A question about details and therapy

[oakleaves]

The reality of saying out loud is devastating. It makes it more real. The fact that I am truly seen and heard hits that vulnerability button that makes me want to crawl in a hole.

I could have written this so easily. It is so so hard isn't it. I think that is why my T wants me to talk. Because I keep saying I want to but then freezing up. But also because it makes me feel so fragile and ashamed it feels unbearable.

There is something about sitting with someone and them being with you with that disgust but them not feeling it and not directing it at you either.

 

[oakleaves]

When you’re checking yourself about detail levels? Describe your dinner. Or your new shoes. Or anything else that comes to mind that you happen to think of. Then compare and contrast. Do your shoelaces need to be glossed over, because, you know, <whispering> shoe laces ... or is it totally kosher to mention your sneakers have white laces, but you’re thinking about switching them out for pink, or maybe the stretchy ones?

Thank you that makes SO much sense.

I find it so hard to say the words sometimes I feel as though I might be physically sick. And the things I have to say and the images I get that intrude make me feel that too.

I do speak vaguely and in an abstract way about a lot of things. I suppose it is about trying not to fully engage with it because it feels intolerable. But I have to be able to look at it to get past it.

I might try to write something more detailed and then tell my T next time. And if I get overwhelmed by something else when I am speaking I might try to say that too. It feels like the details are really important because that is how you habituate I guess.

I said the other day I feel like I am contaminated by association. Which is maybe a bit different to before because I think I used to feel contaminated because it happened.

I think it is also difficult because some of my memories are vague or fractured or a part that bothers me seems 'less' on the surface (like when he would put his arm around me and touch my breasts I knew what that meant and that part was the worst or seeing his belongings and knowing that meant he was there). So I worry about how that sounds.

I feel like very few people get it or get the impact of it really. People can get impatient understandably with you when you get anxious or spaced out or forget or get overwhelmed. My OH is very understanding but I really hate the impact.

Thank you.

 

[oakleaves]

This is going to make me want to hide forever but


I feel like if I say to her, he went inside me but *with his fingers* not anything else.

That is too much and I can't stand it. It is the WORST thing. Because it isn't rape and I then also worry that she will think it was NOTHING because I know a lot worse happens to people but to me having to face that that happened and I can't remember how many times or where or what happened afterwards always feels INTOLERABLE.

 

[somerandomguy]

@oakleaves, it IS rape. It's digital rape and it's just as much rape as any other rape.

If it happens to anyone against their wishes, it's rape. If it happens to children, it's rape.

Rape is rape. There's no "better rape" or "worse rape." You were raped, and I'm so sorry.

 

[Mach123]

Once you do this it will heal it's just exactly like a physical wound. That's what I'm thinking reading the thread.

At first you look at it and it's such a terrible wound. It's unimaginable it'll heal, never mind fade.

But I think I'm starting to heal. I can read all of it now. At first I couldn't look then I'd read and I'd like (idk how to say it?) this was when I was trying to get it out. Couldn't even read it let alone say it.

Now I'm reading it and all the threads in this one place are all like !!! triggers !!!

It's like trying to out do each other with going warning warning like the robot on Lost in Space.

But it's not there anymore. I'm not sure how I feel about this. I want to feel good but maybe let's wait awhile.

I'm afraid to say it and next week be back here saying I'm doing terrible? IDK

What you are saying though? I can guarantee you it'll get easier.

 

[unbrokenwarrior]

I haven't been able to say anything in detail to my therapist because when I go to say theres like a physical block in my throat that prevents me. So I write it down and give it to her and then she will direct the conversation towards that. I find that so much easier and I can write as much detail as I want to because I dont have to read it out.

Hope things get easier for you in therapy.❤

 

[susannahsays]

Someone sticking their fingers inside you without your consent isn't nothing. I don't mean this as a criticism of you, but the idea that there is only one type of rape is pretty outdated. It is a MAJOR violation to have someone put part of themselves (or an object) inside of your body - whether that's your vagina, mouth, or anus. I do not have a penis, but I imagine it would also feel extremely violating to have someone take part of me and put it inside of themselves. The point is, it's all a huge violation, and you are "allowed" to be traumatized. If your therapist thinks it's nothing, she's full of shit and shouldn't be a therapist.

 

[EveHarrington]

That is too much and I can't stand it. It is the WORST thing. Because it isn't rape

Who told you in isn’t rape?

You can be raped with a penis.

You can be raped with a hand. (It’s called digital rape.)

You can be raped with an object.

The idea that rape has to involve a penis simply isn’t true. Female on female rape is indeed a thing.

 

[Friday]

Exactly as Eve says, above. It is rape.

That is too much and I can't stand it. It is the WORST thing. Because it isn't rape and I then also worry that she will think it was NOTHING because I know a lot worse happens to people

That’s black & white thinking. Either it’s ABC or it was NOTHING. Nope. It doesn’t work like that.

If it helps break down the all or nothing thinking...

1. You know attempted rape is a crime? Right? And this was worse that that. Because it wasn’t just attempted, it happened.

2. You know sexual assault is a crime, right? And this was worse than that. Because it reached the level of penetrative. Even doctors, tattoo artists, and the military have to gain consent before they’re allowed to insert things into your body.

So you’re already well down the road on the generally accepted spectrum of badness, because the vast majority of people have agreed that this is wrong.

