How do you open yourself to the possibility someone you love did something evil to you?

[Charbella]

I’ve had too many abusers and recently EMDR gave me a fragment of a hand doing things that shouldn’t happen to a little girl. I do have more than a few CSA memories that do not involve this person. Which only makes this fragment more confusing because why would I remember them but not this one? I have three fragments, however due to physical development they would mean at least a 4 year time span. I get plenty of people repress the abuse and remember it later but during this same age span I have many memories with other people so why not this?

How do I wrap my head around the possibility? Right now I only feel terrible guilt for even considering the fragments. I must be a horrible person to think it of someone I love. So I guess how do I separate from that long enough to think of the possibility enough to actually form some sort of opinion?

 

[Rose White]

Fragmentary recovered memories are tricky. I had to deal with them too. For me, they were linked to symptoms that I experienced in present day. And my way of dealing with fragmentary recovered memories was to try accepting and see how it affected the symptoms I was experiencing. If there was a shift in my symptoms (not necessarily better, but just a shift in general) then I took that as a sign that there was meaning in the recovered fragment. Because I took the perspective that my self-harming and self-sabotaging and somatic symptoms were all attempts to bring my attention to the events.

Saying it out loud with T was for me a big part, and gauging her reaction because I trusted her. And my memory fragments I didn’t trust. Some fragments she helped me reframe as non-issue, some as important. And explore various perspectives for why something might be arising.

Ultimately accepting something like what you wrote about is the same like accepting anything else, facing it. But acceptance, I found, is not unidirectional, it seems to rise and fall and move forward and regress. I think you see that in people’s diaries with their relationships to their family members who abused them or their relationships to the acceptance of the meaning of the events.

 

[Friday]

I assume everyone I meet has done something terrible.

 

[arfie]

in a gentle reframing of @Friday 's assumption that everyone we meet has done something terrible, i assume that everyone i meet is human and prone to human folly. this includes people i know well enough to love.

there is considerable room for confusion in my own recall of fragmented memories. in my own case, my repressed memories were scattered coast to all three north american coasts. neither confirmation nor denial of any of my memories is available, but i strongly suspect my traumatic memories have mixed freely with the memories of the people who tried to help. within this frame, an er gynecology exam can present as a continuation of the trauma. repress those memories with an iron will and the resulting mixes are as unpredictable as acid rain.

but that is me and every case is unique.
steadying support while you sort your own case. easy does it. be gentle with yourself and patient with the process.

 

[Movingforward10]

Fragmented memories are so painful and confusing to sort through. And the self doubt and trying to find different reasons as to why these fragments exist, is a painful rabbit hole.

It's really understandable that your mind wanted/wants to protect you from these memories, particularly given how much you love the person. They clearly have a side to them that is very lovable. However, these memories are also saying they have another trauma inducing side to them.

So I guess how do I separate from that long enough to think of the possibility enough to actually form some sort of opinion?

It's perhaps a process in terms of accepting memories, trusting them, trusting yourself, trusting your gut feelings and that deep and sometimes hidden 'knowing', and then reassessing your relationship with that person?

I get plenty of people repress the abuse and remember it later but during this same age span I have many memories with other people so why not this?

Because those other memories maybe were linked to other things, that may be trauma may be not trauma. Maybe because you love this person and facing what happened was too painful for you back then, so repressing and surviving were key to it. Maybe, as you had a number of abusers, your mind couldn't cope with this particular one, so it was repressed. There could be lots of reasons.

 

[Charbella]

If there was a shift in my symptoms (not necessarily better, but just a shift in general) then I took that as a sign that there was meaning in the recovered fragment.

I might try this but I’m not sure how affective it will be given I can’t tell you how I’m feeling at the moment. Too many things going through my head. Plus it’s hard to know what is causing what.

I assume everyone I meet has done something terrible.

Okay I’ll give you that but in this case I’m talking evil. How can a person who I think loves me also be a person who sexually abused me? I don’t understand how to two can coexist. I don’t think I’m clear enough in my question though.

patient with the process.

I hate patience, I’m just not good at it. Part of me knows pushing on this particular issue could be the thing that implodes my world and part of me wants to throw caution to the wind and just push until my brain gives up it’s secrets. The curse of the ADHD brain.

 

[Friday]

Okay I’ll give you that but in this case I’m talking evil. How can a person who I think loves me also be a person who sexually abused me? I don’t understand how to two can coexist. I don’t think I’m clear enough in my question though

Very well, then…

…Devil’s Advocate.

How do you tell a child has been sexually abused?

