What Type Of Therapy Focuses On Building?

[Klo]

So there are various sorts of therapy techniques out there... CBT, DBT, EMDR, etc etc etc.

Most therapy techniques seem to be about getting rid of unwanted things.

Like anxiety, dysfunctional thoughts, repressed trauma, etc.

Is there any type of therapy that is about building? Or rebuilding. Sort of thing.

Basically I have no life at all. Almost no personality.

I have no friends, no partner, not very involved with any family, no job.

But I also have no hobbies, no interests. I have no sense of personal style.

I often feel like I don't really exist at all. I don't even hold onto objects, like how people have their possessions.

My one and only thing in life that really feels like "me" is my dog. I love my dog more than anything, and much of my waking time revolves around my dog. Feeding, treats, grooming, play, walking, cuddling, training, etc.

But that is all I have to talk about.

My therapist asked me what my hobbies were, and I said I didn't have any. Apparently that is so bizarre that she acted like she didn't believe me and started prodding me with more specific questions. It got to the point where when I said I sometimes play minesweeper to distract myself from intrusive thoughts, minesweeper was then considered a "hobby". Like she needed to feel satisfied that she had proved me wrong about not having any hobbies lol.

She asked me about friends and I said I didn't have any. Once again she acted like she didn't believe and like she was put off by that. But I really don't. I haven't had any desire to try to make friends in years. I prefer to be alone. And I also feel like I couldn't make friends, anyway, for multiple reasons.

When I've tried treatment in the past, it only seems to go as far as erasing, but not building.

I told a previous psychiatrist who gave me meds that made me numb, that I am empty and feel like I don't exist. That I felt depressed because without all the anger and anxiety and other things, I had nothing left. So she gave me an anti-depressant. Something else meant to get rid of things.

So is there a type of therapy that is designed around helping people rebuild? Like once all of the bad stuff is out of the way, how do you go about trying to fill in your life?

Because sometimes I feel like misery is better than a vast nothingness. It makes it hard for me to cooperate with treatment.

 

[Anarchy]

Laurence Heller and Aline LaPierre's "NARM" aims to build on existing abilities and connection. NARM is newish and not widely available.

The DBT skills is also intended to give you the tools to build or re build a more connected life from.

What sort of living accomodation are you in?

if you are in an urban area or can get to one, would something like an evening class give you a chance to at least get on saying "hello" terms with some people, as well as some learning.

 

[Friday]

All the ones you mentioned are, or at least can be...

...I'm thinking this may have something more to do with who your practitioner is, than the therapy itself. It's "just" a different outlook, really. Replacing negatives with positives can either be looked at as getting rid of unwanted things, or change to add wanted things.

 

[toughmomma]

Have you spoken to your T about "rebuilding"? My T will definitely address helping me cope with day to day struggles because PTSD affects so much. Your T could have been having a hard time accepting that you are so isolated because they genuinely like you. You sound like you don't think other people would like you, but by the sound of how much you love your dog you sound kind and loving. I enjoy being alone too, but do occasionally volunteer instead of working. It gives me a purpose when I need one and distracts me when I need it. It's also a form of socialization without the pressure of feeling like I'm looking to force a friendship. Maybe you could try volunteering will the ASPCA or fostering pets that needs homes? Hope you start feeling better soon :)

 

[Sandstone]

I've always understood (re)building to be part of the third stage of therapy, coming after stabilisation and processing/integration. Like you I am very isolated, but I can't imagine being able to socialise until a lot has been resolved. First I would need to learn to go out. It is so frustrating, because I used to be very social and loved to fill my home with friends. Ther have been a few attempts at doing social things, but it has fallen apart, and my sense is that I need to move on with therapy fiirst.

Hobbies are a little easier. I've always enjoyed making things, so I can do that sometimes and it is valuable as a calming and distracting activity. Do you have any ideas what you might like to do with your time? Could you build out from your dog? There are all sorts of training classes and doggy sports like flyball. Or could you use your canine skills to help a rescue organisation?

