General I Feel Stuck And Want To Give Up

[DMerish]

I thought this post could go in a couple of places, so chose "Discussion General" - Hope I've posted it in the right spot . . .

Today was my grand-daughter’s third birthday. I suggested to my daughter-in-law that she include my daughter (severe PTSD) in the preparations, knowing that she’d enjoy the artsy-fartsy stuff and that it may help her feel more a part of the family. It was understood not to give my daughter tasks that might overwhelm her, and that begin around a lot of people might be uncomfortable, so she might leave early – Everyone was “in” on it including my daughter. All was planned well.

I entered the home of my son, holding heavy gifts and goodies to eat, and headed to the kitchen. Moments later, my daughter walked in to set something down and says, “Hey Mom” – an acknowledgement, said flatly, yet an acknowledgement nonetheless. I turned, hugged her (no hug back) and warmly say, “Hi Honey, good to see you.” . . . We went about our respective party tasks.

Later, I noticed my daughter is animated – seemingly having a good time at the party and talking to lots of folks. She’s sitting with my former first husband (not her dad), his wife and their daughter – we’ve all known each other a very, very long time. The four of them along with my youngest son’s fiancé are in conversation about my daughter’s new tattoo.

As I go to sit down next to youngest son’s fiancé, across from former husband, and diagonal to my daughter, I ask, “Oh, can I see it?” My former husband’s wife leans forward, protecting my daughter, waves her hand back and forth and tells me, “No, we’re not showing it to anyone else.” Everyone laughs, but me. I wasn’t in on the beginning of the conversation and I’m not in on “the joke.”

I fall silent while we eat and the rest of them talk.

Later, I try again – My daughter is now sitting across from my youngest son’s fiancé. I sit down and begin talking with youngest son’s fiancé wondering where he is at (he had to attend a class). Knowing that my daughter has enrolled in college, I think that subject might be a better in-road to having a conversation between the three of us (fiancé just graduated) and so I ask my daughter if she got the classes she wanted. My daughter answers with a heavy sigh: “I just finished telling somebody else. (shaking head no and rolling her eyes) I don’t want to go over it again with you.”

Me: “Well, then, I’ll just shut up and leave.” (and I go) Yea, I know - real mature :yuck:

Prior to my daughter’s trauma event, we were in no contact – long story, she assaulted me (unprovoked). I reached out to her after her trauma event (I have moderate PTSD from abuse from her father, which has not been disclosed to my children). The connections we have had over the last several months (card, emails, phone, texts, and lunches out) have all been through my initiation.

I feel that my daughter has rejected me most of her life. I feel she hates me. I feel intimidated by her and afraid that she may one day strike me again. Intellectually, I don’t think she would but I feel she might.

To hate me, to feel disdain for me (I believe is unwarranted and the result of parental alienation). Regardless, to hate me is her prerogative. But it hurts and I can’t take it anymore.

I feel inclined to write my daughter an email saying “I give up” – If she wants a relationship with me, or if there’s something that I can do to help her move forward in her life, she’s can take steps to get in touch with me directly.

I know doing this would not go over well with my son’s and their wives – Doing so would put a wedge between me and them (which I don't want) because they couldn't fathom how a mother “give up” on her daughter - I feel that in my daughter’s eyes, that I am a worthless piece of crap. That she has succumb to the lies her father told her (my son's have learned about their father's true character). She is blind (they're not going to tell her), and I'm sick of the whole mess.

I feel stuck – and welcome advice/insights how to handle the situation.

Drew

 

[Leah123]

If you truly want to know what she's thinking, I would tell her or show her what you just wrote and let her give you feedback about it. Then you'll know for certain where you stand. That might be best done in therapy, if you can get her to attend a session, or with a neutral third party, so someone can help interpret for you two if emotions run very high. Another way to approach it more diplomatically is with the assertiveness model: tell her how you feel, how you think she's feeling, and ask for what you want, directly, clearly, without the expectation of getting it. Keep in mind, you're the mother, and it is indeed your job to suck it up and to reach out, provided that's what she wants. I'm a mother, and that's my take on it.

 

[franciemarnie]

I feel for you. What heartbreak.

