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Deb, my friend killed herself this morning.

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Thank you. She was great towards the end of her life ( she didn't know she had cancer) but she was used to being baseball mom before a lil' girl jumped in her life ( with my Dad and brother) oh man.... Not so easy.. But point is, she did something that would later on benefit the whole state and it started with her and the people she knew in a podunk lil' town. She is buried right beside my brother because she never got over his death.


She'd love the compliment though,
Kudos to your Mother!
so thank-you Miss Living in Seventies!
 
I have sat in my words for two weeks now. (aka live special moments for them.) i have really tried hard to back my crap up. As much as an artist, metalhead, woman who wants more Portishead in her life, I am probably the "crazy bird lady" of my street, (im Not an old bat?) but believe me, it has given me so much insight lately. At my biggest time of grieving for her, I fed the birds even more. Cleaning bird bowls more. Giving them even more fresh water each morning or chance I get. I recognize this is a phase that happens with loss. But for me, with intellectual animals--dogs, birds, (and more rare) have been coming around lately since my friends death. I don't think she's trying to say something to me. She has two kids that are wondering what happened to their mom. And later they will wonder why it was so much it was worth leaving them. Talk to them first. BUT. That's why I feed them. I hope/feel birds are reincarnated lost souls. Such tortured beings that they deserved another chance and this time, they FLY. FREED completely. They don't live in hell like books say, they visit my home, I may give them something to fill their belly, sing a beautiful song to anyone they love, eat some wonderful food before they take a gorgeous trip they've always wanted to. This time it's free of charge. ?
 
Show yourself a little compassion. Your body thinks that’s self care, which you’re very much in need of right now.
That is true!

So it makes sense you’d relapse a little.
It does!

Don’t be hard on yourself. You can have gotten better and still need to struggle during a particularly hard time.
That is so true! I can have gotten better and as I am human I still need to struggle during a particularly hard time.
 
she did not choose to pursue a path of wellness or life. There are so many people who work so hard here, and have very few resources, she had many resources but she still chose not to work on the issues in her life.

Did she really understand the issues in her life? Denial is a huge obstacle and perhaps one she never got past. Resources don't matter if someone isn't aware enough of their own issues to use them.

I feel angry that I gave her so much support when I know how hard people here work hard and she didn't make anything of that.

You have every right to feel angry as there are a lot of feelings for you to process. You genuinely wanted to help.

They really thought that they could do it themselves. They didn't want the shame of mental illness.

There is huge shame and there is also the shame of not being able to handle life. I cannot speak for your friend, but I can speak for myself, as I am fiercely independent and prefer to handle things myself as the scariest thing for me is to be dependent and vulnerable. So perhaps, you friend may have carried a bit of this and did believe she could get better on her own.

if they want to do it, they will find a way.

Yes, when someone has made up their mind, has a plan and has executed the best chance of stopping it is in those moments. However, when a plan is executed one of the components is making sure no one can stop you.

I don't want it to be her choice and her decision

In the moment it can seem to be the only option and when executing the plan is can seem to be an almost rational and logical decision. The pain of depression and the perception of the pain that you cause others can all be reasons that legitimize and make the course of action seem to be the best choice. The problem is when someone is mentally ill the logic is flawed, but they can't see that.

that people often can seem quite well before they do it.

Yes, when the decision is made and the plan is in place there is a huge relief because there is a solution to the problem. One of the biggest warning signs that unfortunately is very misinterpreted.

I could see it though. I was able to name it. I did warn people.

Yes, you saw and you warned and don't ever stop warning when you see the signs. However you can only let people know what you see but you can't make them take action on it. It also hard for people to take action, because you can't forcibly take someone and have them committed even if it is for their own good. In this country only the authorities or medical personnel can execute that type of intervention.

My heart goes out to you as there will always be so many unanswered questions because the person that has the answers isn't here any more. You have so much going on in your own life right know I hope you are able to find peace with yourself that you did your best and that is all that anyone can do.
 
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My heart goes out to you as there will always be so many unanswered questions because the person that has the answers isn't here any more. You have so much going on in your own life right know I hope you are able to find peace with yourself that you did your best and that is all that anyone can do.

