- Post starter
- #13
oh my gosh thank you. I just laughed for the first time in like 3 days. this is perfect. I don't owe him a damn thing. I'm still laughing at this. That's not my normal of thinking. AT ALL!
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Do you ever feel hurt when your t is late for appointments?
- Post starter hithere
- Start date
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My T frequently runs 5-10 minutes late, whether it's because she has a session run over or because she gets the late. It used to bother me but 4 years in I expect it. She is an amazing, compassionate individual and I need that more than I need someone who is in time. That said, it sounds like it's more than tardiness going on with your T. It sounds like some trust issues were violated.
G
Guest
I had temporarily changed my time to see t over a 6 week period. First 3 sessions, he was 10 mins late . Walking out with another female client. I felt unimportant and hundred of other things that i can write a book about.
After 3rd session, i made another appt same week and discussed this with him. He was very defensive. Made excuses.
I was able to tell him everything that i interpreted by his behaviour.
His response was okay. He promised he will try to be on time with me n everyone else. I changed my time and it never happened again. I also noticed that he added another 30 min. Extra after the appt with the girl. He used to see her at 1pm. Me at 2pm. Now he sees next client at 2:30pm.
So he took my complaint seriously and made changes. He had no valid answer to why he ran 10 mins late for 3 appts in a row with me due to the same prev. Client.
Was i hurt? Yes and so much more.
After 3rd session, i made another appt same week and discussed this with him. He was very defensive. Made excuses.
I was able to tell him everything that i interpreted by his behaviour.
His response was okay. He promised he will try to be on time with me n everyone else. I changed my time and it never happened again. I also noticed that he added another 30 min. Extra after the appt with the girl. He used to see her at 1pm. Me at 2pm. Now he sees next client at 2:30pm.
So he took my complaint seriously and made changes. He had no valid answer to why he ran 10 mins late for 3 appts in a row with me due to the same prev. Client.
Was i hurt? Yes and so much more.
joeylittle
Sponsor
Re-opened
- Post starter
- #17
I asked for this thread to be opened up again even those it's been 1 1/2 years ago. I don't see @UnicornSightings on here anymore, but still wanted to respond to their comments. Hopefully, some random person seeking treatment, or better, a therapist trying to get perspective of a patient will read this and learn.
@UnicornSightings was right in a comment when they said "I feel this therapist is not good for you." They were correct. Also, there was so much wisdom in saying if the therapist reacts defensively when you ask to talk about it, get the hell out of there. I only wish I could have gotten the hell out of there.
I want to add to this, but every time I start writing here I get very upset and start crying. I may come back here to finish. The point I wanted to make is that I had written out in bullet points the things I needed to talk about--what my fears are concerning the late for appointments, and what I needed to feel safe. The therapist did become VERY DEFENSIVE. The following actions are still so painful I can't write anymore here. (even 1 1/2 years later) It was shocking. I'm having trouble recovering from it. Thanks for re-opening the thread. I need to stop ruminating over it and I"m having trouble doing so.
- Post starter
- #18
So I'm going to try and write here about what happened almost two years ago in therapy in June, 2017. I will need to only write a little bit at a time, as it has ended up sticking inside me and injuring me. No matter what I've tried, it keeps coming back up. I decided to treat it as a "trauma" in and of itself, because, honestly, to me that is what it was. I feel betrayed by this therapist on a very deep level for multiple reasons, even though they did not try to have sex with me or anything like that. What happened those two days in therapy so very much resemble the emotions and actions of the original traumatic event that I was trying to process. I think that is why it is still very painful, and keeps emerging over and over.
One of the classic thing I learn about therapy is the whole what happens to the client if the therapist is late? Before I experienced it myself, I thought that cannot be. This is so cliche. But from what I learned in my own experience, if I get super upset by waiting, I am already triggered. If I close my eyes and meditate or finish off the book or the article I was reading and lateness pass by so fast, I know I am not triggered. I just acknowledge the two feelings for the same situation. This has been my experience.
