BPD Why are people with borderline personality seen as bad people?

[EveHarrington]

I've known a number of borderlines in my life.

All were without boundaries and all of them made...

Oh and they'd run around acting like they were in the right, that they understand boundaries-----when they don't. its all a farce. It's really sad that they're so incredibly un-self-aware and they manipulate other people into falling for their lies.

Maybe not all borderlines are like this but all the ones I've ever met have been. Healing is not in their vocabulary because it would negate the victim status. True self awareness isn't possible either.

My experience, I'm sharing it.

 

[Sideways]

@EveHarrington - is it possible that some of the people with BPD that you've described might have had other psyche issues going on as well as the BPD?

Some of what you've said resonates with me, and my experience with my sister. But some of it sounds like it might by other issues, maybe on top of BPD?? I think my sister, as an example, does have quite a lot of self-awareness. She's struggling with her recovery for SURE!! But she's definitely not all farce, lies, and incapable of self-awareness.

Mental illness so often appears in layers - maybe BPD has been just one of the complex issues that have plagued the people you've encountered?

Idk, just pondering what you've shared. Certainly there can be a lot of pain on the receiving end of untreated BPD (much like any personality disorder I guess).

 

[NormativeTruth]

A long time ago, I was diagnosed with Borderline PD (Personality Disorder) and I hadn't taken it well....

I have BPD. Well, according to my therapist I no longer qualify for a diagnosis. But I used to. Yay, therapy.
Anyway, I think people with BPD are mostly seen as bad people because a lot of immature idiots diagnose their "crazy ex"-es as borderline without any base in reality. It's much easier than really analyse their failed relationship and, most importantly, their own part in its failure. These people then rant all over the internet about their crazy-ass borderlines (who in all likelihood aren't borderline at all). That's usually the sources people claim once asked why they think people with borderline are bad.

 

[Punky143]

I struggle with BPD everyday. I'm in a medical office and read reports from Dr. and see how damming it is. I hate it. I even hear comments made by the medical team how much of a pain in the ass we are. Its even made me think hard about sharing my long list of diagnoses with other providers since I know, for a fact, they'd cringe. I'm different. Not like the rest. And that is my life. And. I HATE it a lot

 

[candor]

Why are they seen as bad people? Because people are not trained to separate behaviours/actions from the person doing harm. A child being hurt will think "It hurts. You are bad. I hate you." An adult being hurt will try to enforce some "socially accepted rules". Bad people break rules. A supporter being hurt accepts that the behaviour will repeat itself and sets boundaries. If the boundary is broken, who will be blamed? When we feel that we are being harmed, we do not stop to consider "Is this done with malicious intent or is it just a brainless script being acted out by a person that has no clue of the damage being done." All we feel is pain. Whatever my belief has been, I have failed to stop the pain felt.

I think that we need to own our own roles. Take manipulation for example: It is all around us and it does not need to be caused by someone with a mental disorder. Some of the manipulation is well intended. Some of it is not. It can be done by someone that is aware of it and it can be done by someone that is not. It feels ugly like someone is forcing you to do something you do not want to do. My job is to figure out if the person making demands has that authority. Without my permission or agreement, they don't get to make me do anything. In my experience, manipulation happens because I am afraid to loose a person, a financial advantage or a feeling of belonging. As long as I am willing to investigate my fears or cut my losses then I don't get manipulated. If you yell at me to get me to do what you want, I simply won't do it. Not everyone has the thick skin you need to have when in such a position.

When I am accused of manipulation, I really try to listen and understand why the person feels that way. I don't try to change their mind. Before recovering from my own issues, I was in too much pain to realize how I affected anyone. In my opinion, any interest in how others feel shows that you are on your way to a recovery. If they still feel manipulated then I don't insist on the relationship. It is a perception. Manipulation is hard to know or prove one way or another unless it has become a pattern. I know from personal experience how hard it is for anyone that feels manipulated to change their belief and to view things differently. Its a trust issue. I do not want to be in relationships where there is no trust.

We are living in a society where to "put our needs first" has become not just common place but makes healthy sense. Altruistic acts are often questioned. You become a suspect when no one can see the benefits you reap from self sacrafice.

BPD is poorly understood and the basket where all that lack of understanding gets dumped. By trying to understand it as best I could, I have grown tons and I have failed and then picked myself up and becomed more humble when it comes to dealing with pain..both that of others and the baggage I carry.

 

[F_uckYourselves]

I'm guessing because a lot of them have had horrible experiences with people with untreated BPD.

