How do you distinguish cognitive distortion from genuine experiences?

[Carlito2017]

So, I'm currently not diagnosed, but starting to feel that it might benefit me to work with a trauma-oriented therapist. Before I go though I'm trying to explore and tackle a few things on my own. Here's a question that I've struggled with for a long time now.

I'll just copy the following paragraph from my into thread here.

Through my entire life I've experienced a frankly abnormal amount of rejection, and it has left me feeling that there's just something fundamentally off-putting about me. Like people in all kinds of situations, in all contexts, keep me at arm's length, aren't interested in me and don't want me being interested in them. Like people have very little patience for me and very easily reject me outright at the first sight of tension, and at the same time easily become tense and angry with me for trivial reasons. And it's not like I have poor social skills! I have a job that requires me to entertain people by chatting with them! I can talk to people well but can't shake the feeling that most people just don't want me there, and the ones that do always keep me at arm's length. I see it in my professional relationships, in my friendships and even in my marriage.

Recently I stumbled upon an old conversation I had with an ex - the one person in my life who I'm 100% confident loved me and was genuine, present and supportive. In the conversation she tells me that I'm too closed off and don't show myself in interactions, to which I counter that when I do, people turn away, and that I feel like I'm fundamentally unlikeable, as described above. She called it a cognitive distortion. She said that it comes from a core belief that "there's something wrong with me" or "there's something wrong with people" and makes me afraid of interacting with people, preventing me from enjoying interactions and on a deeper level - from knowing what I really want from personal relationships. And, well, she's got a point there - I don't know what I seek from relationships except some vague idea of safety. And on the topic of cognitive distortions - I remember thinking when I was 8 or 9 years old "Everybody hates me! They hate me the moment they see me, it's automatic!" Understandable for a kid who was getting bullied, beaten and yelled at daily, but it does show that I'm not immune from cognitive distortions, and in fact later in life when dealing with mental health in and out of therapy I did successfully challenge a bunch of cognitive distortions. But this one notion - the notion that people seemingly don't like me and keep me away - has always held up, even if positive experiences have helped blunt the edge. But then again, that's what a cognitive distortion does, isn't it? Maybe some of the negative experiences I'm still having are not actually negative or even if they are, the prevalence of such negativity shouldn't fit together into a picture of my being fundamentally flawed?

One way I used to deal with a seemingly hostile world is by self-isolating. Not in a total shut-in way, but just letting connections remain fleeting and being alright with essentially being alone in the world. After a childhood full of abuse, it didn't even feel that bad. Except, as I aged (and after an experience caring for a relative afflicted with dementia) I realized that a lot of what makes isolated life fun - my health, my intellect, my financial freedom - will not stay with me forever. I don't think I originally wanted to be alone before my trauma. I just escaped into solitude because it was safer and more pleasant than the human connections available to me, but I still want connection, acceptance, safety and support. I just can't seem to find those things and make them last, no matter how much I try. Humanity seems weirdly and inexplicably hostile and dismissive towards me, forcing me to choose between walking on eggshells and isolation. At least that:s what I'm perceiving, but people who know me, people who I have reason to trust, have told me that it's a cognitive distortion.

So, how do I separate cognitive distortion from actual poor treatment? Has anyone had experience learning how to do that? And also - how did you find out what you want from people, what you seek from relationships?

 

[Movingforward10]

It's really hard.
And I'm not sure I can articulate it.
I think it's building a sense of self. With a sense of yourself, you then begin to understand what is acceptable behaviour and what isn't? And that's when you can see that other people's treatment of you is more of a 'them' issue rather than a 'you' issue.
If that makes any sense.
And that then helps to understand the cognitive distortion that "there is something wrong with me".
.it also helps with understanding patterns we might create.

However , saying that, there is this:
We might seek out people who reconfirm our cognitive distortions.
Or seek out behaviours that confirm our cognitive distortions.
"I'm unloveable" , if we pull people in and the push them out to prove they were going to leave us anyway etc.

It's messy hard work unpicking it as cognitive distortions feel so real. And we see them confirmed time and time and time again. It's breaking that cycle. Becoming aware. Questioning ourselves. Etc.

 

[Carlito2017]

Movingforward10
Thank you. That reads wonderfully vague and reassuring at the same time.
I've always thought I *do* have a strong sense of self - I know what I like, have a strong moral compass and don't struggle too badly with consistently pursuing my goals. Though now after a couple of weeks reading about trauma I'm not so sure.
So many sources talk about what to do when we don't have a defined self, but how can I check if I'm one of those people? I know an obvious way would be to ask my therapist about it, when I have one, but are there other ways to check?

 

[Movingforward10]

That reads wonderfully vague and reassuring at the same time.

Sorry about that!

I've always thought I *do* have a strong sense of self - I know what I like, have a strong moral compass and don't struggle too badly with consistently pursuing my goals.

Yeah, I was the same. Until I realised I was just adapting all the time to everyone else. I realised this as the trauma I had repressed and denied came to the forefront and I had to confront my past and the fact I had changed reality for myself to cope. My sense of self came shattering down really.

So many sources talk about what to do when we don't have a defined self, but how can I check if I'm one of those people? I know an obvious way would be to ask my therapist about it, when I have one, but are there other ways to check?

I may provide a vague answer again!
For me I think it was:
Soaking up other people's emotions. I could only be ok if they were ok.

Changing how I was depending on who I was with. Adapting myself to the situation.

Ignoring my sensations in my body. (Self abandonment). Just ignoring everything my feelings or body or intuition felt because it wouldn't align with what someone else might want, or what I thought someone else wanted.

A lot of hypervegilence. It takes a lot to do all of the above. A lot of scanning and predicting and work to try and make everyone else ok and ignore myself. Exhausting.