On your post here, I am shocked by two things: The T talking about you to another person while you wait. WTF. I mean do this people email and live in 21 century?2nd, your reaction (right or wrong) is a goldmine for therapy to get to the bottom of things and for T to say you are upset therefore no talking about that is like why even bother going to therapy at all if I need to be happy camper all the time? just reading your post evoked those thoughts/feelings in me.
Another thing that caught my eyes in your consequence responses was also telling something:
I am really sorry you experience this. this is more or less re-traumatizing. you know you are not really 11yrs old and this T is not exactly doing that which happened then, but what he is doing is scratching the same wound that (most likely become implicit memories you need the therapy for in order to release it) and makes them explicit memories and fresh wounds. it is dangerous to associate today's experience to replicate the trauma. IMHO, this is how people become more f*cked up in the service of therapy or therapist that is not mindful, trauma informed or egoistical. you are not blind and you can use this experience to your advantage...like OK you lost control like this when you were 11 and it was just that much more complicated because you were a child. At least now you are an adult and can even fire this person but then you could not. you can compare and contrast the feelings of this incident from the trauma it is reminding you and compare the consciousness and the power difference.
This is what the T supposed to help you with. Oooh Hithere, i see you are upset about waiting for me, do you want to tell me more about your feelings or what feelings evoked and go on to show you how this feeling is related to your trauma so you could process. What he did is shut you down consciously while you are there in the trauma memory AGAIN and it is dangerous as you noted. It truly is. I dumped two therapists for this reason alone and they thought therapists cannot be emphatic all the time. I was like yeah but you can apologize for your failure too just like everybody else in the world. NOPE. I left. I am not recommending you do the same cause you know your T more than me and can assess and determine the next step but from what you post here, it seems a great empathy failure if there ever was one.
On your post here, I am shocked by two things: The T talking about you to another person while you wait. WTF. I mean do this people email and live in 21 century?2nd, your reaction (right or wrong) is a goldmine for therapy to get to the bottom of things and for T to say you are upset therefore no talking about that is like why even bother going to therapy at all if I need to be happy camper all the time? just reading your post evoked those thoughts/feelings in me.
Another thing that caught my eyes in your consequence responses was also telling something:
I am really sorry you experience this. this is more or less re-traumatizing. you know you are not really 11yrs old and this T is not exactly doing that which happened then, but what he is doing is scratching the same wound that (most likely become implicit memories you need the therapy for in order to release it) and makes them explicit memories and fresh wounds. it is dangerous to associate today's experience to replicate the trauma. IMHO, this is how people become more f*cked up in the service of therapy or therapist that is not mindful, trauma informed or egoistical. you are not blind and you can use this experience to your advantage...like OK you lost control like this when you were 11 and it was just that much more complicated because you were a child. At least now you are an adult and can even fire this person but then you could not. you can compare and contrast the feelings of this incident from the trauma it is reminding you and compare the consciousness and the power difference.
This is what the T supposed to help you with. Oooh Hithere, i see you are upset about waiting for me, do you want to tell me more about your feelings or what feelings evoked and go on to show you how this feeling is related to your trauma so you could process. What he did is shut you down consciously while you are there in the trauma memory AGAIN and it is dangerous as you noted. It truly is. I dumped two therapists for this reason alone and they thought therapists cannot be emphatic all the time. I was like yeah but you can apologize for your failure too just like everybody else in the world. NOPE. I left. I am not recommending you do the same cause you know your T more than me and can assess and determine the next step but from what you post here, it seems a great empathy failure if there ever was one.
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- Post starter
- #22
@Muttly Thank you so much for the support. @NightSky Thank you for listening. @grit thank you so much for your comment.
I will be adding to this as I 'm able. The real painful part came on the following session. Every time I start to write about what happened at the next session, I can't continue. It seems small when written out, but it really rocked me deeply. More to follow.
