Deemed "untreatable."

[Abstract]

I just wanted to add one more thing at present. Some of your reactions to treatments are things many have had problems with too. EMDR is not for everyone and relaxation can need careful management to not release too much contained trauma. It's important not to throw out the baby with the bathwater though. Its about finding a way to work safely and learn what we need to.

 

[Animalliberator]

I asked about DBT but I haven't been answered and it entails a lot of homework so is sure not to appeal.

No, I have not tried DBT. I was told by my current talk therapist, the one therapist I've actually grown to trust, that it was unlikely to help me.

 

[Animalliberator]

Sure. It's an extremely simple mindfulness exercise that uses the senses to help someone genuinely experience their body and self in the present moment, thereby making it possible to establish a benchmark for differentiating between past and the present which then sets up a working schema for understanding the traumatic experience has ended and recognizing what it feels like when it returns.

Thanks, Lost Pup, for an explanation. Still sounds like mumbo-jumbo to me.

I snowboard, rock climb, do Insanity and P90X workouts daily, practice yoga three times a week, and participate in other sports. So, I think I'm pretty aware of my body. Despite all those activities, I still suffer from depression and anxiety. Again, I fail to see how feeling water on my body when I take a shower would make me any more aware of my body than I already am, given all the physical activities I'm involved in. And those activities have not made a dent in helping me heal.

 

[Animalliberator]

I'm sorry you are having a rough time. I have a couple of questions. Why do you keep going to therapy if nothing works? What are you getting out of it? How do you cope with PTSD now? And lastly, what are some of the other reasons for therapist firing you (besides the scary thoughts)

Why do I keep going to therapists when all has failed? One answer: hope. I still hold out hope that one day I will find a type of therapy that will help with learning to be intimate with others, to know peace and serenity, and to embrace life more fully.

How do I cope with PTSD now? I suck it up. Obviously, that hasn't worked out so well.

The reasons therapists have terminated my therapy: 1) several said that the thoughts I expressed during therapy "frightened" them (Mind you, I've NEVER been violent. Never. I witnessed terrible violence as a child so I know how damaging violence can be. So I keep everything in.); 2) they said my issues were outside their expertise and ability to treat me; 3) they had never encountered a case so complex or difficult; 4) the therapeutic techniques that proved effective on most of their other clients seemed to fail with me.

 

[anthony]

Depression and anxiety alone are a little different. With all the exercise you do, I'm a little curious that you still have depression considering the chemicals your body would create via exercise to naturally curb it. I wonder if you are simply one of the rare ones that have biological depression, which means no medication, exercise, or such, would work upon you, because the depression is biologically engrained within you. It is rare...

Anxiety... that can, and is, to some degree within genetics, though it can also be a learned behaviour to x circumstances. Even if genetic, it can be curbed for the most part to atleast allow you to function... and you sound as though you're functioning fine to me. I would be more curious as to who diagnosed you with PTSD and for what reason, and also what it is that gives you the most issue memory wise.

 

[Animalliberator]

Do you accept that treatment almost always makes us feel much worse and more symptomatic and for a long time? Abstract said: ↑ do you accept grounding as a concept? What grounding do you do?

Sorry, Abstract, I missed your questions. I answered the DBT question earlier.

Yes, I accept treatment can make one feel worse. But I would hope, over time, I would feel better. Unfortunately, I don't.

No, I do not accept grounding as a concept. Sounds like more woo-woo stuff to me. Again, I don't operate in that kind of airy-fairy world.

 

[Deleted member 1860]

I respectfully disagree. You don't know me. And you have no idea what your talking about when it comes to my issues.

I love it when I get the "you don't know me" response. Nobody knows anyone here. It's not a reason to dismiss someone and most often used when I've hit that nerve of truth!

People hold on to specific behaviors because there is a payoff or benefit of some sort. My point is that you are making yourself treatment resistant by rejecting everything----because in the end it keeps you safe. Changing is hard. It means we need to take a leap of faith and be open minded to trying new things. It means feeling UNsafe until we feel comfortable with the change.

And I believe I know a bit more about PTSD than you do, given that you don't even know what grounding is! Again, PTSD 101.

FACT: PTSD involves a higher level of dissociation than that experienced by the general public. The antidote to dissociation is grounding which involves sensory activities (feeling water in the shower, smelling our favorite foods, tasting sweet candy, etc) in order to fully bring our minds into the present. Rejecting the concept of grounding is probably holding you back. If you're so unsafe as to need repeated hospitalizations, that means you are not safe, a danger to yourself or others. Grounding can make you feel safe again.

I'm getting to the point where I am not believing your story because you're supposedly pro-active enough to seek out 50 different therapists and post on a forum yet you don't know what grounding is?!? Something doesn't jive here. Someone who has sought so much therapy I would imagine would have read up on PTSD, even just the basics. It's clear that you haven't and I honestly believe you truly are just going through the motions expecting to be healed without any work in your end, that is if all you say is true.

Here's my prediction. You're going to try prolonged exposure therapy and it will fail miserably. Not because of the therapy itself but because you will find some facet of it to reject before giving it a full chance.

 

[Animalliberator]

I just wanted to add one more thing at present. Some of your reactions to treatments are things many have had problems with too. EMDR is not for everyone and relaxation can need careful management to not release too much contained trauma. It's important not to throw out the baby with the bathwater though. Its about finding a way to work safely and learn what we need to.