Jumping into the personal spectrum? I’ve had some rapes that were far less damaging than some sexual assaults. It doesn’t matter that criminally rape is the worse crime, in how it’s affected me. On my own personal spectrum? This was worse than that. Does that mean the rape in question was nothing, because the sexual assault was worse? Nope. They’re just different, is all. Both bad, in different ways. And then? There are some absolutely no crime happened whatsoever that f*cked me up far worse than things which are capital crimes. The general consensus of “worse” reeeeeally doesn’t change how I personally am affected. They’re all in the Kingdom of Bad, with different aspects affecting me in different ways.

How I am affected? Is why I’m in therapy / what I’ve hired someone to help me with. It’s not like I’m only “allowed” to hire someone to help me with certain things, and the other things I’m not allowed to seek help for. That would be like hiring a mechanic who can only work on the left hand side of the engine. Sure, mechanics specialise and all, and that’s fine... but just because there are break specialists, and body specialists, and engine specialists, and foreign motor specialists, etc., doesn’t mean that everything outside their specialty is bullshit. Oh it’s a domestic car? No. Domestic cars don’t have problems! :cautious: :shifty: Doesn’t make any sense, does it?

If people are “allowed” to have problems just meeting someone for coffee, and holding hands, or having completely consensual sex? You think maaaaaaaybe it’s “okay” for people who’ve been sexually assaulted and raped to have problems? Or normal life problems are okay to be f*cked up by, and violent stranger rape is okay to be f*cked up by, but all the middle Isn’t? Only the left hand side of the engine can be seen by a mechanic?

ANY problem you’re having? Is a problem. By definition. And it is absolutely okay for you to seek help with that problem. Promise.

 

[Rumors]

This is going to make me want to hide forever but


I feel like if I say to her, he went inside me but *with his fingers* not anything else.

That is too much and I can't stand it. It is the WORST thing. Because it isn't rape and I then also worry that she will think it was NOTHING because I know a lot worse happens to people but to me having to face that that happened and I can't remember how many times or where or what happened afterwards always feels INTOLERABLE.

I'm sorry that happened to you. The sad reality is that this was a violation of your body and it can't be minimized. Details in any form are ugly feeling but please don't minimize the impact this event had in your life bc you compare it to other stories. It's horrific on its own. I am really sorry.

 

[oakleaves]

it IS rape. It's digital rape and it's just as much rape as any other rape.

t is a MAJOR violation to have someone put part of themselves (or an object) inside of your body

Who told you in isn’t rape?

Exactly as Eve says, above. It is rape.

I really do appreciate those of you who have taken the time to respond and I am reading every word and taking it in.
I am also a little overwhelmed by the responses to be honest.
Where I live it is not called rape but I know getting hung up on legal definitions is probably another way of distancing and minimising so I won't.

The sad reality is that this was a violation of your body and it can't be minimized.

This is the reality and this is why it feels so difficult to say.

My T is very very good and I like her and trust her but she has never said that it was rape. I have only tentatively told her the things that happened vaguely though so that means that she won't want to make assumptions and won't want to put a label on it that I haven't because I know if someone said that to me out loud (rather than written) I don't think I would cope with that at the moment.

Seeing it written is allowing me to get a sense of space to try to take it in if that makes sense.

It is so difficult to let myself think about it and I am almost literally on the ceiling - I am so agitated and anxious and I keep thinking bad things will happen (and they may) and I can't make decisions or think clearly and my T is off for a week now. It is ok it is just hard.

 

[oakleaves]

That’s black & white thinking. Either it’s ABC or it was NOTHING. Nope. It doesn’t work like that.

If it helps break down the all or nothing thinking...

1. You know attempted rape is a crime? Right? And this was worse that that. Because it wasn’t just attempted, it happened.

2. You know sexual assault is a crime, right? And this was worse than that. Because it reached the level of penetrative. Even doctors, tattoo artists, and the military have to gain consent before they’re allowed to insert things into your body.

Jumping into the personal spectrum? I’ve had some rapes that were far less damaging than some sexual assaults. It doesn’t matter that criminally rape is the worse crime, in how it’s affected me. On my own personal spectrum? This was worse than that. Does that mean the rape in question was nothing, because the sexual assault was worse? Nope. They’re just different, is all. Both bad, in different ways. And then? There are some absolutely no crime happened whatsoever that f*cked me up far worse than things which are capital crimes. The general consensus of “worse” reeeeeally doesn’t change how I personally am affected. They’re all in the Kingdom of Bad, with different aspects affecting me in different ways....If people are “allowed” to have problems just meeting someone for coffee, and holding hands, or having completely consensual sex? You think maaaaaaaybe it’s “okay” for people who’ve been sexually assaulted and raped to have problems? Or normal life problems are okay to be f*cked up by, and violent stranger rape is okay to be f*cked up by, but all the middle Isn’t?

ANY problem you’re having? Is a problem. By definition. And it is absolutely okay for you to seek help with that problem. Promise.

Thank you for taking the time to write this. It is all helping me to think about what I might say next time I see my T and I need to think that whatever else is going on in my life, this is important and it matters and it is ok to make space for it.

I feel like I don't want my words to hurt her or to leave her with images that she can't get rid of for the rest of her life. BUT she is a good T as I say she is very boundaried, experienced and she is deliberately very calm and not unempathic but not overly affected by things, which is what I need I think. I don't need to see someone whose emotions I have to manage. I need to see someone who can let me be a broken mess and can sit with that and tolerate it so that I can somehow find ways to tolerate it too. Somehow.

I might write a bit more later on when I have had time to absorb things just to help me consider what I might say and how I might say it.

But you are all right. Someone putting their (it makes me shrink inside myself this word I don't know why) fingers inside you (me) is not a nothing thing.