Is This PTSD? And a Few Questions

[anthony]

Your welcome loqu.

You raise an interesting point about ASD and why its doesn't encompass delayed onset... I agree with you, it should. The problem with the DSM, ICD and other manuals, is that they are only written ever decade or more.

• DSM I - 1952
• DSM II - 1968
• DSM III - 1980
• DSM III R - 1987
• DSM IV - 1994
• DSM IV TR - 2000
• DSM V - Expected 2012.

The really big problem though with the next DSM version, is just how viable it is even going to be and whether as a result of the below stupidity, whether the world will move back towards the ICD as the mental health bible as it doesn't suffer problems like below:

Robert Spitzer, the head of the DSM-III task force, has publicly criticized the American Psychiatric Association for mandating that DSM-V task force members sign a non-disclosure agreement, effectively conducting the whole process in secret: "When I first heard about this agreement, I just went bonkers. Transparency is necessary if the document is to have credibility, and, in time, you’re going to have people complaining all over the place that they didn’t have the opportunity to challenge anything."

That is one aspect, then another:

Although the American Psychiatric Association has since instituted a disclosure policy for DSM-V task force members, many still believe the Association has not gone far enough in its efforts to be transparent and to protect against industry influence. In a recent Point/Counterpoint article, Lisa Cosgrove, PhD and Harold J. Bursztajn, MD noted that "the fact that 70% of the task force members have reported direct industry ties---an increase of almost 14% over the percentage of DSM-IV task force members who had industry ties---shows that disclosure policies alone, especially those that rely on an honor system, are not enough and that more specific safeguards are needed." David Kupfer, MD, chair of the DSM-V task force, and Darrel A. Regier, MD, MPH, Vice Chair of the task force, countered that "collaborative relationships among government, academia, and industry are vital to the current and future development of pharmacological treatments for mental disorders." They asserted that the development of DSM-V is the "most inclusive and transparent developmental process in the 60-year history of DSM."

Which then really just nowadays laugh so damn hard its not even funny, because the below site redirects to an error page upon the APA's website. Yer... complete disclosure and openness about what's going into the manual. Not!

The developments to this new version can be viewed on www.dsm5.org. In June 2009 Allen Frances, head of the DSM-IV task force, issued strongly (reckless, potentially disastrous, ludicrous, absurdly premature) worded criticisms of the processes leading to DSM-V and the risk of "serious, subtle, (…) ubiquitous" and "dangerous" unintended consequences such as new "false 'epidemics'". He writes that "the work on DSM-V has displayed the most unhappy combination of soaring ambition and weak methodology" and is concerned about the task force's "inexplicably closed and secretive process."

Hey, I'm just a sufferer and I'm pretty worried myself.

The appointment, in May 2008, of two of the taskforce members, Kenneth Zucker and Ray Blanchard, has led to an internet petition to remove them. According to MSNBC, "The petition accuses Zucker of having engaged in 'junk science' and promoting 'hurtful theories' during his career." According to The Gay City News, "Dr. Ray Blanchard, a psychiatry professor at the University of Toronto, is deemed offensive for his theories that some types of transsexuality are paraphilias, or sexual urges. In this model, transsexuality is not an essential aspect of the individual, but a misdirected sexual impulse." Blanchard responded, "Naturally, it's very disappointing to me there seems to be so much misinformation about me on the Internet. [They didn't distort] my views, they completely reversed my views." Zucker "rejects the junk-science charge, saying there 'has to be an empirical basis to modify anything' in the DSM. As for hurting people, 'in my own career, my primary motivation in working with children, adolescents and families is to help them with the distress and suffering they are experiencing, whatever the reasons they are having these struggles. I want to help people feel better about themselves, not hurt them.'"

Hmmmm... and this is why we are now hearing things like, "its cool to have PTSD" come across the media and from adolescents, because these exact nut job physicians who are recklessly handing out diagnosis in order to compensate themselves via prescription kickbacks, are doing a lot of damage to the world and the physician industry. Many of the best physicians across the globe agree with this and voice their own opinions across the web and media.

 

[loqu]

I might be obtuse, but there's two more things I'd like to clear up before seeing my new therapist for the second time. Is ASD by definition a one-time event? In other words, as far as the traumatic incident that caused the condition, the consequences are only experienced once and without future triggers. Second, I understand that repeated instances of ASD may lead to PTSD, but can intervening counselling/therapy lessen the probability of prior trauma being accessorial to future trauma in this regard? In other words, a reduced or negated "piling up"-effect.

