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BPD Why are people with borderline personality seen as bad people?

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This has been very interesting to read. I have found there to be negative connotations with the bpd diagnosis. I've been diagnosed with that, along with CPTSD and bipolar disorder so I feel like I'm just battling a lot. My memories are so fuzzy about getting the bpd diagnosis, and then a long time T told me I have "traits" and may not necessarily have the disorder. When I read the DSM 5 requirements for bpd, I identify a lot, as I do with bipolar and CPTSD.

But in the long run, does the diagnosis matter as much as what we are doing to help ourselves! I've been doing dbt since 2013 and it has helped greatly, although sometimes I still get disregulated. I go to therapy, a psychiatrist and tasked my meds. I've hospitalized myself when I feel unsafe. I feel like I'm doing everything I can, but still struggle.

For me, it is all exhausting. All of these things overlap. I don't even care what I have anymore. I don't want my illness to define me. I just want to feel better.
 
A long time ago, I was diagnosed with Borderline PD (Personality Disorder) and I hadn't taken it well....
My mother was BPD with a strong narcissistic component. She was very manipulative, lied, and played family members against each other. It was very easy to tell when she was fearful or PTSD triggered versus stacking the deck for her own attention needs.
 
My mother was BPD with a strong narcissistic component. She was very manipulative, lied, and played family members against each other.

I think thats likely the narcissistic component as i dont know how to manipulate or gaslight on purpose and if you watch the video I posted, neither does the BPDers on there and the professionals advise that they dont. Therefore, thats not the BPD unless it was not on purpose and not known. And in that case, it shouldnt be held against the person. I dont know how to manipulate on purpose.

My point is so many are advising of abusive parents that have BPD AND NPD (and something else). That is the NPD (or the something else), not the BPD as BPDer may be manipulating but not on purpose.

This thread is asking why so many see BPDer as "monsters". This is why. From the outside it looks like we are crazy, psycho, manipulating, gaslighting, angry (exploding), abusive, freaks/abusers; when we are feeling every emotion in its highest intensity, going through pure hell inside and in tremdous pain, wanting badly for someone to understand, pushing away due to fear but wanting badly for someone to stay. We dont know how else to be, think this is normal, and even if we dont it takes a LONG time and patience/persistence to get better but outsiders dont seem to be patient, wants you to be better now and end up leaving anyway though you are trying to get better.

By the same token, when I hear someone say something like, "BPD's are difficult/bad/toxic/etc", I get where they're coming from and I really struggle to hold it against them.

I dont necessarly hold it against them but wish most would give us a chance. If given the chance I make a very good, caring, and loyal friend but am never given that chance in the world because all people see is "emotional / rageful (not anger though seen as anger) / difficult / bad / toxic / manipulative / gaslighting / and other stuff"

I suppose this is why BPDers are alone....
 
I dont know how to manipulate on purpose.
Because you don't do it on purpose doesn't mean it's not what's being perceived by the other person.

An example that's pretty commonly used to describe this is the symptom people with borderline display of crisis magnification. A person with borderline may state they will harm themselves because of the actions or inactions of another. For the person with BPD, this is coming from the intensity of emotion they experience, coupled with the attachment struggles they have. The statement is often placed in the same context a threat would occupy.

For the person listening, when it's been a pattern of behavior, they perceive it as a threat being used to manipulate their (the receivers) emotions and actions into whatever the person with BPD wants from them in that moment.

It's symptoms and perception.

The person with BPD needs to work on regulating so they don't default to threatening dangerous action against themselves. The supporter needs to work on remaining neutral when this behavior manifests.

What is kind of brilliant about the full DBT structure is that the client is basically fully immersed in regulation support. The logbook is daunting but a really good teaching tool for use in the group sessions. The therapist is on call 24/7 for skills support. Literally. And then, the private therapy actually rounds out the talking bit.

I just don't think anyone could do it and hold down a full time job, or have many responsibilities. It's a huge time commitment to do it in the Linehan full-on therapeutic model.

I don't necessarly hold it against them but wish most would give us a chance. If given the chance I make a very good, caring, and loyal friend
I think this is very well said, and I also don't doubt it.

There's not nearly enough support constructed for people living with BPD, both sufferers and supporters. I've never understood why family therapy wasn't a recommended component. Education helps.
 
I just don't think anyone could do it and hold down a full time job, or have many responsibilities. It's a huge time commitment to do it in the Linehan full-on therapeutic model.

Maybe not the full DBT group thing but im just going through the book (actually just the first 2 chapters of the book) and its working. I dont have a therapist 24/7 and it is harder but its doable.

I think this site helps as in those times that i would need to talk to the therapist, talking here helps to settle down the emotions and helps me to see clearer.

Not saying this site should be used in the place of a therapist but just saying the how I have it all placed, its working. And I have a full time job and it calls for someone to be screaming at me all day.

The Seriquel XR also helps a ton to dumb down the intense emotions some.

There's not nearly enough support constructed for people living with BPD, both sufferers and supporters. I've never understood why family therapy wasn't a recommended component. Education helps.

Yes! A supporter group would be VERY helpful. Like al anon, how to best to be in a relationship (friend, family, BF/GF, wife/husband) and best support while best looking out for your own needs.

Education is what im posting here. Or trying to anyway.
 
So, no, it's not a given that people with BPD are 'monsters'. They are capable of extreme behaviors that make communication nearly impossible.

I agree.