I agree with the idea of showing her what you wrote here. Then I might say, I love you but it seems clear to me that right now you don't care for my company. I feel sad every time this happens. I don't like feeling like this nor do I want to force a relationship with you if you don't want one so I will leave you alone for now. If you should ever want to talk to me, I will be available.

Just the simple truth. No one can deny truth spoken plainly.

 

[bell]

Hi @DMerish, I'm not a mom, but I am a daughter that has pushed my mom away. (Regretfully.)

Although I see the downside to your original post, I see the love that you have for your daughter, especially in the first part! You orchestrated things beautifully! Well done you!

The biggest thing here (and the hardest thing) is to not play the martyr. (Which you noted that you did!) Doing that will create a wedge between you and your daughter. (I speak from experience.) Because even if it is protecting yourself in a sense, it reinforces negative feelings both to you and those who hear it. (And hurts you the most, I'm afraid... As it hurts you externally and internally.)

What about writing a letter that doesn't say "I give up" from a negative standpoint, but one from a stronger standpoint? I.e., one that says "I love you very much, but am not sure that you want my help, so I am going to let you come to me?" that way, you are not playing the martyr, and instead are strengthening your boundaries. I may also suggest reading/listening to the audiobooks of Harriet Lerner, she has been very helpful for me, especially The Dance of Connection and The Dance of Anger, and may be helpful for you, too?

Best of luck and be sure to take time for yourself to heal during all of this, as rejection can sure hurt like hell.

 

[DMerish]

Thanks for the replies - I've been somewhat agitated by my daugter's behavior (in general) over the last couple of weeks - more like years. I'm sick of the lies, the secrets, and what I call "false manipulation syndrom" i.e. her father/her playing the victim role and living off others. Part of my problem is that my PTSD was excalibrated by her physical assult - If the assult had occured from anyone else's hand, they would not be part of my life. Because she is my daughter, I'm really wrestling with how to handle things.

 

[franciemarnie]

That would be really difficult to deal with given she assaulted you. I wish I knew the perfect answer.

Bottom line - You have to be safe and feel safe no matter who did what. A professional might help advise.

What a quandary.

 

[cavy]

DMerish, I too am a mum & what you are going through right now is very similar to my mum / daughter relationship, I had a very bad relationship with my daughter (she hit me too).

I have worked hard in therapy & have learn't several important things. Everyone unconsciously transfers their emotions, feelings onto those around us. It is called Transference in psychotherpay, have you ever been around someone who is really angry for example? It is perfectly natural for us to pick up on that anger and we start (if we are unaware of what is going on) to feel the same emotions too. Crowds can stir each other up in a demonstration, the same thing happens, every person picks up on the atmosphere. Going back to our ancestors this was probably very helpful, a helpful tool for survival.

My daughter answers with a heavy sigh: “I just finished telling somebody else. (shaking head no and rolling her eyes) I don’t want to go over it again with you.” Me: “Well, then, I’ll just shut up and leave.” (and I go) Yea, I know - real mature :yuck:

Please don't beat yourself up about this but I may be wrong here but I think this is a perfect example.:cautious: It has taken me more than a year to gain insight into this.:banghead:

What helped so much was when I told her without going into details, what had happened to me (traumas) & why I had PTSD. My daughter was so relieved it was as if a corner had been turned, I had shown I trusted her enough to open up to her. She had been angry for several reasons, she was scared (my mental health affecting my mothering skills - I was unable to be a consistent maternal figure - which is not fault of any parent who has PD or PTSD. She was confused, had no idea why she felt the way she did about both of us.

I had the chance to attend parenting classes, they were such a help. Just by using a few simple tools in which we communicate to children, especially to teenagers are.

1. Validate how they are feeling, tell her that "I can see you are feeling angry/upset" etc.
2. Use phrases such as "it would help me so much if you....." this works really well with younger children to.
3. Show empathy, I found this one especially difficult because of my symptoms. I managed it by imagining myself as a famous nanny who has a series on tv. It is an english series but she did go out to the States to do one, can't remember the name.
4. Also try to stay calm and assertive if you are in the right place to do it.

In order to do all of this you need to be feeling well & strong enough to do it. That is where you're therapist might be able to help. My daughter flatly refused to attend any sessions with me, yet things have improved though they are not perfect.

