Why Do Therapists Minimize?

[ghotiff]

I was also thinking about developing a scale, like doctors use to ask how bad your pain is, so we'd have a shorthand to talk about it in the future. But first, I have to define what is on that scale. That's the hard part.

A scale does exist, my first T used one. It didn't work for me so I don't remember the details but maybe a web search would find it.

 

[ghotiff]

My first T was horrible at minimizing. When I told her about disassociating and that it was scary because the worst one was that a guy I knew walked toward me and something a it that triggered me and I "came to" with him lying on too of me. My Ts response was to tell me that because I only disassociate for minutes, it's mild and that others can lose a whole day, go shopping and buy a bunch of stuff that they don't remember. Sorry....given my childhood sexual abuse, I'd far rather "shop" than have a sexual act from someone other than my husband while dissociating.

I left her and when T shopping I made it clear that validation was one if my core needs.

 

[Seasounds]

@sun seeker, others, @Chava

I think it takes an especially skilled therapist to walk the middle path here - validate that things really are that bad, but also truly believe and be able to express that they might not always be that way or that there are different perspectives to consider...and to not get sucked down the rabbit hole. It doesn't do any good for both of you to be stuck in the mire.

Well saiid; and it can be a learning curve for many PTSD folks, (myself included, as @sunseeker is,too) to sort out. personal healing, developing emotional intelligence and confidence-to trust ourselves, and, on the other hand seeking knowledge about the psychological profession and the different way T's practice. Thanks for your words.

@ghotiff, a scale sounds like a great idea, as it could be compared to other visits. Along these lines, I would find it helpful for therapists to give patients a scale, measuring T: asking things like "Did you feel your therapist understood you ?" "Was empathetic?" "Was helpful?" Both of these questionnaires make thoughts and feelings concrete; harder to ignore, and good ideas for discussion in sessions, and good information for both parties to discover if the T and client are a good match.

 

[sun seeker]

A scale does exist, my first T used one.

Thanks. A brief google search showed that there are several versions, but I think it would be best to make my own because the same words can mean different things to different people and the important thing is to communicate what is happening for me.

Especially like in cases like mine where my tormentors told me that no one would believe me. It's of even more importance and value to be told that someone believes you.

Yes. I couldn't agree more. I wasn't told that no one would believe me - that I can remember anyway - but have a lifetime of trying to draw attention to how much I was hurting and being blatantly ignored, even in life-or-death situations. Having a therapist react this way is retraumatizing, for slightly different reasons from what you are describing, but the results are similar.

• They were diverting me from (so called) childhood memories that couldn't be proven, so that they wouldn't be liable in court for supporting false memories.

• They thought their job was to help me think 'reframe' of my life in more positive terms.

• They were taught to not let the client be the primary directive influence, in a session.

• They were taught that PTSD increases if clients re-tell their experiences.

Thanks @change. I'm impressed at the concise information you've put together. I would have been too confused or dissociated to ask a therapist to explain this in so much detail, so I appreciate that you were able to. The first item - ouch. I hadn't thought about liability. I thought they were just willfully ignorant (which could also be the case). With my last therapist, when I told her about the worst memory I had she first didn't say much at all and the next time I brought it up, assumed it was symbolic rather than real. I stopped telling her what I remembered. With the new therapist, I haven't tried yet. What I am mostly wanting is for her to hear the degree of emotional pain I experience on an ongoing basis, more than to believe in any specific event, though of course I want that too.

The second item I can see myself talking to her about, i.e. asking if that is what she is trying to do and explaining that it isn't what I need. What I really desperately need is to be heard. Having that, I can do my own reframing.

About the third item, I think there are different schools of thought on this. I've personally come across therapists who are happy to let me direct the session, sometimes more than I want to.

I'll have to think about the fourth one. Isn't there another theory on this that it decreases?

there is a skill, in being a client, who learns how to tell their story, feel the feelings, and let themselves transform into new, healthier patterns.
I think the only way this process can begin to happen, is if a person is heard.

Yes. I am getting more and more clear on the truth of this. Maybe this painful awakening was necessary to learn to advocate for myself. After all, a therapist is only human and can't make changes they don't realize are necessary. I've spent most of last night in tears over this but now feel like I know which way I need to go with it. Thanks everybody.

 

[sun seeker]

My first T was horrible at minimizing. When I told her about disassociating and that it was scary because the worst one was that a guy I knew walked toward me and something a it that triggered me and I "came to" with him lying on too of me.

I know someone who was told by a therapist that she wasn't really dissociating; someone else with severe DID who was told her personalities were just "different moods", and a therapist once tried to tell me that my lifelong struggle with depression wasn't really depression but that maybe I was "bored" or "lonely". I didn't know enough at the time to argue. Now I do.

 

[katiekat]

@sun seeker That last bit about depression being boredom or loneliness really hits home for me. My whole life I have struggled with boredom and loneliness and depression. I know this is not a realistic option for most people, butI can hhonestly say those symptoms have significantly decreased when I had my son (3 years ago). There's no more time to NOT have something to do or Playdate to go to or family and friends wanting to visit with my son. I still feel depressed at times but it's definitely more bearable.

