Therapist Clueless About Sociopaths

[RussH]

I think the source of the trauma is not as important to focus on as the trauma itself to gain your healing.

 

[anthony]

what supports your belief it is so clear ?

The question is quite clear:

Does anyone else think trauma induced by sociopaths/psychopaths is unique and distinct from other types of trauma, at least in the details of how it occurred?

Anyone can inflict trauma equally, or more devasting than that of a sociopath / psychopath, and they DO just that every day. There is good reason why therapists avoid such things, because you're trying to claim one type of traumatic offender as worse, trauma is trauma, and is defined uniquely person to person, and not by a stereotype scenario which you're trying to produce here.

What difference is a soldier shooting someone to a psychopath shooting someone? What difference is a soldier wounding someone, watching them in pain and suffering, to a psychopath wounding someone, watching them in pain and suffering? What is the difference from someone broke and desperate robbing you, or a sociopath robbing you? What is the difference from a sociopath emotionally abusing a child to a parent emotionally abusing their child?

In all of the above examples, either party can inflict more or less trauma in each situation, none of them are restricted to a psychopath or sociopath being worse. Humans can be extremely brutal. Children walk into schools and shoot up their peers, killing and wounding them, because they were depressed. They weren't psychopaths or sociopaths, they got depressed or other mentally challenged situation that they just couldn't handle, they snapped and performed a horrific traumatic act. You read about it all the time... nobody seen it coming, the kid was as normal as they come, blah blah blah... yet they snap and perform such horrific events.

All of you commenting on this from the US know this story inside out... it's nearly a monthly or more common occurrence in America. Great kid snaps, goes on school shooting rampage. Depression, teen suicide, the list keeps going on.

You're trying to stereotype a trauma as worse based on the abuser, which just can't be done, and I've given you plenty of examples above to cite my stance and reasoning.

There are bad types of trauma, there are bad people in this world (the majority are not psychopaths or sociopaths), but trauma by such a specific person is not worse or better than another.

 

[Dana1010]

I've noticed the same 'reluctance' in some therapists. I don't understand it.

I honestly think a lot of therapists just don't understand psychopathy that well or just think it's bad behavior that can be changed. The understanding that it's not an illness in terms of something that can be treated, but rather a way of being is a somewhat recent finding. I mentioned the work of Robert Hare to my therapist and she drew a blank. Basically, he's the guy who first threw in the towel, and said, "These people can't be treated." He once sent some brain scan-type research on sociopaths to a scientific review who returned the work saying, "These scans couldn't have come from real people." I recommend his books to anyone interested in the topic - and we should all be interested because these people exist to prey on all of us.

When you do become the victim of one, you'll see the difference.

Indeed. I'm as stunned today when I think about this person as I was when I first found him out years ago. Most people just don't get it until they experience it, and then they'll never trust again.

 

[radicalgratitude]

It's always a challenge to keep from punching a person who tells me that my dad loves me, but I know they are just trying to be helpful so of course I don't. It's awful having a dad as a psychopath because you know the truth about that.

That said, we need to avoid falling into the psychologically damaging trap of saying one traumatic event is somehow worse than another traumatic event. It is simply not true. We are all here because we have PTSD. Thus we have all been through far too much in our lives.

 

[Lolly]

What difference is a soldier shooting someone to a psychopath shooting someone? What difference is a soldier wounding someone, watching them in pain and suffering, to a psychopath wounding someone, watching them in pain and suffering? What is the difference from someone broke and desperate robbing you, or a sociopath robbing you? What is the difference from a sociopath emotionally abusing a child to a parent emotionally abusing their child?

Because a psychopath *enjoys* it. Its all a game to them. They love having a feeling of power, that they can manipulate you to do whatever they want you to do. Like a crazy puppet master. Just being in the presence of someone like that, is scary. Never mind being abused by them. For being their source of pleasure.

You used a soldier as an example. PTSD was first discovered because of soldiers. Soldiers were coming home because they found killing people, and watching them die, etc, traumatic. They are haunted by it every day of their life. That's the difference with a psychopath. They don't find it traumatic. They seek it out. They aren't haunted by it, they like to remember it. That's the difference.

PS,

please do not think I'm having a go at you! just having a rough day, so finding it hard to write without sounding defensive and angry lol.

 

[Dana1010]

@anthony, you left out the second part of my question:

Does anyone else think trauma induced by sociopaths/psychopaths is unique and distinct from other types of trauma, at least in the details of how it occurred?