I feel that my daughter has rejected me most of her life. I feel she hates me. I feel intimidated by her and afraid that she may one day strike me again. Intellectually, I don’t think she would but I feel she might.

This is exactly what has gone on through my mind on several occasions, it is a horrible thing to have to admit to but you are being so brave in doing so.:)

To hate me, to feel disdain for me (I believe is unwarranted and the result of parental alienation). Regardless, to hate me is her prerogative. But it hurts and I can’t take it anymore.

Please, please don't give up :hug: I know right now that you feel overwhelmed by the situation, that is perfectly understandable. I was desperate for help but in the end I did get it, with therapy, research and education.

Doing so would put a wedge between me and them (which I don't want) because they couldn't fathom how a mother “give up” on her daughter - I feel that in my daughter’s eyes, that I am a worthless piece of crap. That she has succumb to the lies her father told her (my son's have learned about their father's true character). She is blind (they're not going to tell her), and I'm sick of the whole mess.

I don't advise sending her the e-mail, it looks to me that she is very confused right now & understandably. Her father has obviously not helped by what he has said to her. If she listens to her brothers then perhaps they could talk to her generally, not to confront her about her Dad but if possible just to talk to her in general about him - past events "do you remember when ..." is a good one to start with. Feel free to show them this if you think they are mature enough to understand.

Sorry I have waffled on so much, it is waffling of the most well meaning type of waffling there is!!!;)

I sincerely hope this is of help to you.:hug:

 

[DMerish]

Leah - I understood your sentiment. Since I'm the mother my maturity should act as a model. In this instance it didn't. My error. My response to her was childish - a retort - as in "'Fine, I don't need to talk to you either".
- -

Email today from my daughter: (no greeting) “Why did you get up and leave?” That was weird – I don’t understand why a mother wouldn’t want to be with her children. I’m your daughter and I think it should be a natural feeling to want to spend time with your children. WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU???" (no closure salutation)

I'm not taking the bait. What's there to defend? I was there I to spend time with my grand-daughter, my four children and their spouses, including you (she). I got the impression you (she) weren't interested in spending time with me so I moved on?

I'm not taking the bait. I don't feel that as a mother that it's indeed a my job to "suck it up" and reach out when the child is an adult and past abuse has been involved by the adult child upon the parent. In my mind, doing so is like the reverse of telling a child they should do what their parents tell them to do simply because the parents tell them to. A child being told by a parent to do something that's inappropriate is child abuse. Similarly, "sucking it up" can perpetrate adult child abuse towards the parent. I'm done with that.

 

[ashdawn8287]

1. Dmerish I have admired you from the get go about being a mother. You had posted and talked to me about my own mother and my feelings towards her. I look up to you for being such a great mother.

2. Reality check time. YOU have done everything to maintain a relationship with her and I understand her PTSD gets in the way, but it is NOT right for her to take out her PTSD on you and if she isn't she needs to get help and handle her own feelings instead of projecting them out on you. That is not healthy to you, who also suffers and supports someone. Is there anyway you can sit down and actually talk about your feelings and past stuff with her? What would you like from her? Think about it. YOU are a GREAT mom. Repeat that 5 times OUT LOUD. YOU DON'T DESERVE to be treated like that. Remember that it is PTSD related and as hard as it is don't take it personally. You cannot undo the past or go back and you just have to tell yourself that you handled things in her childhood and in past years the BEST way you could at the time! Life is about making mistakes and learning from them. EVERY parent has regrets and mistakes. DO NOT beat yourself up for that.

3. Time to rid the bad thoughts that have been processing in your head and to counter attack them even if you do not believe them. Here is a link to help you. Also, youtube has some great things if you cant manage to think of any on your own. Simply search "positive affirmations" and sit back and listen.

http://www.vitalaffirmations.com/affirmations.htm#.Ujhgx8aUSaM

4. Go take a nice hot relaxing bath after all of this. Refocus and gain that almighty motherly strength I sense from you.

