Childhood Abusive Kissing?

[Maxi]

Worst case scenario, your parents willingly handed you over to an abusive person and knew everything that was going on. Best case scenario, your parents don't understand what abuse is and permit bad behavior (sort of like in Shimmerz case.)

It sounds like they are in denial. You can believe them and stay in your own denial. No, I'm not trying to make you believe that you were abused when you weren't, rather you're presenting a LOT of info about being abused so its a matter of you coming into your own and accepting the truth. You've posted before about all of your symptoms, but seem to be unable to accept that bad things happened to you. Denial can and will prevent your healing.

I can't imagine my parents just handing me over, it doesn't fit with the way I've been raised, but I think perhaps they didn't realise that it was such a big deal (well my dad, did as he got angry). My parents love me, but I think because the people, particularly the guy who did this was a close friend, they just swept things under the cover.

Its abuse. No doubt. God if anyone did anything like that to my child I would call the Police. Not your fault your mother's for being aware and allowing it. What planet was she on?

I can't understand how any mother would allow that unless she was complicit. Does she have some sort of condition such as low IQ or was she abused herself? Because otherwise she was guilty of allowing you to be abused. No excuse. Have you ever seen anyone on TV, in public, French kiss a child? You would just jump back in horror. Because it is wrong and no way would you not know that.

.

She doesn't have a low IQ and I don't know if she was abused, but she's my mother and I love her and I don't think she'd ever do anything intentionally to harm me.

 

[Queen Boudica]

So your parents let you alone with a known alcoholic to baby sit you. a baby. And she knew he was French kissing you. That is neglect. I don't know intentional or not but you have a child you don't leave them with an alcoholic to baby sit them and no you don't let them French kiss your child. What you are describind is abuse and neglect.

 

[Maxi]

This is a big one.

She's never said anything about being abused. She is very conservative about sex and is disgusted by kissing and oral and told me never to let a man make me do it (I know, not the sort of conversations you expect mother and daughter to have), but I just put that down to prudishness. But that's why I think it's odd that she doesn't seem to show any disgust at the fact that he may have preformed these acts on me as a baby. She struggles to even kiss my father, but was happy to let this man kiss me like this; it doesn't make sense to me. I'm just so confused. She also used to make me finger myself when I had showers; not in a bad way, just in a 'you need to be clean' way. She never took pleasure out of it, it was just normal; or was it normal, I don't know, I don't know where the line is anymore.

 

[Queen Boudica]

You need to talk this over with a counsellor. What you just described was also not normal. This isn't really something I think that a forum should handle. What you have described was not OK, I can't imagine anyone asking their child to clean themselves with their finger like that. But you need to talk to talk this over. This is too big.

 

[Maxi]

@Lizio

I have a therapist, but I've not discussed this with her yet (only bits and bobs).

But her intention wasn't abusive and I don't feel traumatised and she still talks about it as the best way to keep clean down there (she doesn't describe it as fingering, but that is what it is in essence). I know longer clean like that, I don't think it's a big deal, perhaps it was just the way she was taught.

 

[Maxi]

@Lizio you make me feel like I'm not normal :(

 

[shimmerz]

Yes, see that is inappropriate. Very, very inappropriate.

This leads me back to this statement:

Anyway, what I am trying to say is that if someone is not all warped out, it is really easy to pick out inappropriate behaviour.

And it seems like a link is broken here Maxi.

 

[Queen Boudica]

I'm sorry I am not meaning to make you feel like not normal. I described my own situation where my teacher was abusing me and I didn't realise that wasn't normal for years. I didn't realise a lot of things about my childhood that was not normal or my own marriage. It is not you it is the situation. You asked the questions. Those situations were not normal. Not you. So I'm sorry if you think I'm saying that I am not. I have been in a similar situation and not realised for years. That is not not being normal. It is being normalised to abuse. Happened to a lot of us

 

[shimmerz]

It is being normalised to abuse.

Brilliant. Yes. Well put Lizio.

 

[Queen Boudica]

And that is it. Why would you talk about the best way of being cleaned down there with your grown daughter? I don't know about your mother. But what you are describing does not sound right. Yes normalised to abuse. I was normalised for so long. When you start talking about it, then your realise. Your mother may not realise. But honestly, leaving a child with an alcoholic and letting them French kiss you. That is not what a mother would do if she did not have some kind of problem. So what is behind it I don't know. And you are normal. I could tell you stuff I've done and I can't believe it now. But that is it you become normalised to this. That is why it is so important to get help with a professional and talk it over. Because it is like an awakening and you need to work it out for yourself.

 

[Maxi]

Saying she 'normalised me to abuse' makes it sound as if she groomed me for perverts, she didn't, she didn't and doesn't think these things are a big deal and she doesn't take any pleasure out of them. My parents worked very hard and friends lived with us so it was natural to let them babysit. She wasn't sexual with me, she didn't touch me, she just made sure I was clean. It does feel icky when she talks about it today, but only because I'm a grown up and such things are icky. I don't think she's a bad person, in fact she's a lovely women and loves me more than I can convey.

It's the Easter break at the moment so my therapist is on holiday, but I may bring it up when she gets back, I don't know, despite our strong relationship, I can't imagine looking another human being in the eye and telling them about this stuff, it would seem like a betrayal to my parents. I know they'll probably never know what I say in therapy, but it would be like telling people that I think they were bad parents, when I don't, they love me, they just didn't know how to look after me properly.

 

[Queen Boudica]

No that is not what it is saying normalising does not mean grooming. That is what you are reading into it. You need to talk this over. You are on a public forum discussing it. And no it was not natural to let alcoholics baby sit you or let them French kiss you. Even if they were staying in your house.That is not OK. No-one is saying they didn't love you but you clearly want to question this and then when you get a reply you don't like you take it as someone saying you are not normal or other misreading or what I have written. This is why you need to talk with a professional.