 

[Klo]

You guys/gals give good suggestions. I just have no desire to do anything. I don't have interests or desires or whatever. I don't have preferences. I eat whatever. I wear whatever is on my floor that doesn't smell bad. I feel indifferent to almost everyone I encounter during the occasional journey to the gas station for cigarettes. If anything I feel annoyed and put upon when trying to be out in the world and being someone. Like there's a guy who works at the gas station, who is always super chatty and friendly with me, and asks me questions. So it's like in order not to be a d-bag, I have to manifest myself, put on the personality for socializing in public, but then I can hardly remember what was even talked about, I was hardly even there. Last night my mother's husband was trying to get me to discuss/debate politics with him, and I could barely fake mirroring his crazy ass. He's so intense and competitive, I feel none of it. It's just like.. whatever you say, blah blah, you are right about everything, blah blah, I just wanted to get a glass of pop, now I have to try escape the kitchen without getting into a debate about Donald Trump.

I think it's hard because I was never really able to just exist. Even when I was a kid, I had to mirror my father on everything to try to avoid his borderline psychotic wrath. It was like if he saw me as a miniature version of himself, then he was hesitant to attack. So all of his views were my views. All of his interests were my interests. His sense of humor was my sense of humor. I didn't even understand what I was talking about half the time, but I knew how to more or less copy his language. Like he hated women in general, and he thought the LifeTime channel was part of a conspiracy by women to spread hatred of men. I never even watched this channel and don't know much about it, but he called it the "Man Haters Channel" so I called it the "Man Haters Channel" and he would seem pleased with me.

But this didn't stop when I became a legal adult and never had to be around him anymore. It didn't stop when I tried to make friends in high school. It never went away and never stopped. I've never existed and just know how to mirror people. In therapy this doesn't work out so well unless I have a bad therapists. Bad therapists bring their own personal crap into therapy, and it doesn't take me very long to figure them out and start mirroring them. My current therapist is probably a pretty good therapist because she has -zero- personal energy, I can't read her at all. So I just sit there like a stuffed animal not knowing what to say to her.

 

[Anarchy]

Hi Klo,
Yeah, I think I'd rather gnaw through my own arm, than spend time talking about Trump, Hitlery, or whatever the rest of the current crop of psychopathic narcissists are called...

I'm guessing that you are currently experiencing what gets called anhedonia- Simply put, it's seeing the world through shite coloured glasses, or at least grey ones.

It may be that you really do not have any likes or passions. I'm going to stick my neck out, and say that, you probably do have some, but that you just can't think of them at the present time.

Thoughts and memories are very context dependant. You know how hearing a song, or particularly smelling a smell ( smell, uniquely goes straight to our cortex, unfiltered. It's a very powerful tool for triggering memories) can trigger certain memories?

It's the same with mood. If we are in a low mood, it is easier to access dull or painful memories, and we have much less access to brighter, happier ones.

We also have much less feeling of self agency. The thought of doing something becomes hard work, life becomes like walking through mud.

I can't remember what meds you might be on (you are in America, so I'm guessing lots and lots). Many of the psychiatric meds block the dopamine system, dopamine is the brain's pleasure and reward chemical.
SSRIs can also cause a numbing depression and a feeling of couldn't give a bugger about anything.
Meds can be sods to come off, so do not go cold turkey! But if you are on drugs, please discuss your feelings with your prescriber, with the emphasis on reducing the drugs.

( a common thing seems to be for the drugs to cause depression or suicidality, and the prescriber to keep upping the dose to try to cure what the drugs are causing. A friend who came off SSRIs after years on them, found that the suicidal crap went, as did th constant low grade depression).

Have you tried " the mindful way through depression "? You should be able to get the full audio book on YouTube. Get a YouTube downloader plug in for your browser and download it, so that you can listen off line. Listen to about 15 or 20 minutes a day.

The guys who produced the book are some of the top researchers in the world into depression, and the stuff is useful for far more than depression.

Going to a fresh post.

 

[Anarchy]

Like I said, I'm guessing that you really do have the inner resources to build upon and develop, even if you don't recognise them yet.

I'm going to tag you on a post which links to an academic paper about finding those resources and potentials.

You'll probably need to sign up to academia.edu to download the paper, it's free and isn't intrusive like face spook or tw@er.

Once you have downloaded the paper, like the post and I'll take the tag off.

I needed to read the paper several times to get to understand it, so don't feel dumb if you struggle with the first reading - I think you'll find it worth the effort.

Judith Herman's " trauma and recovery " although over 20 years old, still gives a good description of the stages of recovery and of building the new you, and beginning to connect with people again.

Were there subjects at school that you found easier than others? Or not as unpleasant as others?
Do you have past times, even if it's gaming on the computer? There are gamers meet ups, and the people are likely to be accepting of people who are socially isolated.