I will be adding to this as I 'm able. The real painful part came on the following session. Every time I start to write about what happened at the next session, I can't continue. It seems small when written out, but it really rocked me deeply. More to follow.
- Post starter
- #23
I’d been seeing the therapist for 8 months. He was helpful. He was nice and attentive, and that contributed to me trusting him.
I had been living in distress trying hard to avoid memories and feelings and thoughts surrounding a particular traumatic rape by two men when I was a preteen. I had never uttered anything about this event to anyone ever. (It is complicated because it led to some life-changing situations that lasted for decades & even going on now) I went into the sessions week after week for 4 months trying to tell the traumatic story and I would end up just sitting there completely unable to speak. The words would just freeze in my throat and I'd say nothing.
The kind therapist would say things like, "evenutally you will tell me." On other days he’d say, "I'm patient, but I'm a short-term therapist so I can't be patient forever." One day at the psychiatrist office I had a full-on movie-style flashback of the traumatic event because of the way the office is configured and something that happened that triggered me. That intrusive memory was coarsing through me at a 1,000 volts of electricity for about a month leading up to the appointment that I originally posted about above at the beginning of this thread.
He had been very late 4 times in row; very late. Sessions are 45 minutes sharp and he came out after I had been waiting for 15 minutes very anxious about sharing the traumatic event. I write about that session above. I was so confused and taken aback when he looked at me and said because of my mood he wouldn’t talk to me further in that session.
So after posting here on myptsd and some suggestions to bring it up to him at the next session, I decided I would go the next session and tell him how I was feeling and talk with him about my thoughts. I went to the next session (after the original post above) with a bullet point list of questions to ask before I shared the trauma.
The list included telling the therapist I needed a lot of encouraging words said to me in order to continue trying to share. I needed to hear that it was hard work to try and do therapy and I needed to hear from him things like "good job , keep trying," and "this is hard, I understand." I was trying to ask for that. I was so nervous to share the trauma and so nervous to ask for help. So nervous to ask for assurance that I was, indeed, welcome and that his tardiness was not an indication of procrastinating to see me.
I wanted to bring up how I felt when he said because of my mood (I was upset) that he wouldn’t talk to me. So, I brought up the first two points and he jumped backwards in his seat and said,, "no one who knows me would ever say these things about me!" I was REALLY very confused when he said that--what things was I saying? He then commanded, "You need to hurry up and share your trauma now! You are running out of time!" He was stiff & his face not friendly (at all).
I really wanted to please him and obey any rules, so quickly said, "ok," and abandoned any idea of trying to get an understanding of the previous session. I forced myself to hand him another paper I had written details about the traumatic events that "set up" the trauma. I set up the storyline in writing on this paper. I handed him the paper and said, "here you can read this--but I can't tell you the details of the middle part yet, but after you read this, I will tell you the end part where I have strong memories."
He read it and when finished he looked at me and then I spit out the words: "so the last thing I remember is me crawling away on my hands and knees into the bathroom and laying down against the door so they couldn't get in. And they were pushing on the door against my body and I could see their laughing faces through the crack of the door," I literally spit those words out quickly while leaning forward in my chair, with no eye contact. He responded immediately, "So what? - he raped you."
—silence…… (it really sounded like he spoke it in a tone that meant: "big deal. so what" (I was stunned. I felt slapped. I about died inside)
He shook the paper in his hand, (I was now looking at him) and he said "is this what has taken you four months to tell me?" I said, "Yes." He responded, "Why did you want to tell me this?" His tone was demanding. I was just struck in my heart at the question--I was bewildered.