 

[anthony]

ASD is not a one time event in the sense of suffering it, but being triggered is something different. You either fit the diagnosis at the time or not, but that doesn't mean you cannot still have a symptom or two of it ongoing. That doesn't mean you have it though, you just then have "x" issues to deal with and solve. Many suffer triggers or flashbacks from traumatic events within their lives, none of which have ASD or PTSD, because overall you do not fit the criteria. This is where sometimes PTSD is seen to be curable, in that people get diagnosed with it, recouperate, then years later fall over even worse. So people think it came, went away, then something worse happened and now its much much worse. If PTSD is present, being the physiological change within the brain, then it is always there... its only the level and degree of severity that changes the illness. This is why now a good majority of people are misdiagnosed with PTSD, instead should be ASD, and even the other way around. Psychology is a best guess at the best of times unless medical tests are done to conclusively prove a medical aspect. Usually it comes down to knowledge and experience.

Yes, actually taking action after trauma and dealing with it completely, absolutely can and does reduce the risk of developing PTSD later in life.

Even having PTSD, the constant stress upon a persons body is likely to shorten their life significantly if left unchecked, uncontrolled. If you deal with and work through your trauma so that you no longer have this constant stress upon your body, then you now just removed an issue within your future and are much more likely to live a normal and full life with PTSD.

For example, some friends of mine all with PTSD from combat, a couple fail to accept they can help themselves, instead they take bulk medication, drink and smoke as their way of keeping themself under control as much as possible, which still fails as they are quite destructive people now. 40 years of age and some have had to have heart surgery, multiple bypasses, heart attacks, etc... all the one's that fail to accept they can reduce their overall stress tolerance by talking and resolving trauma. All others who have taken this road, live more healthy lifestyles, are involved in society, some even work... have relationships, respect, etc. Some just continue to re-traumatise themselves via their own bad behaviour.

You can always change your future if you want too... even with trauma. It is like being diabetic due to being over-weight. If you live a more healthy lifestyle now and keep control of your weight as you age, then you have a much higher chance to never develop something like diabetes. Treat things now and live for the future... Ignore things now and your past typically catches up with you in the future.

 

[anthony]

Loqu... honestly as I stated earlier in this thread, you have done an amazing job of helping yourself now before its too late. I am not sure whether this is a result of the education we all see nowadays splash in front of us about issues, or just your attitude, but you seem to be a person who is looking out for your future because your not ignoring any issues that raise within your life now.

Really... well done to you. If I had your attitude years ago, I would have likely hoped that maybe I could have avoided this myself. I didn't talk, I ignored... it caught up with me.

 

[loqu]

ASD is not a one time event in the sense of suffering it, but being triggered is something different. You either fit the diagnosis at the time or not, but that doesn't mean you cannot still have a symptom or two of it ongoing. That doesn't mean you have it though, you just then have "x" issues to deal with and solve. Many suffer triggers or flashbacks from traumatic events within their lives, none of which have ASD or PTSD, because overall you do not fit the criteria.

I'm sorry, I don't think I quite follow here. If you are diagnosed with ASD, then you can deal with the symptoms to the point where you no longer reach the criteria for this condition. Yet, the symptoms can be debilitating on their own and should be dealt with professionally. This seems to be my case, as I don't believe I've ever reached all criteria necessary for ASD. Then again, the traumatic event thoroughly fits the description of what would be causative of ASD.

Reading twice I guess what you're saying is that trauma will return in some form like other memories do and it won't ever completely go away. That is certainly something I have to deal with. I suppose I'm getting myself winded up about this, and it surely won't be as bad as I envision in my darker moments. But I'm trying to understand. I do hope I can go back to the way it was in the intermission between the event and the breakout of symptoms where I basically remembered what had happened but without thinking twice about it.

Thank you for your encouraging words. After all is said and done I'm determined to run my therapeutic efforts to the hilt. One must never blind oneself to the reality of things.

 

[anthony]

Another way to think about it is like this... a person has suffered trauma in their life, but the only symptom they have is depression. So does that mean the person has ASD? No, it means the person has depression, which is an illness by itself, but can be a symptom of another label if in conjunction with that symptom, a person met all other criteria by symptom and cause to be diagnosed.

A person can suffer both anxiety and depression illnesses without trauma... or you could suffer both and off had prior trauma. Again, no other symptoms are present though. A person can suffer just anxiety, and as a result have further symptoms that relate with anxiety, ie. panic attacks, agoraphobia, etc. All this can be done with or without trauma.

Trauma is an occurrence in life, however; because you have endured trauma and have symptoms or an illness... none of this means its due to your trauma, it could simply be an existing condition that has now manifested, the trauma could merely be a pre-cursor to create a condition that was already present, though dormant, etc etc. People tend to presume, even mental health professionals, that if trauma has been within your life and you have anxiety or depression, that it must be something greater such as ASD, PTSD, etc.

The point to all this is... as long as you recognise an issue exists and that you do not ignore that mental health issue, instead seek immediate treatment and counselling to help yourself work through it, then all this in the majority of cases will remove further development of an issue arising within your future when traumatised... and everyone will be traumatised in their life to one degree or another, its just a matter of whether it suits the realm of abnormal trauma or normal life trauma.