Thank you @intothelight. My heart is a bit broken? sad? bewildered? lost? teary? I can't feel, but right now there are a few tears.

I did do a lot for her. I just wish it could have been more and it could have meant something more to her. To me it seemed so doable what she had to do. But her anxiety was incapacitated her, literally to death in the end.

Finding peace - can't do that at this time. But I will have to feel some feelings and be present with it all, which I haven't been doing. But I will.
 
So a mutual friend of Deb and I has returned from overseas, she wanted to know if I was coming tonight to trivia. I said I don't really want to sit at the old table (where Deb, her husband, her sister, a mutual couple friends, and another single friend sit), she said that when someone decides to commit suicide that no one can stop them, and I texted back "That is true." but it was a long story and I didn't want to go. She said why no come, so we can all get through it together, well I am not going to sit there and listen to revisionist history, but I didn't say that to her. So I said long story but I am not coming, so she said she wanted to see me on Friday and catch up and I said sure because that is a friendship that I do want to pursue, but I don't want to pursue a friendship with Deb's husband. They can say what they want, and they have to cope now, but I don't have to agree and lie.
 
So it is hard, because if we hadn't spent so much time with the others at trivia, then going to sit with my friend and her husband, who have returned from overseas, wouldn't be a big deal. I don't want to engage with the revisionist history, but I also don't want to be unkind either. It is not useful or necessary. The appropriate thing is to just disengage, and not go. I will be working soon, and I won't have time for trivia anyway. I don't have respect for Deb's husband, and that was long before she committed suicide. Her sister has a difficult personality, and B doesn't like her, or want to be around her, and I feel the same, and the other three, well I really like T&L, as well as M, but it is not work going to put up with Deb's husband's comments, he is pretty sexist, or to listen to her sister's glass is half full commentary. She thinks that teachers should teach like they did 40 years ago, and when I explained that only 15% of the Australian population went to Year 12, or the final year of high school, and if we taught the content teachers taught 40 years ago then we would only be teaching up to a Grade 4 or 5 level in terms of content. She is also racist, and seriously I don't need that in my life. I only really went to see Deb, (and for long periods didn't even go for that as trivia was boring me,) and have the occasional conversation with the three others I like, but L has serious social anxiety and agoraphobia, and doesn't do anything to improve her life, and that is her choice, but we live very different lives, I work on myself all the time.

I know it is not my responsibility how other people experience things, but if we went and sat with the others, it would hurt their feelings, and I know that they would read it in a negative way, and I don't want to do that. They have had a terrible tragedy in their lives, and they have to construct narratives and stories to manage that. We all do that to some extent.

I spoke to Deb's husband and told her that her behaviours were like someone about to attempt suicide. I gave him resources - Suicide Call Back Line, go see a pyschiatrist, ring the mental health team, etc etc when he paid no attention to me, I got B to ring up and say the same things in case it was sexism that was preventing him from hearing me, I think it was denial now or no capacity, but whatever it was when Deb's husband rang up and said we don't know what was happening there (in reference to the suicide) B just cut him off and then talked about something else to do with the funeral. I get it he couldn't deal with what I was saying but I don't have to listen to him saying everything was done that could be done, when in my opinion that is not true. I said to him get the Internet disconnected, and he got patronising nad condescending and said "Oh no, a lot of things I do is the Internet!" REally someone tells you of their fears of your partner killing themselves and you can't take a couple of basic steps? On the other side to say that to them what I think and feel would not be compassionate and now that she has committed suicide not at all helpful. So I have decided not to continue on with those people, in my social network, and that is my choice.

I got angry on the 1st of June when Deb said she was going into retreat to "heal," it was clearly bullshit, and that she had decided to commit suicide and was getting rid of anyone in her life who could have called her on her stuff. That was her choice. I am still angry about her choice, at times, and for a few minutes here and there I shed a few tears. I am not good at feeling feelings. I think that is my main problem, instead of feeling feelings I go in to ruminations or maladaptive daydreaming or comfort eating or binge eating. I said when she retreated to my partner that the next time we would all see each other would be at her funeral, and that did turn out to be true, it was not a hard thing to see what was happening, for me anyway.