With my niece? I was wiping her after the toilet (kids under six your hands are in their privates 20 times a day, and that’s if they don’t have an infection you’re cleaning and medicating twice an hour. 2 of my kids -kids in my care- were prone to yeast infections -both boys- until we found the cause; one because he was allergic to the diaper wipes, another because he needed “real” soap, instead of hypoallergenic infant wash). Back to my niece. 3 second wipe revealed an odd swelling.

Hey sweetie! Pop up over here on the bed a moment (because you can’t see anything pointing INTO a toilet (although girls don’t naturally point “down”, and have to be taught not to pee… everywhere… which is a startling thing for most parents, especially moms), or toward the floor.

Quick visual on the bed, & does XYZ hurt? Meant we headed to the doctor. Sexual abuse? Didn’t enter my head. Nor the doctors. We assumed it eas a childhood injury that happened as they do. Everywhere. And then got infected. 6weeks of rubbing in cream at least once every 4 hours (and after every bathroom trip) to kill the infection, and minimize scarring. It was YEARS before we learned of the sexual abuse of both my niece and nephew. Like, nearly 10 years. Most of the time when I had care of them? They were totally fine, as far as I knew. “Just” flakey parents who would drop them off for the weekend and come back 6mo later. Disappear for 3-4 years, move back, drop them off for another weekend that lasted 2 weeks or 2 years. I NEVER knew how long my niece and nephew would be with us. A day, a year, and hour.

So, perhaps? This person was dealing with you NOT spreadlegging a bicycle. (As most kids do, at least 2-3 times. And at least once rating a trip to the doctor, and cream & pills). But? Didn’t know it.

Or? Maybe they’re a child raping asshole, who deserves to die screaming.

Kids? Will love BOTH. The amazing parent/aunt-uncle/guardian AND the abusive motherf*cker. Childf*cker. Because that’s what kids do. They love the adults in their lives. The downside of unconditional love? Is that you can rape/torture/kill the kids in your care, and they’ll still love you for it. Despite of it. Because they blame themselves, instead of you.

Only you would know, which is which.

A memory of hands in your privates? Is totally normal for anyone who has EARLY childhood memories, instead of from 5 up. Kids pee? 20+ times a day. Also? Totally normal for anyone who has ever had an infection, that loving/normal parents treat instead of ignore. And? For people who have been raped/assaulted. Hands, in and of themselves, don’t say much. Even if they’re inside you, treating an infection. (Hymens mean little girls / parents of little girls cannot use applicators to apply yeast infection cream.)

 

[Rose White]

I think @Friday makes a good point. I had a memory where my dad had his fingers in my vagina and I was crying but he wasn’t abusing me. He was putting cream on my vagina. The reason my vagina was infected we’ll leave that aside, because I don’t know why I had so many vaginal infections around age 1-2 that my mom took me to a doctor who put a scope inside and peered in, but the point is that for that particular memory, him putting cream on my vagina while I cried was not abusive. Now I’m realizing that’s not a good example probably because my dad was sexually abusing me. But not all hands in vaginas are abusing all the time is maybe what I’m trying to corroborate. My brain isn’t working it seems but I see Friday’s point I think.

 

[Charbella]

@Friday that’s terrible for your poor niece!

The hand to the privates I guess maybe possibly could be something like that. It feels sinister in nature but I guess I don’t know. I am however not that young in the image. Im 8-9, which I realize could be a medication thing though I’d think my mom would be in charge of that, it’s not her hand.

When I’m older there’s and image of groping my breast and since the hand doesn’t belong to a doctor I can’t think of a reason it would be done.

For me I feel like the images are either abuse or conjured. A product of a mind that has two many terrible memories and something is pairing things that don’t pair. Which is that much harder to just know. My other memories of abuse are very concrete.

 

[Rose White]

@Charbella wondering if the memory being tied to the fact that you love them and might have to face it is somehow related to reminding you something like you loved J but had to face it and now you hate him? Because you have so much trouble accepting your little and things that she “let” J do. But maybe she loved him? And this thought could potentially help you understand her perspective?

 

[Charbella]

@Charbella wondering if the memory being tied to the fact that you love them and might have to face it is somehow related to reminding you something like you loved J but had to face it and now you hate him? Because you have so much trouble accepting your little and things that she “let” J do. But maybe she loved him? And this thought could potentially help you understand her perspective?

There is some of that. I actually don’t think I hate J. Sometimes I find myself hating what he did but often I just have confusion when I try to think of how do I feel, or I have her emotion of fear, but I do think of it as hers. Mini me definitely has fear surrounding the experience. I find myself compare the reaction I’m having to mine about J which then produces guilt for putting them in the same box.

 

[Rose White]

How would you feel toward mini-me if she had affection for J?