 

[loqu]

I just feel the need to write something right now. I woke up tonight with a creeping, panicky feeling, questioning whether I will ever be completely free of this. This sentiment is making me cold from fear. I've told both my therapists, in the end all I really care about for myself is that I have suffered no permanent damage and that I will eventually be completely fine. It seemed to me neither of them wanted to elaborate further on this or give blanket answers. With the one I'm seeing now, I told him the last time all I'd learned about PTSD/ASD, what is curable and what is not. He questioned why I was so focussed on the issue of permanence (isn't that obvious?). I explained this, I still have confidence in him though.

I tell you, the whole situation leading up to this misery was so banal, so unnecessary and trite. To think that something like that would affect me for I don't know how long, it just rattles my psyche continually.

I don't really have a question, I just felt the desire to vent this emotion in a place where people understand. I looked at the forum rules, hope this is not in violation of anything. It didn't seem so but I know you're strict around here.

Edit: I'm sorry, I actually do have a pertinent question: my therapist made the assertion that once the signal has been sent to the brain (saying your life is in danger) and, I suppose, the concomitant encumbrance of the nervous system takes place, there really is not much difference what the external situation might me. In other words, even if as in my case there was no real chance of death the fact that the signal was sent would make it comparable to any other death-threatening situation. I question this because I recon that at least the time span during which you're under duress would have an affect (my traumatic event lasted about one minute, then maybe you should count in the time of the aftershock which is hard to determine). Also, I would think that the worse the original event, the stronger the symptoms once manifested. Again, I've had limited symptoms.

I'm trying to find reasons why I should be free from this, if not soon then at least some time in the future.

 

[anthony]

my therapist made the assertion that once the signal has been sent to the brain (saying your life is in danger) and, I suppose, the concomitant encumbrance of the nervous system takes place, there really is not much difference what the external situation might me. In other words, even if as in my case there was no real chance of death the fact that the signal was sent would make it comparable to any other death-threatening situation.

This is absolutely correct. Regardless the event, if the brain believes death was a likely option, then that is no different from whether it was or wasn't... the brain believes its real. Basically, whether you think you could die from being within a traumatic event, to actually near death or even death and been resuscitated, the brain registers them all identically... Death.

Each person then ascertains this differently to themselves.

 

[loqu]

This is absolutely correct. Regardless the event, if the brain believes death was a likely option, then that is no different from whether it was or wasn't... the brain believes its real. Basically, whether you think you could die from being within a traumatic event, to actually near death or even death and been resuscitated, the brain registers them all identically... Death.

Each person then ascertains this differently to themselves.

I see. To think that this whole thing would've been avoided if that guy had just punched my lights out immediately, or pushed me or whatever... anything had he just not used that word, "kill". Add to it, he wasn't even brutal when he grabbed me by the face, it was all a showing of dominance. If he only knew what he has done to me.

 

[loqu]

This is absolutely correct. Regardless the event, if the brain believes death was a likely option, then that is no different from whether it was or wasn't... the brain believes its real. Basically, whether you think you could die from being within a traumatic event, to actually near death or even death and been resuscitated, the brain registers them all identically... Death.

Each person then ascertains this differently to themselves.

One thing though, even if this is true, surely there must be different levels of how strong the signal is? Otherwise, how could there be differences in symptoms? Some people obviously have very strong reactions, strong avoidance issues, unable to function socially etcetera all from a one time event. Same thing if the signal is prolonged. I'm just extrapolating but that would seem reasonable.

 

[anthony]

Yes... each person interprets uniquely, hence why some get PTSD, some don't, some get it easier than others, some are more sensitive than others... all factors.

 

[loqu]

Another update. I had quite a major event happen this Monday. When I wrote the last posts I actually thought I was going to have a panic attack. I think it partly came down to being out and talking to an acquaintance who asserted that he too would've been angered by behavior such as mine, or rather the way I described the incident to him. This sparked new feelings of self-blame that have been pervasive throughout this ordeal. Bottom line is I know they're irrational. I'm just waiting for my emotions to get up to speed on this, to reach a definite conclusion that will evaporate all remaining doubts bouncing around in my head.

Anyway, what happened? Well, as I've written before I'm doing EMDR now. I decided to try this technique at home, by myself. I was amazed by the results, ecstatic almost. There was an instant, noticable and lasting reduction in pain from just five minutes of work. Astonishing, really. The fact that it would work is in opposition to all my ideas on change - the natural law of things in general seem to be that evolution is always slow, viscous, swaying back-and-forth in a spiral fashion.

Nevertheless my intrusive thoughts are still constant, and I keep having moments of intense distress. Even though there's been a major pain reduction the intense nuisance of the unrepenting intrusion is a suffering on its own. It's like having a hornet's nest occupying your mind. Buzzing, on the defensive, not quite stingy.

At least there has been change. Tomorrow I'm seeing my new therapist for the third time. I'm going to ask him to make it clear that this will all be over soon. I need to hear that. Thank you for listening.