5. I really do admire you, I know you are a good person. I know you are a good mother and I just know you care so much your family. I am so sorry you are not getting appreciated and it must be hard being put into all of those situations. I know you had a busy week and you were truly looking forward to this past weekend because of your grand daughter and just remember you were there for your grand daughter and try to forget the rest. My therapist says, "You cannot change the way people think about you, but you can change how you think about you." Positive affirmations are the best! Challenge those bad thoughts. You don't know what they are thinking or feeling and it is exhausting trying to figure that out, trust me I spent a lot of my time doing that. My fiancee always reminds me when I am freaking out about what others think he says, "*uck them." Which is basically the thing my therapist says but in an easier way ha. Your children dont know what you had to endure with their father, remember that they don't know truth and whatever that scumbag (no offense) is saying or thinking about you is NOT true.

You really are great dmerish. You have helped me so much. Be kind to yourself. What do you like to do by yourself? Read, garden, watch the sunset/sunrise, sip on some hot tea, light some candles, PAMPER yourself!!

 

[ashdawn8287]

Oh any way you can go get a mani or pedi or set a date later out to go get your nails done? Schedule an appointment or maybe a massage too! That way you have something to look forward too!

 

[DMerish]

Ashdawn - Thank you for being my "mommy" :cool:
I needed the validation and someone to tell me specifically things to do for myself, now.

I appreciate all the feedback folks posted . . . and I'm considering the different suggestions to implement. I won't write her, or email her now, but perhaps "laying things out" for her to consider is in order, and timely now since she's an adult. I'm not sure. The anniversary of her trauma is just a couple of weeks away - I don't want to layer any extra heavy stuff on her, so idk. The diplomatic inquiry that Leah suggested, is also something to think about. I'm still too emotional to make a rational decision :confused:

What I do know is that I overextended myself with the preparations for the birthday party. Couple that stress with a general sense of being nervous about around my daughter and being with in a large crowd of people (it doesn't matter two bits that I've know most of them more than half of my life and really like them), something was bound to crack through in me . . . Tonight I'm going to bed early and watch the move Bell suggested in a different thread: "What About Bob" ;) and try to get some good sleep.

(((hugs everybody)))

 

[Abstract]

I Drew, I have not read this all but wanted to say that I was shocked and sad to read your first post and to realise that this relationship is far more complicated than it first seemed.

Being assaulted by ones adult child when you have PTSD must be confusing and damaging on so many levels. I think it is a great credit to you that you came here so wanting to help her and ease her suffering.

It was refreshing and inspiring to see a parent on here wanting to support their child with PTSD. It saddens me how few parents we seem to get on here. The bulk of supporters seem to be women in relationships with combat vets and a lot in co-dependent and abusive relationships.

Where are all the parents and siblings of someone with PTSD? I think it says a lot about the families that a lot of us come from.

Despite this assault you are here and trying to help your daughter and it was very obvious that that was your real aim. Many times when supporters come here it often seems to be mostly about their own crisis. Nothing wrong with that at all but nevertheless it is a credit to you. All of this is something you should be proud of.

I think it may be a little unrealistic that you can help a lot when this relationship has been so fraught and for multiple reasons. One is that it seems there hasn't been a conversation or mutual resolution and was rather just you attempting to be there for her. Your daughter is still the same person she was but just with PTSD on top of it all. Anther thing is that you have PTSD and were assaulted. Logic and emotions are two different things and PTSD has a mind of its own. You also it seems have not told her you have PTSD or where it came from. That isn't going to help her understand where you are coming from. Lastly it seems she has a strong relationship with and identifies with your abuser and the person responsible for you PTSD. That makes it complicated.

I think it might be worthwhile being realistic about the position you are in and reigning it right back and taking small steps. You can't fix her anyway and you can't even help her if she doesn't want to helped or is caught up in her own stuff about you and her.

It was interesting speaking to my sister as to her my father was all she saw as she grew up. She hated him but I could see as she spoke that she identified with him as well. Her behaviour has always been similar to his. She said she can barely remember my mother.

How did you manage to keep the abuse from them and do your sons not know too? Have you considered disclosing both the PTSD and the source to your adult children. I believe it is tricky territory when children are young but think disclosure when done for the right reasons at the right time can be helpful if unwelcome. She has to develop an idea of what a healthy relationship is and isn't. Knowing all the facts can be part of that. You don't owe it to anyone to disclose but it is something to consider.