I guess I am angry at Deb as well because I know how easy it is to go to that space, and I also tried to kill myself in 2013, so I feel a bit of hypocrite.

I am thinking that when I see my friend on Friday that I shouldn't say much, just say it was sad, and leave it at that, because me rehashing my conversations with Deb, that if she is that unhappy in the relationship, and her husband was that selfish that I said that she really didn't want to go down the same path as his first wife, (who also committed suicide). She agreed, and she did Facebook me that he had agreed to buy her out in two years if he still didn't want to move, because the house was too hard to manage for her now as she ages. I would imagine telling my friend that would not be useful for her to know I guess? I know she wouldn't say it to Deb's husband, and I know that Deb did care for him as well. But she was very unhappy and anxious about the relationship, and she was furious about being made to stay in the house against her will, and I did suggest to just go away for a week or a weekend for a meditation retreat, so he could get a sense of not having her there, and maybe he would appreciate her a bit more, what I think happened, and I will never know for sure, but that she didn't trust the strength of the relationship, she had attachment issues. I know though she decided to commit suicide sometime in the middle of May, and June the 1st she started, she got rid of me, (when I said to my partner the next time we will all see each other will be at her funeral) and she just retreated into the anxiety and distress and somatisation.

Somehow we need to support people who somatise their anxiety and depression instead of just not taking them seriously.

Anyway I did go to her funeral and I did go to the wake for a time as well. It wasn't about me, and my anger, it was about showing respect, and also giving solace to a couple of people that truly didn't know that someone could feel that bad and take such actions. One woman came to me and said if I had only seen her, and I said to her there was nothing you could have done, she had made her decision. That she cut people out so they could not make an input.

But I won't pretend that no one knew that she could potentially kill herself as I called it months before she killed herself. I could see it. So it is not necessary for me to say anything as that would only cause hurt, but it is also not necessary for me to listen to all the the comments (which to me are lies) that it was such a shock when I mentioned my concerns to multiple people many times, and approached her husband directly, and made a specific phone call and B repeated that phone call, and I didn't sleep for a couple of weeks from stressing about it, after she cut me off. That is not my reality, for those with low capacity to manage and deal with such things, that is their truth, for her husband who was in denial, despite my comments and phone calls, that is his truth.

I wish I had written this out yesterday instead of comfort/binge eating. That would have been a more useful use of my time rather than dissociated reading whilst numbing out on food.
 
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You have no obligation to these people. It's entirely appropriate to distance yourself from them. They sound toxic - and that is not something you need in your life right now. You need to grieve for your friend, not deal with those left behind.
I think your overseas friend may want to know your thoughts on this but it's ok to tell her you are not ready to talk about it. I get your anger -- and I think I would be in the same place if I had tried to help and they blew me off.

You did everything you could to help her.
You did everything you could to help her.
Please remember that....
 
Thanks for your feedback and comments @Freida I didn't think that I was but I am still grieving for Deb.

I have been a bit numb and I just rang the Suicide Call Back Line and ended up crying about it.

I only rang to discuss managing these people, but I fell apart when the woman asked me how I was dealing with it. I have emotions there that came up.
 
The distorted cognition is that I am not to be trusted and nothing I ever do turns out okay. I have done things that turn out okay.

The other distorted cognition is because I feel left out and excluded when I was cut out, that I always have been and always will be. I was severely abused and abandoned as a child, I had to give up myself to meet my Mother's needs. I often have that severe abandonment triggered, but that does not mean I will always be friendless. It just means I am extremely triggered by my abandonment issues at the moment.

A lot of the folks I know have PTSD, other issues I tried to branch out, and it was not successful.
 
So I have a friend that is a mutual friend of Deb, and it seems that she is not pleased with me, but if I lose that friendship, I can live with that. I don't know that will happen at this time. I JUST FEEL ANXIOUS ABOUT IT ALL. I got a terse text from her yesterday when I texted her that I had been to the dentist's and I might not be able to make it today. She said she was pretty busy today anyway so let us just cancel it.

It won't be a bad thing if I don't see her for a bit, she just found out that Deb killed herself a short time ago, so she is in shock, I did say to her before she left the country that when people behave like Deb that it can mean that they are getting ready for a suicide attempt.
 
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