I totally agree that PTSD is PTSD and nowhere in my post did I imply that psychopath induced trauma is worse than other trauma, merely distinct in how it's to be discussed and treated.

What difference is a soldier shooting someone to a psychopath shooting someone? What difference is a soldier wounding someone, watching them in pain and suffering, to a psychopath wounding someone, watching them in pain and suffering? What is the difference from someone broke and desperate robbing you, or a sociopath robbing you? What is the difference from a sociopath emotionally abusing a child to a parent emotionally abusing their child?

I get the gist of this and think I can provide a partial answer. In most of these scenarios, there is not the betrayal of trust painstakingly and artfully gained by the sociopath before the attack is launched. In other words, the street rapist, the robber, the soldier, have not made inroads into your private inner sanctum before they start smashing it to pieces. What hurts more, a bleary eyed thug pushing you around, or someone you believed was your soulmate, a dream come true?

Also, the "normal," "great" kids you refer to may be anything but. Sociopaths don something we call that "mask of sanity" and sometimes have veritable fan clubs around them, as they can charm and beguile with preternatural ease.

 

[anthony]

They don't find it traumatic. They seek it out. They aren't haunted by it, they like to remember it.

That is actually incorrect... and exactly as stated, stereotyping. You need to go read about psychopathy and understand it more, because your focus is only on the abuse, not on the actual personality disorder behind it. Liking to inflict trauma is actually only relevant to a minuscule number of psychopaths.

 

[Pencil]

Does anyone else think trauma induced by sociopaths/psychopaths is unique and distinct from other types of trauma, at least in the details of how it occurred?

It never takes long for the hair splitting to start, does it? Dana never said WORSE, she said unique and distinct. But for me, myself, I, personally, the sociopathic variety is worse, when I compare different experiences I had. I don't compare my experiences to anyone else's, because I can never, ever, ever imagine what anything was really like for somebody else. But there is a huge difference between an event that has a kind of once-off quality, such as a school shooting, and an 'event' that doesn't have a clear beginning or end and totally messes with one's sense of reality, self ... just about everything, really. I've spoken about my sister before - after the events of the past seven years I finally got an interim protection order against her, which she is opposing, and the trial starts in November. But even if I do get a permanent protection order against her, it will NEVER be over. She will rule my life until the day she dies. And I hope and pray that day will come soon.

 

[Dana1010]

That is actually incorrect...

Ooooh...nope. This whole post. You need to read Without Conscience by Robert Hare. It's not a stereotype. Not all are classical sadists, but they get a certain thrill out of getting over on people. At any rate, they don't feel a hint of remorse about it.

 

[radicalgratitude]

Do you think if your trauma was caused by a psychopath, that's a crucial piece of the puzzle and needs to be integrated in therapy?

Ok, so going back to the OP's question. Yes I do think that is a critical piece of the puzzle and needs to be integrated in therapy. Coming to terms with the fact that your father is a psychopath is something that takes a long time to come to grips with. I'm still coming to terms with this myself, and I've known this since I was a child and was told that this was why my parents divorced. I never understood why he still got visitation privileges though...

 

[Deleted member 19804]

The trouble started when I was talking to my therapist about someone from my past who scarred me and who was a sociopath (I am well versed in the subject and have copious evidence to support the claim). My therapist looked flustered, and said, "Why is it so important for you to describe him as a sociopath?" Um, because he was one?

This is just how I see it from my own experience, I could be completely off, but could it be a blame thing? That if he's a sociopath, he is 100% a monster and therefore 100% accountable? Since a lot of us, including myself, are struggling with self-blame even though we did not help facilitate our traumas in any way, if the abuser is a sociopath not only helps you put some of the feelings of guilt away, but it also makes what happened unpreventable. The abuser was no doubt a sick monster who deserves to be locked up for a loooong time. But if you can give it a label.. a label that explains everything that happened and why you couldn't get away.. then perhaps you can externalise some of the shame and guilt you feel (even though what your abuser did to you was in no way your fault!!!). Because there are no more doubts about the situation, no more "but what if I had done ...."s . He would have still been a monster with no capability of feeling remorse or empathy whatsoever. It makes the trauma easier to process. Does that make any sense?

 

[Pencil]

From Hare:

Pay extreme attention to the person's treatment towards others.

Psychopaths are generally prone to belittle, humiliate, mistreat, mock and even attack physically (or kill, in extreme cases) people who normally would bring no benefits to him/her in any way, such as subordinates, physically frail or lower-ranking people, children, elderly people and even animals - especially the latter ones.