My mind raced with the thoughts, weren't we doing therapy? While my mind raced for an answer he said, "Well... I imagine that you want to be unburdened by it. I imagine that you would want to receive care. But I can't give that to you because you cause me stress. You cause me distress. " Then he glared at me.s
All the humiliating emotions of the trauma were tangibly hanging in the air, I looked at him so bewildered. He started pointing into the air with his two index fingers and said, "You are here,- you are there- you are over here. Sessions with you are difficult-- you are always all over the place." Then he dropped his arms and looked at me with disgust. He started counting on his fingers saying, "1.) the level of anxiety you have is stressful for me, 2.) the level of distress you are in. … (silence) … He paused, looking at me with serious disdain. “What exactly did you hope to hear from me?” (--silence—)“Because nothing I say ever seems good enough for you.-- The level of anxiety you have," he shook his head and then just looked at me with a look that said, "you're an awful person"
At this, an internal shift happened inside me. I felt a huge distressing "wailing" rising up inside of me, but I had to stifle it and take control of it. I knew I had to walk out of the medical complex past other patients and personnel, past a big fancy lobby that is crowded with people coming and going. I had to walk outside into my community as my work office is just across the street. I knew I could very well see anyone I work with or personally know in the halls and elevators of the building. The "professional me" who deals with difficult work scenarios took over and calmly and quietly (and submissively as possible) asked, "are you saying you have hurt feelings?"
He put his hand on his chest, and said "yes, sometimes I feel hurt." I quietly nodded and looked at him with submission and a calm demeanor. He handed me the paper, and said "put that away. Your time is up. " The look on his face is hard to describe. Detest is the only word I can use. I felt "detested." I was lost and I was confused. I was mostly mortified, humiliated, and ashamed.
I walked out of the room. I walked into the elevator. Inside the lobby I walked past the four greeters at the info-desk who smiled and said, goodbye. I nodded back at them, walked out into the sunshine. I walked to my car.
Unfortunately, standing next to my car I felt another part of me inside, I felt very detached from this person who was me, very stupidly, foolishly, yet very calmly called his voicemail and said, "You asked me what I had hoped to hear from you and I think I had hoped to hear 'thank you for sharing that' and 'im sorry you went through that.' That's what I think I was hoping to hear." I hung up the phone, and I got in my car and drove away. To do this day I have absolutely ZERO memory of where I drove to or what I did next.
I had been living in distress trying hard to avoid memories and feelings and thoughts surrounding a particular traumatic rape by two men when I was a preteen. I had never uttered anything about this event to anyone ever. (It is complicated because it led to some life-changing situations that lasted for decades & even going on now) I went into the sessions week after week for 4 months trying to tell the traumatic story and I would end up just sitting there completely unable to speak. The words would just freeze in my throat and I'd say nothing.
The kind therapist would say things like, "evenutally you will tell me." On other days he’d say, "I'm patient, but I'm a short-term therapist so I can't be patient forever." One day at the psychiatrist office I had a full-on movie-style flashback of the traumatic event because of the way the office is configured and something that happened that triggered me. That intrusive memory was coarsing through me at a 1,000 volts of electricity for about a month leading up to the appointment that I originally posted about above at the beginning of this thread.
He had been very late 4 times in row; very late. Sessions are 45 minutes sharp and he came out after I had been waiting for 15 minutes very anxious about sharing the traumatic event. I write about that session above. I was so confused and taken aback when he looked at me and said because of my mood he wouldn’t talk to me further in that session.
So after posting here on myptsd and some suggestions to bring it up to him at the next session, I decided I would go the next session and tell him how I was feeling and talk with him about my thoughts. I went to the next session (after the original post above) with a bullet point list of questions to ask before I shared the trauma.
The list included telling the therapist I needed a lot of encouraging words said to me in order to continue trying to share. I needed to hear that it was hard work to try and do therapy and I needed to hear from him things like "good job , keep trying," and "this is hard, I understand." I was trying to ask for that. I was so nervous to share the trauma and so nervous to ask for help. So nervous to ask for assurance that I was, indeed, welcome and that his tardiness was not an indication of procrastinating to see me.