I had a close friend who had it. She treated me, her partner, and most of our mutual friends like absolute garbage. She would have hysterical, screaming meltdowns and say vicious things in anger. If she felt like she wasn't getting the attention she required, she'd go to astonishingly manipulative lengths to obtain it by manufacturing crises that forced everyone to concentrate on her. She would create chaos by spreading rumors and gossip about our friends and strategically playing people off one another to create conflicts so she could then swoop in and save the day by smoothing everything over. She would repeat anything you told her in confidence and then blame you for sharing it in the first place. She always had to be in control of everything, and in her world there were two distinct sets of rules: the set she expected everyone else to follow, and another set that was for her alone and changed at her convenience. She was also a habitual liar

While I don't doubt that her inner life was tumultuous and painful, the way she treated people was completely inexcusable and frankly dehumanizing. I assume others with loved ones with the disorder have had similar experiences.

 

[Symphony]

I thought I read somewhere that BPD is the same as CPTSD and that BPD is created in the person by their messed up parents/authority figures.

Can someone clarify this for me? I'm confused but I swear I've seen both of these things in literature online before (literature meaning written by a clinical professional). I accept if I'm wrong... I just want to know WHY it's wrong (or right) and why I may have seen these things.

 

[Abstract]

I thought I read somewhere that BPD is the same as CPTSD and that BPD is created in the person by their messed up parents/authority figures.Can someone clarify this for me? I

Messed up childhoods are thought to be a known possible contributor. So is biology and other factors. Not all those with BPD will have a history of trauma or abuse. Some don't. No, it isn't actually the same as CPTSD.

The CPTSD theory is still up for debate but refers to people who have PTSD and on top of that have personality changes as a result of clinical trauma. Someone could have both CPTSD and BPD or either one or the other. The version of CPTSD which is going to come out soon in ICD 11 clearly differentiates between the two and the diagnoses will allow someone to have both or either diagnoses. In other words: BPD; BPD and PTSD; BPD and CPTSD; CPTSD; PTSD etc..

Most people who have BPD don't have PTSD. Most people with PTSD don't have BPD. A fair amount of people with complex trauma (and especially whilst growing up) show personality changes and dissociation. That tends to be the arena of CPTSD. If those disturbances are enough then a personality disorder diagnoses comes into place.

I also think Martha Linehan's theory about a clinically invalidating environment are interesting if you haven't read it.

Some people theorise that all who supposedly have complex trauma have BPD but that's not widely accepted at all.

 

[Symphony]

So the consensus is still that you're "born with" BPD and it's not environmentally caused?

 

[recoveringfromptsd]

I have been in the mental health system since early childhood, and long before PTSD was even recognized. BPD seems to be a catchall for those of us who have behavioral issues that affect dealing with others. Most of the PDOC like to use BPD a lot, my last diagnosis until I got to SP TDU included the usual BPD, and other labels that make us look like we are untreatable.

It was a good thing I dropped out of the system completely for over a decade (functioned as a hypomanic most of the time).
It allowed me to reenter the system when I needed it with the old labels following me as when I was hospitalized in July I was manic and depressed at the same time, and was too disorganized to give them any history.

While SP had the records from those old times, the disregarded them, probably because all those labels amount to trying to get ones needs met, while struggling with the trust issues that make dealing with others hard or impossible.

I now only have two DX's

Bi-polar I with features
PTSD

 

[Abstract]

No. The way I understand it the consensus is that trauma or bad parenting are a common factor in its development. But that;s different from saying it is CPTSD. Does that make sense? One of the foundations of it is thought to be emotion regulation and another abandonment issues.(etc) These are things we learn in childhood but some people may be more that way inclined in temperament. Quite subtle things can mess that up and very extreme things can too. But some people end up with severe BPD without trauma and definitely without PTSD. For others trauma can be the main factor for them developing these issues. There are also hundreds of different ways people can potentially react to trauma.

I think when it comes to environment and biology (nurture nature) most people agree that most things are a combination of both and epigenetics is a part of that. Our environment or our parents environment triggering some genetic switches to switch on and if other factors then occur one gets the condition occurring. The good thing if this is a factor then epigenetics is affected by environment of all types so positive learning and environment can change these things too.

Is this something that you are dealing with for you?

 

[Symphony]

Is this something that you are dealing with for you?

It's come up by unspecified family members that I may be BPD (they are in denial about family dysfunction) but every provider I see tells me it's impossible for me to be BPD so I guess that's just that. And also that it was impossible for me to be diagnosed with a personality disorder before the age of 18. My mental health mentor basically once told me that BPD doesn't even really exist, that it's just a catch-all phrase for kids who got messed up by their parents' incompetency.