First, Abstract, I want to thank you for commenting that I've kept my cool. I'm not upset or troubled by the posts on this thread. In fact, I find them quite helpful and insightful, even if I don't agree with some of them. I will take what was written on this thread and give it all serious thought.

I'm glad you wrote what you did about relaxation. Two weeks ago, after nearly three months of horrible insomnia (I've been averaging 1-4 hours of sleep a night, with some nights of no sleep. Years ago, I once went 12 days on only 2 hours of sleep. I have struggled with wretched insomnia for as long as I can remember), I tried, yet again, to do some body awareness and relaxation exercises. Given that I've experienced convulsions before during such exercises, I asked my wife to video me while I did some deep breathing and body check work. Soon my body began to twitch, then convulse. And moments later, I felt as if a small child's hands were crawling up from my stomach, through my chest, and then reaching out through my mouth. My mouth opened wide - I had no control over it - and out of it came the most hideous and awful moans, screams, and snarls. It was right out of the Exorcist! My wife captured it all on video. I later watched it with her and we both noted that the voices did not sound like me AT ALL. Pretty scary stuff. Not sure what to make of it. But both my talk therapist and SE therapist recommended I stay away from relaxation exercises.

 

[Deleted member 1860]

Oh snap.

Borderlines are rejected by many therapists as untreatable. It is because they are treatment resistant. (Being factual here, not slanderous.) As such, nothing argued or said here really applies. This is a PTSD forum and we are giving PTSD advice. This guy needs borderline advice and none of us are giving it.

We are NOT dealing with an untreatable case of PTSD. We are dealing with an untreatable BORDERLINE. As such we can try and hep for 100+++++ pages and we will be met with rejection.

Animal, you're doing yourself a huge disservice by blaming your issues on PTSD and saying your PTSD is untreatable. It's like using chemo to treat diabetes and getting pissed when it doesn't work.

 

[Animalliberator]

Depression and anxiety alone are a little different. With all the exercise you do, I'm a little curious that you still have depression considering the chemicals your body would create via exercise to naturally curb it. I wonder if you are simply one of the rare ones that have biological depression, which means no medication, exercise, or such, would work upon you, because the depression is biologically engrained within you. It is rare...

I exercise 6 days a week and have for years. Climbing is an activity that requires focus, mindfulness, and lots of body awareness. Same with snowboarding and yoga. Much more than standing in a shower feeling water running along one's body. So that is why I'm so skeptical of SE. I'm already very in tune with my body. Yet, none of those activities have lessened my depression.

I would be more curious as to who diagnosed you with PTSD and for what reason, and also what it is that gives you the most issue memory wise.

Many therapists diagnosed me with PTSD, BPD, and anxiety because of severe and prolonged physical, psychological, and emotional abuse I endured as a child. During my EMDR sessions, I experienced images of being raped when I was quite young. I have no idea if those images are grounded in reality. They certainly seemed real during EMDR sessions. But I have no proof I was molested.

I just wanted to add one more thing at present. Some of your reactions to treatments are things many have had problems with too. EMDR is not for everyone and relaxation can need careful management to not release too much contained trauma. It's important not to throw out the baby with the bathwater though. Its about finding a way to work safely and learn what we need to.

First, Abstract, I want to thank you for commenting that I've kept my cool. I'm not upset or troubled by the posts on this thread. In fact, I find them quite helpful and insightful, even if I don't agree with some of them. I will take what was written on this thread and give it all serious thought.

I'm glad you wrote what you did about relaxation. Two weeks ago, after nearly three months of horrible insomnia (I've been averaging 1-4 hours of sleep a night, with some nights of no sleep. Years ago, I once went 12 days on only 2 hours of sleep. I have struggled with wretched insomnia for as long as I can remember), I tried, yet again, to do some body awareness and relaxation exercises. Given that I've experienced convulsions before during such exercises, I asked my wife to video me while I did some deep breathing and body check work. Soon my body began to twitch, then convulse. And moments later, I felt as if a small child's hands were crawling up from my stomach, through my chest, and then reaching out through my mouth. My mouth opened wide - I had no control over it - and out of it came the most hideous and awful moans, screams, and snarls. It was right out of the Exorcist! My wife captured it all on video. I later watched it with her and we both noted that the voices did not sound like me AT ALL. Pretty scary stuff. Not sure what to make of it. But both my talk therapist and SE therapist recommended I stay away from relaxation exercises.

 

[Animalliberator]

People hold on to specific behaviors because there is a payoff or benefit of some sort. My point is that you are making yourself treatment resistant by rejecting everything----because in the end it keeps you safe. Changing is hard. It means we need to take a leap of faith and be open minded to trying new things. It means feeling UNsafe until we feel comfortable with the change.

With all due respect, Solara, you are once again incorrect. And again, you don't know me. Please stop trying to analyze someone you don't know.

 

[Deleted member 1860]

No, I have not tried DBT. I was told by my current talk therapist, the one therapist I've actually grown to trust, that it was unlikely to help me.

This therapist is an idiot as is any therapist who knows you are borderline. DBT is the go-to treatment for borderlines. Get yourself into DBT therapy and maybe your PTSD will be treatable in the future. But be prepared----it's generally a 6-12 month commitment, 2x a week. Very intense as borderline is so hard to treat.