 

[anthony]

One thing I want in a therapist is for them to really hear just how bad it is, to be strong enough to sit with that.

Actually, it depends on whether you're talking about physical pain, or mental pain. Mental pain is a cognitive distortion, and a therapists role is to get you to see that you're magnifying the issue beyond possibly rational proportions, and thus they minimise it to try and bring you back to a reality of the situation.

Don't get me wrong... the comment about pain and response depression... weird, no doubt about it.

CBT is the foundation principle to counter a majority of PTSD irrational logic.

 

[sun seeker]

Anthony, do you differentiate between mental and emotional pain in this assessment? Just curious. When you say people magnify the issue beyond rational proportions, do you mean in terms of what people believe about their situation or what they feel? Since you are advocating CBT, I am guessing you are coming from a perspective more related to beliefs, and in that sense I agree that our thoughts can be illogical. "Everybody hates me" for example is (usually!) an irrational belief that deserves re-examining. "I spend several hours a day in emotional pain so great that I am desperate to make it stop" is a subjective statement about feeling and needs to be heard, not argued with. That's my experience anyway, since when people try to minimize my feelings it has the opposite effect, to extreme proportions.

 

[sun seeker]

My whole life I have struggled with boredom and loneliness and depression. I know this is not a realistic option for most people, butI can hhonestly say those symptoms have significantly decreased when I had my son (3 years ago).

That's great @katiekat. My experience was quite different, perhaps because my depression really was depression and not loneliness or boredom. It was incapacitating at times even when I did have the responsibility of a child. It's a problem of the same words meaning different things to different people again. I know a woman with seasonal depression. To her, this means having low energy, increased cravings for sweets, and foggy thinking. She assumes this is what I mean when I talk about having depression, when for me, depression is more about being in such severe emotional pain that I am writhing in agony and just trying to survive from minute to minute, and interacting with people becomes almost impossible.

I'm not trying to minimize what you were experiencing before you had your son. For whatever reason, you have been able to feel some relief whereas I wasn't able to, and it's probably beside the point to wonder why. I was just trying to make the point that the therapist trying to reframe my experience was, in this case, unhelpful.

 

[Rumors]

Beyond saying, "yeah that sucked" I really don't want anyone validating how crappy it must have felt. I would much rather spend my time figuring out how to move past it and feel better...I know it sucked and left me spending thousands of dollars trying to figure out how to turn sh*t into sugar.
I don't think your therapist didn't hear you, he/she just didn't spend as much time in the gutter rolling around getting wet and muddy with you. You don't pay them to wallow around, you pay them to pull your ass out of the gutter and get dry and cleaned up. Don't get lost about the purpose of why you are in therapy. You were heard, don't minimize that just because you didn't get the desired response you were looking for. Use their response as a means to begin crawling out of the misery.
I certainly don't mean to minimize your experience or what happened to you because I am sure it sucked. However, I want you to feel better more than I want you to live in the suckyness of what happened.
I hope that didn't come across as sucky... Best wishes. I hope it all works out.

 

[sun seeker]

I think it takes an especially skilled therapist to walk the middle path here - validate that things really are that bad, but also truly believe and be able to express that they might not always be that way or that there are different perspectives to consider...and to not get sucked down the rabbit hole. It doesn't do any good for both of you to be stuck in the mire.

I think there is a place here to differentiate between agreeing that the situation is hopeless and really hearing that it feels that way. It's helpful for someone outside the situation to hold onto the belief that it can get better, while still validating your feelings, know what I mean?

I don't think your therapist didn't hear you, he/she just didn't spend as much time in the gutter rolling around getting wet and muddy with you. You don't pay them to wallow around, you pay them to pull your ass out of the gutter and get dry and cleaned up. Don't get lost about the purpose of why you are in therapy. You were heard, don't minimize that just because you didn't get the desired response you were looking for. Use their response as a means to begin crawling out of the misery.

I think there is something I haven't managed to convey. I'm not talking about minimizing experiences. I'm talking about needing someone to hear the feelings, and that is an extremely strong need for me which I am ready to advocate for.

This thread has been helpful to me to sort out what I need and where to go from here, and I'm really grateful for that.

 

[Jane.l]

When you described your situation to your T do you think you may without realising it have down played the feelings? Sometimes I have felt my T hasn't really 'got ' something and we've talked it through and often I have not been as clear and obvious as I thought I had been. It's very hard not to sound like you are being over dramatic when you are talking about suicidal ideation, and because you are feeling the pain and the emotion sometimes it feels like your words are accurately mirroring the feelings but actually you are giving a much more palatable version. It's very hard to talk about emotions in a balanced way - I either feel like a crazed Shakespeare lead or I talk in such riddles trying to be subtle that the point gets missed.

Good idea to talk about this with your T - also might be worth thinking about what you want/need to hear that you are not getting . I would guess that your T isn't deliberately trying to minimise your feelings, Either there has been a communication misunderstanding or perhaps even that your T is misreading you and is thinking you might find their reaction soothing - just thoughts but you will feel better when you have talked it through.