I wanted to bring up how I felt when he said because of my mood (I was upset) that he wouldn’t talk to me. So, I brought up the first two points and he jumped backwards in his seat and said,, "no one who knows me would ever say these things about me!" I was REALLY very confused when he said that--what things was I saying? He then commanded, "You need to hurry up and share your trauma now! You are running out of time!" He was stiff & his face not friendly (at all).
I really wanted to please him and obey any rules, so quickly said, "ok," and abandoned any idea of trying to get an understanding of the previous session. I forced myself to hand him another paper I had written details about the traumatic events that "set up" the trauma. I set up the storyline in writing on this paper. I handed him the paper and said, "here you can read this--but I can't tell you the details of the middle part yet, but after you read this, I will tell you the end part where I have strong memories."
He read it and when finished he looked at me and then I spit out the words: "so the last thing I remember is me crawling away on my hands and knees into the bathroom and laying down against the door so they couldn't get in. And they were pushing on the door against my body and I could see their laughing faces through the crack of the door," I literally spit those words out quickly while leaning forward in my chair, with no eye contact. He responded immediately, "So what? - he raped you."
—silence…… (it really sounded like he spoke it in a tone that meant: "big deal. so what" (I was stunned. I felt slapped. I about died inside)
He shook the paper in his hand, (I was now looking at him) and he said "is this what has taken you four months to tell me?" I said, "Yes." He responded, "Why did you want to tell me this?" His tone was demanding. I was just struck in my heart at the question--I was bewildered.
My mind raced with the thoughts, weren't we doing therapy? While my mind raced for an answer he said, "Well... I imagine that you want to be unburdened by it. I imagine that you would want to receive care. But I can't give that to you because you cause me stress. You cause me distress. " Then he glared at me.s
All the humiliating emotions of the trauma were tangibly hanging in the air, I looked at him so bewildered. He started pointing into the air with his two index fingers and said, "You are here,- you are there- you are over here. Sessions with you are difficult-- you are always all over the place." Then he dropped his arms and looked at me with disgust. He started counting on his fingers saying, "1.) the level of anxiety you have is stressful for me, 2.) the level of distress you are in. … (silence) … He paused, looking at me with serious disdain. “What exactly did you hope to hear from me?” (--silence—)“Because nothing I say ever seems good enough for you.-- The level of anxiety you have," he shook his head and then just looked at me with a look that said, "you're an awful person"
At this, an internal shift happened inside me. I felt a huge distressing "wailing" rising up inside of me, but I had to stifle it and take control of it. I knew I had to walk out of the medical complex past other patients and personnel, past a big fancy lobby that is crowded with people coming and going. I had to walk outside into my community as my work office is just across the street. I knew I could very well see anyone I work with or personally know in the halls and elevators of the building. The "professional me" who deals with difficult work scenarios took over and calmly and quietly (and submissively as possible) asked, "are you saying you have hurt feelings?"
He put his hand on his chest, and said "yes, sometimes I feel hurt." I quietly nodded and looked at him with submission and a calm demeanor. He handed me the paper, and said "put that away. Your time is up. " The look on his face is hard to describe. Detest is the only word I can use. I felt "detested." I was lost and I was confused. I was mostly mortified, humiliated, and ashamed.
I walked out of the room. I walked into the elevator. Inside the lobby I walked past the four greeters at the info-desk who smiled and said, goodbye. I nodded back at them, walked out into the sunshine. I walked to my car.
Unfortunately, standing next to my car I felt another part of me inside, I felt very detached from this person who was me, very stupidly, foolishly, yet very calmly called his voicemail and said, "You asked me what I had hoped to hear from you and I think I had hoped to hear 'thank you for sharing that' and 'im sorry you went through that.' That's what I think I was hoping to hear." I hung up the phone, and I got in my car and drove away. To do this day I have absolutely ZERO memory of where I drove to or what I did next.
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