Panic Attacks At Dusk..anything I Can Do?

[Deleted member 37605]

I have been reading but I honestly can't find any evidence that I could not have acute PTSD.

 

[Deleted member 37605]

If you are lucky enough to know in advance of when a panic is going to happen, I would prepaid for it in...

I have taken a different approach..I know my most panicky time of the day is the early evening so I have tried to immerse myself in it by walking when it gets dark. I expose myself to the emotions and then just ride it out.

 

[joeylittle]

Reading the article you highlighted, it outlines that Link Removed can last longer than 1 month. My Psychologist said that for a Diagnosis of PTSD, the condition must last for at least 6 months.

Oh my goodness. Well, your psychologist is wrong on the 6 months. Read the criteria. Symptoms must persist for one month. Honestly.

Your Psychologist is referring to the criteria for Delayed Expression. So, to have a diagnosis of PTSD with delayed expression, the PTSD must not emerge until six months following the event, though the individual may have similar symptoms within the first days following the event. What this would look like is - the trauma happens. You are upset for a few days, a week, maybe 2 weeks. And then things go back to normal = or so close to normal that it's really manageable. Then, six (or more) months later, something happens and you emerge with full PTSD symptoms.

There are those of us here, and there are studies, that debate whether one month is sufficient for a straight-up PTSD diagnosis. There are also studies that debate whether ASD can actually persist longer than one month - and that's what the article I linked to states. But if you were to examine the criteria for ASD, you'll see that it's only diagnosable for one month following the event.

What the DSM says, and whether it's right, is often debated.

All we can go on, medically, is the DSM5 or the ICD10.

And, look: if you want to have PTSD, then OK, you have PTSD...not sure what else to tell you. It sounds like that's what you want to have.

I'm still kind of shocked that you are declaring phobias to be not as serious as PTSD - you refer to it as

I don't accept that what I have is simply a "phobia"

Which is pretty insulting for people who struggle with them. The three phobia categories are Agoraphobia, Specific Phobia, and Social Phobia. Agoraphobics are often house-bound. I know a fear of flying person who is a freelancer, and has to travel job-to-job - but if she can't get there by train, she has to turn it down, since 9/11. That's a significant functional impairment. Someone with a serious fear of spiders might need to move out of their apartment after they see one. Phobias aren't 'simple', they are very, very real.

At least, read this: Specific Phobia DSM-5 300.29 (ICD-10-CM Multiple Codes) - Therapedia - it is a nicely written guide through the requirements of a diagnosis of Specific Phobia.

And here is Acute Stress Disorder, from the same source site: Acute Stress Disorder DSM-5 308.3 (F43.0) - Therapedia

 

[joeylittle]

I honestly can't find any evidence that I could not have acute PTSD.

Cross-posted, so adding...

You are not experiencing significant functional impairment. I'm not a doc, again, but from everything you've posted, you don't meet the clinical requirements for functional impairment, which is a criteria.

 

[Gs172003]

If you are lucky enough to know in advance of when a panic is going to happen, I would prepaid for it in...

Agreed. Has your therapist taught you grounding techniques?

 

[Gs172003]

I have been reading but I honestly can't find any evidence that I could not have acute PTSD.

It sounds to me like you are determined you have it.

 

[Powder]

It's entirely possible that the attempted break in is not traumatic enough, but could have pulled up reminders of an early trauma that is not remembered.

With the OCD symptoms from childhood, was that ever diagnosed or have you told your psych that you had OCD type of anxiety life-long?

I, too, felt "better" for a while in my teens for about a year. When things are going really well and health is very strong, PTSD can go into remission, so I supposed that could be it, or if it's also OCD or mainly that, I don't know. I think my cousin with OCD was "better" when she was most happy, but even then, she suffered from insomnia and took sleeping pills.

I know a psych is not able to fully diagnose PTSd or OCD. For the diagnosis to "stick" here, in court, with disability benefits, etc. you gotta get an actual Doc to diagnose. And for me, I had to go to the Psychiatrist several times. He noted depression, anger, anxiety that didn't match events, nightmares, etc. and at that time (I was 20) I had a hard time accepting the PTSD diagnosis.

From what I've seen mostly on the forum and what I've read, one of the "tests" for PTSD is that you deny and fight the PTSD diagnosis and basically run from it and the person who said you have it, for like decades. Your response is unusual. I guess maybe you're in a phase where you just want to know what "it" is, and I do get that feeling. I do.

 

[Deleted member 37605]

Oh my goodness. Well, your psychologist is wrong on the 6 months. Read the criteria. Symptoms mus...

I think the term "simple phobia" was a bad choice of words on my part. I never meant to imply that phobias were not serious and could not interfere with life. Of course they can.

What I meant by "simple phobia" was that there was so much about my condition that was inconsistent with it being a phobia as opposed to reliving a traumatic incident (such as ASD or PTSD) or some other disorder.

a) Acute morning anxiety.
b) Panic attacks and high levels of stress throughout the day.
c) feeling decreased anxiety late at night (when it's darker outside).
d) the phobia did not appear right away, it was a delayed symptom.

It is my understanding of phobias is that they occur without good reason. For example, most people afraid of spiders were never bitten by a venomous spider. Or most people afraid to fly, did not get involved in a plane crash.

If you got into a car accident and then suddenly developed a fear of driving...is this a phobia or a reaction to a trauma?

My phobia "came from somewhere"

As for experiencing significant functional impairment. Yes I was. My symptoms have eased off recently. But at my worst point, I was experiencing recurring panic attacks, irritability, physical symptoms and disturbing thoughts. These symptoms were very intense and very troubling. I did my best to fight through it all. The way I see it someone with a phobia of flying would choose not to fly but if forced to fly, would tolerate it and live out the symptoms. There is no avoiding night. So I really had no choice but either immerse myself and hope for recovery or get used to panic disorder.