It's the periodic extreme behaviors that garner so much public attention. And, when in 'extreme mode', borderlines can be remarkably difficult to deal with - but that doesn't make them 'bad'.

I don't think people who are Borderline are labeled as bad people I have heard them labeled as "difficult".

'Difficult' is the word that comes to mind regarding BPD.
 
I think that the behaviors people with BPD can show when they are disregulated are similar, or look similar, to the behaviors manipulative people can chose to use.

Like, my son has severe anxiety. He can rock back and forth to calm himself. A stubbornly undereducated teacher kept insisting he had autisim, because "they do that".

I had a manipulative boyfriend. If something upset him, he would scream, rage, and self harm, so that I would never upset him. Luckily, I saw that this was voluntary behavior and not mental illness. When I met someone in treatment with BPD, and she became upset, she would scream, rage, and self harm. But she didn't know what else to do. As we went through DBT together, she worked her ass off, and started doing more positive things to expels herself and having less "hurricaines" of emotion. (I stopped dissociating as much, among other things).

So, I can see how people can get confused, but it is still judgey and demeaning to say bad things about people because of a mental illness. Just my HO. Laura
 
I've known a number of borderlines in my life.

All were without boundaries and all of them made everything about them. They'd force themselves onto you and act like a total victim when you tried to set and enforce boundaries.

I won't knowingly deal with another borderline ever again. It's just not worth it.
 
@lostforgottensoul - that's such an important point. People with BPD come in all shapes and sizes. They are as much a unique individual as anyone else. And just like people with ptsd may have similarities, that doesn't mean we're all exactly the same as each other.

The list of symptoms that make up BPD is extensive, each person has their own combination of symptoms, and each symptom can present differently from one person to another. So there's a huge variation in presentation from one BPD to another.

I think it would be pretty reasonable for a person with BPD to expect to be accepted as an individual, and based on their own character, rather than be assumed to be a very particular type of person, uniform with all other BPDs. Mental illness just doesn't work that way, and it could easily be seen as plain old discrimination to assume that all BPDs are exactly the same and should be treated as such.

We're all individuals, BPD or not, and should be accepted according to our own merits and character.
 
I have had the BPD label at some point, and in 1992 a huge point was made in my records about manipulating, and such. That hospitalization did not end well. And while I agree with some of what was said, how I was treated by the team was terrible. When I got my records and read this stuff I dropped out of the mental health system completely, stopped taking meds, and moved out of the area, I functioned in a hypomanic state that way for 15+ years. It was only until I had to move up north again that I ended up hospitalized due to a severe manic/depressive episode. That was july. And that was followed by PHP which is where my PTSD got opened up resulting in my recent hospitalization at PRATT's TDU, beside having a full blown manic and depressive episode at the TDU (they diagnosed me as a MANIC I with mixed features due to the fact I had a full blown manic and my manic and depression symptom sometimes co-exist at the same time.)

My BPD behaviors all come from my abuse, problem with mind docs is most of them have no clue when it comes to PTSD. I would speculate that most if not all those with the BPD label are abuse victims with unrecognized PTSD.

I also found that it was recognized in a couple of my hospitalizations but I nothing was ever done from that recognition. I even had a full psych review done on me which led to me being in a women's group at the mental health center, that's where I made my first disclosure. So on the sum of things I never really got any treatment specifically for PTSD and dealing with ABUSE until my recent hospitalization at PRATT.
 
I think ragdoll circus made an important point and one I was thinking of. There are range of symptoms.

I think people mistake a personality disorder as describing a person. People do that with PTSD too to an extent. The label BPD (or any other PD) does not describe a person. A person is not a BPD. It describes a range of potential behaviours or relationships the person has with themselves or others. Many with PD's will have traits from other PD's or qualify for more than one. For example BPD and NPD. Other people may not have any and may not even have the usual rage symptoms. Depending on how much of certain traits someone has and how much control over them they have/self awareness etc it is going to be way more or way less difficult to interact. A bit like some with PTSD are going to be way easier or more difficultly to deal with depending on other facets of their personality, symptom control and self awareness. Despite the severituy of the condition.

@Morphius remember always that you are not a pd and are a human being. You can remind others of that too if they use that type of language with you. Difficulties in how you interact with others and yourself can improve with hard work and self awareness. Your essence is you.

As for manipulation: Martha Linaman was very informative on this topic in my opinion. Before that many interpreted behaviours as purposefully manipulative. Martha explained it as usually a desperate and unconscious attempt to get needs met. Manipulations definition is to get ones needs met indirectly. That doesn't have to be a conscious thing, However it is good for anyone who does this type of behaviour, BDP or not, to realise it doesn't feel good to be on the receiving end of it and indirectly attempting to get needs met is not a great idea.

It think its usually this and the push/pull black/white and rage issues that are hardest to deal with from the receiving end Morphius if one has them so that can be a great place to start. Try not to read and believe what you find on the internet as there is masses of misinformation. Many people wrongly talk about BPD when what they are really dealing with is a person with is Antisocial PD or mixed with NPD.

I have a few people with BPD in my life in one way or the other. Like anyone else they range from a person who is compassionate and caring (although highly self destructive and distressed) to someone else on the other end of the spectrum who never does a single thing for anyone else other than herself, is highly aggressive and manipulative as well as abusive to her children (who she has severely damaged and left one with ptsd).

What do you think are the main symptoms you are struggling with BDP wise and have you had any proper help dealing with them? Its brave of you to post.
 
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