Sending kind thoughts your way
@

 

[EveHarrington]

Awesome thread. :)

I've had to do much/most of my building on my own, outside of therapy.

It seems like a therapists idea of building oftentimes doesn't align with what is best for me.

 

[Klo]

I'm guessing that you are currently experiencing what gets called anhedonia

I looked it up and yeah, that sounds about right. Says it is often related to dopamine. That might make sense for me, since I smoke a lot (nicotine) and have also read that people with dopamine imbalances smoke at very high rates due to nicotine's effects on domanine (basically self-medicating urges lead to smoking).

 

[Anarchy]

Hi Klo,
Yeah, the main theory of addiction is the dopamine theory.

First thing first, nerdy stuff later.
If you are not on meds, I'd recommend that you stay away from them.

Did you check out the mindful way through depression? It will explain a lot of the stuff about anhedonia, and it's by some of the most respected guys studying depression.

They do suggest the possibility of SSRI anti depressants. Since the time of writing, there has been a big meta analysis of SSRI effectiveness ( studying published studies and combining the results into a single study). One of the flaws of meta analysis is, for a study to be published, it needs to show a positive result.

There is no journal of negative and ambiguous results

So, all of the tens of thousands of studies that fail to show anything, don't get published, and don't get included in meta analyses. Meta analysis therefore have an inbuilt but usually unstated and unacknowledged bias towards positive results.

Despite this inbuilt bias, the meta analysis of SSRI anti depressants, found that for ordinary depression ( not the sort that lands people in the back ward of a psychie hospital) SSRIs are statistically indistinguishable from the sugar pill placebo.

In terms of dangerous side effects ( trashed sexual function, increased suicidality and for young males, increased violence) SSRIs appear to be significantly different to the placebo - even though the trial participants are selected to avoid suicidal people and these effects are seldom reported.

So, I'd disagree with the suggestion in favour of meds made in "the mindful way through depression".

________________________________
Nerdy stuff

Everything that is addictive, temporarily boosts dopamine levels in one way or another, or excites dopamine receptors. LSD and psyllicybin ( magic mushrooms) bind to and excite dopamine receptors.

The downside to that is your body tries to restore balance, an drops dopamine levels. There's a bit of a time lag, so your dopamine levels get low, and you feel like shit - that's what a hangover or the desperation for a smoke is

You want to feel good again, and the cycle continues.

Low dopamine is Parkinson's disease. I don't think you'll have that, there are some very simple movement tests to get an idea if someone has Parkinson's. I'd be extremely surprised if you have it at your age.

The drop in dopamine levels associated with a hangover or going cold turkey can cause people to become Parkinson's like for a few hours or days - look at them shaking!

A lot of the psychiatric drugs act on the dopamine system.
People who have been on them a long time, or too high a dose can develop Parkinson's like shakes and fidgets ( tardive dyskinesia) which never goes away.

There was some beautiful science looking at dopamine and psychoses. It appears that the action of the drugs on the dopamine system is separate to their effect on psychoses.

Psychotic people, who are having an episode, but are not on drugs, do not have abnormal dopamine levels or receptors.
People on anti psychotics, do have increased dopamine receptors, but the number declines to normal when they come off the drugs. It seams that the body produces more receptors in response to the artificially lowered dopamine activity.

Accounts that I've read of academics taking small doses of neuroleptics, to see what it feels like, suggest that it feels bloody awful, and the effects are very debilitating.

 

[Klo]

If you are not on meds, I'd recommend that you stay away from them.

I've tried some in the past, but the side effects were just too many and too intense. I was put on Zyprexa for a little while, and it actually did work well as far as helping me sleep normally and also cleared out all my terrible intrusive thoughts, also helped with the paranoia/hypervigilance stuff.

However it also caused me to rapidly gain weight, I lost my ability to orgasm, and my memory and focus both became very, very poor. Then oddly enough I became extremely, cripplingly depressed. At which point the pdoc wanted me to add Prozac to the mix, and I just felt like, "No thanks," and stopped the meds altogether.

Before that a doctor gave me Xanax, but it just made me feel drunk and did not help that much, plus I know it's very addictive, so I just dropped it before it was too late.

Before that, I was on Effexor, and it made so looped I couldn't do anything at work. I mean TBH it was a lovely feeling, but I don't think it was making me "normal" lol. More like feeling incredibly high.

So Idunno, I don't bash meds since I know there are people who get great benefits from them, but for me they just took me for a whirl.