 

[Friday]

Have you read either of these 2 articles, yet?

((I’m not in a headspace, at the moment to write, but will come back to answer your Q about personal experience when zeh brainzzz working a smidge better. In the interim, if you haven’t read the articles, there’s some killer examples & explanations, tips & tricks.))

Primary cognitive distortions (negative thinking styles)

Aug 6, 2018

Cognitive distortion forms the backbone of PTSD. Whether you know it or not, all moods and behavioral patterns originate from your cognitions-- your thoughts. The first thing that happens is a thought, and then a mood or behavior occurs.

When you allow an area of your life to become dominated by negative thoughts, you'll come to believe things are as bad as you -- frequently incorrectly-- imagine them to be.

This leaves us at identifying cognitive distortions and rationalizing them. An often-seen mistake occurs...

• anthony
• Comments: 38
• Topic: Articles

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Solving the problem: reframing negative thoughts

Jun 10, 2018

How many times have you heard yourself say, "I can't?"

Everyone has these moments. Problems can seem too intricate to solve, and challenges can appear too difficult to face. For people living with PTSD, there is an additional piece that will easily make anything seem impossible: negative thinking.

Negative thinking is choosing to have thoughts that discount any positive, hopeful, or desirable outcome. These negative thoughts often arise out of cognitive distortions. You can use your...

• joeylittle
• Comments: 16
• Topic: Articles

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[arfie]

i steer away from the effort of defining the actions of other people. the value and intent of their actions is theirs to sort. what other people think of me is not my business. your thoughts are yours, my friend. may they serve you well. leaving others to sort their own frees up considerable processing space.

mine to sort is my own thoughts and reactions to outside stimuli. was i actually rejected or am i rejecting in order to avoid the rejection, etc., my cognitive distortions are convinced is coming. am i subconsciously mistaking the love of my life for one of the playground bullies who tormented my childhood?

i suspect my own explanation is no more clear than @Movingforward10's, but cognitive distortions are a vague phenom.

side note
i am currently in my second parenting career and grow ever more convinced that children experience cognitive distortions as naturally as they fantasize about having their own flying unicorn and/or fear abandonment because they don't own the latest tech gadgets.

 

[Carlito2017]

Friday
Thank you. Just read them both. My honest reaction is to want to throw out a rebuttal: BUT I ALREADY KNOW AND APPLY ALL OF THAT, AND YET HERE I AM.
...evidently, I'm not applying them right.
Funnily enough, I just tried to name the cognitive distortion described in my original post, and... I can't? Probably because it doesn't actually feel like a cognitive anything to me, let alone a distortion. Rather, to me it's genuinely more like a fact, a life circumstance that I can't seem to change despite wanting to. Like it's true regardless of how I feel about it the same way that the sky is blue and will remain so even if I take issue with it.
If it's truly a cognitive distortion, it must be pretty deeply entrenched.

arfie​

That sounds like the perspective of a healthy and independent person, and it's one I definitely respect. It's also similar to what I myself do - I try not to ascribe feelings and thoughts to people unless they actually express them. I tend to do that, but have learned not to. Now that I thin of it, that voice in my head that keeps going "Nobody likes you, everybody leaves, you'll die alone" is less triggered directly by rejection and more by what I perceive to be the consequences of rejection - having to carry a heavy fridge up the stairs alone because I've got no one to ask for help; the inability to have boundaries in my marriage because if I have them my spouse jumps straight to divorce; having to get out of tough spots by myself every time, especially when I could have used some help, because I'm not close enough to anyone to expect help in tough life situations.
Sometimes I wonder if I'm more bothered by the loneliness and lack of connection, or by the impacts that loneliness has on my quality of life.

 

[In the weeds]

@Carlito2017
I just wanted to thank you for staying this thread.
I have many of the same thoughts but couldn't put them in words.
I have no answers but I'm going to read those articles later suggested by @Friday (thank you to @Friday).

 

[Sideways]

how do I separate cognitive distortion from actual poor treatment?

I personally apply it to someone else.

For example: say someone says something to me. I can take that away and think about it in terms of - if they’d said that to my colleague/friend, would that be okay? If not, why not

how did you find out what you want from people, what you seek from relationships?

Identifying my values. Not just for personal relationships, but also more broadly, and considering how my relationships add meaning and value to my life.

 

[Carlito2017]

Six months later, I've been banging my head against this the entire time, and I can't say I've made any progress. If anything, I though a combination of retraumatizing life circumstances in the presence as well as tackling past trauma with EMDR has made me feel overall much worse.
I still can't shake the idea of myself being fundamentally flawed. I still see people giving me absolutely no grace while others are loved through all their flaws. But now, after exploring my trauma, I'm also aware of the extent to which all the things I do are people pleasing - seekingt to be unoffensive. helpful, useful in situations where I wish to be included. I will never be included if I don't earn it. Cognitive distortion? Maybe. But how the hell do I challenge it when, again, absolutely nobody will give me grace in my imperfection. Not my friends, not my family, not my wife. Everyone either goes away, or becomes hostile and I have to go away to protect my boundaries.
And you know, right now I think I'd be fine with just 'earning' acceptance in social circles and some semblance of love from my spouse. But the problem is I suck even at that. So often the kindest, the most inoffensive, the most helpful thing I can do for a person in need, even a person I deeply care for, is to just not be there, not take up space, not offer anything. I don't look good, I'm not strong, I'm not good at comforting people or listening to them, so when I 'perform' to 'earn' the right to take up space and be with people, 'performance' is just trying not to make things worse, to not be a burden or a nuisance to the people I like.
I don't even have the capacity to effectively cope with my trauma, so how can I hope to heal it? And if I can't, what is the point of digging past stuff up in therapy sessions and paying good money for it?