and I found many of the opinions/thoughts about it interesting. It seemed to touch a chord in people. Some had varying interpretations of what it meant and how it was defined in terms of, presumed thoughts of others, actions of others and even of themselves.
Of course I have my own interpretation and yes the topic does strike a very deep chord in me. So much and so deep I almost didn't start this post but I needed to say it enough so here I am.
There seemed to be a distaste for the word manipulation/ manipulative. Well not the word but what it means to each person and how it makes them feel.
Can I be manipulative? Damn straight l can. Especially with some ex-partners and family members.
Pausing long enough to let them think they "won" that particular round and then push that button while thinking to myself, now how do you like that MFer ? As they went into the projected and yes, enjoyably anticipated spaz. I had my exit planned already and was executing it by hanging up, walking out, driving away, whatever. The point was to have the element of surprise with the last vicious jab that would push the desired button, get the desired reaction and have the last word.
For that round anyway. Of course it worked both ways.
I never had that for the eight years I had with my husband. I learned life can be different and I realized I wanted a different life. He would not tolerate it from my family (the word family used in this post does not include my children) and they tread carefully and respected his boundaries.
I cut off all communication with my family last year when he passed. I knew it was a game changer and I no longer had a taste for the game. Now, I was to learn hubby and clan played the game too but differently enough that I didn't recognize it. It doesn't matter. What matters is l changed and for the better and I like it and I want more.
Can people still push my buttons? Most definitely but I work at handling it differently. I still have a lot of work to do but I'm better than I was. I hope, I Believe, I KNOW I will continue to get better.
Now, on the thread that prompted this post, "I interpreted" some of the things being said kind of implying people who suffer PTSD or other disorders as not intentionally being manipulative so it wasn't really manipulation.
I am not referring to talked about specific actions by specific people. Please, I want that to be very clear because I don't want anyone to think I am judging or secretly talking about them. I would not do that and that is certainly not how I want this post to be interpreted. I'm doing some work.
This was more of quoting medical experts to say we can't know someone's intent and something tossed in about dissociation.
Again I'm not pointing fingers, I just found "my interpretation" of what was being said interesting.
I got the impression it was being suggested most people with PTSD or other disorders don't have the smarts or the skills to manipulate or most on the forum, that part "for my purposes" is unimportant.
It is my opinion that a great majority of those with PTSD especially developmental/complex PTSD learned manipulation well and it served them as a survival skill. They had to, it was necessary to get through or out of situations.
That does not make them lifetime addicts to manipulation and one can lose their taste for it and choose a different way, like myself.
But there are those who do get addicted. I'll even go out on a limb and suggest that most of the perpetrators who inflicted their poison on the majority of us in this forum who suffer with developmental/complex PTSD were abused long before they became abusers and had complex PTSD/BPD and landed somewhere high on the dissociative spectrum without having full blown DID or maybe they did. It's not important.
They were certainly master manipulators because those who choose to actively and deliberately inflict abuse at some level are addicted to the power and they enjoy wielding it and part of wielding that power is manipulating us to believe it either didn't happen or it was our fault.
They made the choice to go in the direction they did, just like we made the choice not to go in that direction.
So we struggle and retrain our brain and we work so damn hard to simply manage. Sometimes we fall but we get back up. We get back up as many times as it takes because that is what we choose. It takes smarts and determination and resourcefulness that the average person has no clue about. We are survival geniuses.
Now what I'm about to say next is not for drama purposes but just something to think about and not in a paranoid way.
The odds are pretty high there are some in the forum who are manipulators and abusers. It's simple statistics. It's a place too ripe for some to resist.
We are all adults and responsible for our actions and our choices. This is a great place, No this is an excellent, quality forum for doing the work. That's what brings me here.
One more thing... A lot of pain, struggle, tears and snot went into writing this post and I am at this very moment crying and shaking and at the same time congratulating myself for screwing up the courage to push that "Create Thread" button.
Of course I have my own interpretation and yes the topic does strike a very deep chord in me. So much and so deep I almost didn't start this post but I needed to say it enough so here I am.
There seemed to be a distaste for the word manipulation/ manipulative. Well not the word but what it means to each person and how it makes them feel.
Can I be manipulative? Damn straight l can. Especially with some ex-partners and family members.
Pausing long enough to let them think they "won" that particular round and then push that button while thinking to myself, now how do you like that MFer ? As they went into the projected and yes, enjoyably anticipated spaz. I had my exit planned already and was executing it by hanging up, walking out, driving away, whatever. The point was to have the element of surprise with the last vicious jab that would push the desired button, get the desired reaction and have the last word.
For that round anyway. Of course it worked both ways.
I never had that for the eight years I had with my husband. I learned life can be different and I realized I wanted a different life. He would not tolerate it from my family (the word family used in this post does not include my children) and they tread carefully and respected his boundaries.
I cut off all communication with my family last year when he passed. I knew it was a game changer and I no longer had a taste for the game. Now, I was to learn hubby and clan played the game too but differently enough that I didn't recognize it. It doesn't matter. What matters is l changed and for the better and I like it and I want more.
Can people still push my buttons? Most definitely but I work at handling it differently. I still have a lot of work to do but I'm better than I was. I hope, I Believe, I KNOW I will continue to get better.
Now, on the thread that prompted this post, "I interpreted" some of the things being said kind of implying people who suffer PTSD or other disorders as not intentionally being manipulative so it wasn't really manipulation.
I am not referring to talked about specific actions by specific people. Please, I want that to be very clear because I don't want anyone to think I am judging or secretly talking about them. I would not do that and that is certainly not how I want this post to be interpreted. I'm doing some work.
This was more of quoting medical experts to say we can't know someone's intent and something tossed in about dissociation.
Again I'm not pointing fingers, I just found "my interpretation" of what was being said interesting.
I got the impression it was being suggested most people with PTSD or other disorders don't have the smarts or the skills to manipulate or most on the forum, that part "for my purposes" is unimportant.
It is my opinion that a great majority of those with PTSD especially developmental/complex PTSD learned manipulation well and it served them as a survival skill. They had to, it was necessary to get through or out of situations.
That does not make them lifetime addicts to manipulation and one can lose their taste for it and choose a different way, like myself.
But there are those who do get addicted. I'll even go out on a limb and suggest that most of the perpetrators who inflicted their poison on the majority of us in this forum who suffer with developmental/complex PTSD were abused long before they became abusers and had complex PTSD/BPD and landed somewhere high on the dissociative spectrum without having full blown DID or maybe they did. It's not important.
They were certainly master manipulators because those who choose to actively and deliberately inflict abuse at some level are addicted to the power and they enjoy wielding it and part of wielding that power is manipulating us to believe it either didn't happen or it was our fault.
They made the choice to go in the direction they did, just like we made the choice not to go in that direction.
So we struggle and retrain our brain and we work so damn hard to simply manage. Sometimes we fall but we get back up. We get back up as many times as it takes because that is what we choose. It takes smarts and determination and resourcefulness that the average person has no clue about. We are survival geniuses.
Now what I'm about to say next is not for drama purposes but just something to think about and not in a paranoid way.
The odds are pretty high there are some in the forum who are manipulators and abusers. It's simple statistics. It's a place too ripe for some to resist.
We are all adults and responsible for our actions and our choices. This is a great place, No this is an excellent, quality forum for doing the work. That's what brings me here.
One more thing... A lot of pain, struggle, tears and snot went into writing this post and I am at this very moment crying and shaking and at the same time congratulating myself for screwing up the courage to push that "Create Thread" button.