I am not convinced that I have PTSD. If someone could say "well here is what you really have" and to make a 100% recovery you need to do this and this. Believe me I'm listening. I just haven't read anything that neatly described my condition.

 

[Deleted member 37605]

It's entirely possible that the attempted break in is not traumatic enough, but could have pulled up remind...

You know I thought about that at least 1000 times in the past month.. Maybe I was physically or sexually assaulted as a child? It would explain my OCD in regards to harming children. Maybe I was acting out something that was done to me?

But upon extensive research of this theory, I realize how unlike it is.

I can't post links but do a search for British false memory society.

Playing the role of my own skeptic, I am forced to ask myself these questions:

1) why in over 30 years had you not thought about being abused, either sexually or physically? It seems like a myth that memories often get repressed down to nothing and later resurface following a trauma. It seems more likely that people retain memories of childhood abuse and that these memories do fade over time, just like ordinary memories.

2) I have been around lots of children, 6 nieces and nephews. Worked at a day camp as a teen. I never had any inappropriate thought. The OCD event with children seemed to emerge out of nowhere. It only seemed to appear at a time of heightened anxiety.

3) The incident with the running child wasn't my only incident, I also had incident with "flash thoughts" involving adults on the street.

4) this doesn't have anything to do with my phobia over dusk or encounter with a prowler (should that have been imagined).

I actually did deny my condition as an "anxiety disorder" for a long time. I thought it was lyme disease, lupus, MS,a brain injury and some other conditions. I was actually willing to drive to Buffalo and pay hundreds of dollars for private testing because I thought my doctor was wrong about anxiety. When the panic attacks came on, I was forced to be sure it was anxiety related,

 

[joeylittle]

It is my understanding of phobias is that they occur without good reason. For example, most people afraid of spiders were never bitten by a venomous spider. Or most people afraid to fly, did not get involved in a plane crash.

I don't believe so. A person can experience the subject of the phobia, and then develop the phobia. They are fairly complex things. Read the link and see if the description perhaps sounds like you.

If you got into a car accident and then suddenly developed a fear of driving...is this a phobia or a reaction to a trauma?

More likely to be a reaction to the trauma, but would depend on the symptoms. Also, this does not compare to your situation because a car accident, if it's serious, is a straightforward qualifier for PTSD trauma criteria. Your situation is really murky, especially when you added that you are not sure if it was even there.

A car accident that was not life-threatening - then yes, fear of driving could become a phobia.

My symptoms have eased off recently. But at my worst point, I was experiencing recurring panic attacks, irritability, physical symptoms and disturbing thoughts. These symptoms were very intense and very troubling. I did my best to fight through it all. The way I see it someone with a phobia of flying would choose not to fly but if forced to fly, would tolerate it and live out the symptoms. There is no avoiding night. So I really had no choice but either immerse myself and hope for recovery or get used to panic disorder.

Here's the frustrating thing about talking with you re: your situation. You have been improving. Yes, you did your best to fight through it when it was hard, and it was hard for a fairly short period. I know this sounds like I'm diminishing your experience, which is not my intention.

No, someone with a serious phobia of flight cannot get on a plane, period. I know a few. No drugs are strong enough.

You say there is no avoiding night. I can share this - my trauma was not only at night, but my experience of some of the stronger aspects were at night. I avoid the night. I will stay up all night, and have done so very, very consistently. I'm doing it again these days, and it's very frustrating. I know it's because of what I'm working on in trauma therapy right now, and I know it'll get manageable again. This struggle with night is something that I cannot actually push through, when it is intense. And I hate sharing this on this thread, because now it's sounding like 'I have real trauma and you don't, so shut up'.

This is hard to help you understand.

I am not convinced that I have PTSD. If someone could say "well here is what you really have" and to make a 100% recovery you need to do this and this. Believe me I'm listening. I just haven't read anything that neatly described my condition.

Because you are not at a diagnosable length of time. I know how frustrating this can be - but you simply haven't had symptoms that have persisted long enough in order to evaluate what, of many disorders, it could be. All you know right now is you may have had an ASD reaction, but now that it's been going on longer than one month, you're not sure.

You're putting yourself through exposure therapy by going out at night, and you're doing basic good mental health care. Your symptoms are improving.
When you hit the six month mark, you can be evaluated. That's it.

The incident with the running child wasn't my only incident, I also had incident with "flash thoughts" involving adults on the street.

This, by the way, is a common phenomenon, and most people experience it. That sudden urge to do something utterly wrong, dangerous, drive off the cliff, jump off the bridge, shoot someone, hit someone...it comes almost out of nowhere, takes you powerfully by surprise, and then when the moment is gone, it's gone. Normal psychological phenomenon.

What else is going on in your life? Can you share things about you, positive and negative,. that aren't about this one incident, or about trying to diagnose yourself? How is your work, are you happy, what's been on your mind lately, how's your family/relationships...

Might reveal something.

 

[lymphomamama]

Honest, didn't read all the thread, sorry. Just wanted to say that at dusk I too begin to get hypervigilant. That's when I begin locking the outside fences, the wrought Iron gates on the porches, turning on outside lights, etc. Doing what you can to try to assure yourself you are safe helps a lot. I check things like doors and windows every night. Just my thoughts

 

[EveHarrington]

Cross-posted, so adding...

You are not experiencing significant functional impairment.

I tend to agree based on reading your other posts. You're still highly functional, go to bars, pick up women, etc.

I'm concerned that you jumped to asking for MMJ so soon.